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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Young man engaged to girl diagnosed with schizophrenia

45 replies

LizFlowers · 31/01/2021 22:25

I realise this is not my business but it concerns someone very closely related to me.

A chap in his thirties has known a young woman, an American, for about four years. Lovely girl in her thirties! She was widowed a few years ago and has a young child. They became engaged some eighteen months ago and were planning to marry last year but then the pandemic happened. She cannot come here, which was the plan, and he cannot go to see her.

She lives in a fairly rural, mountainous area, very beautiful with lakes, etc, and has rarely ventured far from there. The inhabitants of her town live very close to nature. Not much happens there and there aren't many prospects.

He usually works for several months a year in America and Canada and met her when he was working in her home town. There was an instant attraction, they became close and started a relationship during which time she has travelled all over the States with him for holidays (New York, Florida, Texas, Disney etc), he has spent holidays at her home and she has been here in London, which she likes.

Last year she had several episodes of shrieking at him, accusing him of all sorts of things (which he hasn't done and deep down she knows he hasn't), insulting and blocking him everywhere. He put that down to the tension caused by lockdown, etc, and the fact that they cannot see each other. He's working from home, she is not doing very much. She also told him that she heard people telling her things when she was on her own, at night etc. It was very difficult. A good well meaning friend of his who knows her intervened, telling her how wrong she was, misjudging her guy, etc, but that didn't go down well and friend was blocked.

Now it transpires she has been diagnosed as schizophrenic and is on medication. Apparently she has always heard voices but her family, who live near her, used to say she was in touch with the spirit world and it was natural!

I have every sympathy for this young woman but am terrified of him marrying someone who is so mentally unstable; who knows how she would be living here without her parents, siblings and extended family nearby. It's one thing to like visiting a place and spending time with a person you love, living together is a different kettle of fish. I don't know what she would do work-wise, they did have some ideas about that, ie her working in a jointly owned business. They also talked about having a child.

When I spoke to him yesterday he said, when he is free to travel, he will go to her and wants her to have a second medical opinion on her mental health (which he would finance) - preferably here because he doesn't have much faith in the medics where she lives. Then he'll see how it goes.

He is very work focussed and wants to have a secure base. He is a nice and popular person, clever and interesting.

I honestly don't know what to say, if anything. He is old enough to make up his own mind and take his chances, so is she, but I also feel I may not be doing him any favours by saying nothing. He has to protect himself.

It's frightening, frankly.

Sorry this has been long. I wanted to share and wonder if anyone has experience of similar,

Thank you for reading.

OP posts:
Moondust001 · 31/01/2021 22:35

Why is it frightening? And why is it frightening you?

If his girlfriend has a mental illness, it sounds like he has a plan and wants to support her to manage her illness. Would you have the same fear if she had a physical disability?

He sounds like a caring and responsible person who has found someone he very much loves. He is working to make that relationship happen. It may or may not work out, but that is true for everyone entering into a relationship. Don't interfere. It is none of your business.

Abd what exactly do you thin k he has to protect himself from?

LizFlowers · 31/01/2021 22:39

I don't know, Moondust. Maybe it comes from me having worked for the NHS for years and witnessing many things.

If you think I have nothing about which to feel uneasy, I take that on board.

I'm just asking for opinions and, hopefully, reassurance.

Thank you for replying so quickly.

OP posts:
PandaVie · 31/01/2021 22:48

Last year she had several episodes of shrieking at him, accusing him of all sorts of things (which he hasn't done and deep down she knows he hasn't), insulting and blocking him everywhere

I would be concerned OP. It’s natural for a friend to be concerned about the above behaviour. What can you realistically do or say though? Presumably he has some idea of the risks involved.

PandaVie · 31/01/2021 22:49

But I think it’s ok, and what all friends should do - voice their reservations or concerns - once. But once only.

PandaVie · 31/01/2021 22:50

to voice

LizFlowers · 31/01/2021 22:56

Thanks for all your comments. I honestly don't want to interfere but I think it is natural to be concerned.

PandaVie Sun 31-Jan-21 22:49:54
But I think it’s ok, and what all friends should do - voice their reservations or concerns - once. But once only.
.......
I'll think about that Panda. At the moment we'll just see how it goes.

OP posts:
Moondust001 · 31/01/2021 22:57

Schizophrenia has a "bad press". Managed the majority of people live rather "normal" and ordinary lives. That said, people develop mental and physical illnesses after marriage / having children - he knows and she knows what they face, and so in many ways they are at an advantage over those who haven't yet developed any illness.

There's no such thing as a safe bet in any relationship, but adversity can make a relationship stronger, not just weaker. I would look for ways to support him in making the right decisions - but in my experience nobody ever listens to what they don't want to hear, so in a sense it doesn't matter whether you are right to have concerns, because unless he shares them he won't hear you.

WoodpileHouse · 31/01/2021 22:59

People with schizophrenia who are treated can live very happily and make wonderful wives and mothers.

LizFlowers · 31/01/2021 23:01

@WoodpileHouse

People with schizophrenia who are treated can live very happily and make wonderful wives and mothers.
That is true and is what I am hoping. All I want is for them to be happy.
OP posts:
AccidentallyOnPurpose · 31/01/2021 23:07

The thing is it could go very well or seriously wrong. No one knows.

Since you have a background in MH is there any advice you can give about what safeguards he can put in place so everything goes as smoothly and correctly as possible? Approach it as wanting to help and ensuring she's safe and well rather than concern for their relationship. If there's anything he can do to ameliorate things, then that should be put in place and then it just comes down to luck.

AccidentallyOnPurpose · 31/01/2021 23:11

Also, how well do you know him?

Is he someone that could actually support,help and cope with her mental illness or would he just hinder or exacerbate it?

Is he fully aware and realistic about what it entails and what he'll need to do?

Is he fully committed to help her settle in ,get her medical care here etc?

If not, then I'd worry about her more than him.

LizFlowers · 31/01/2021 23:14

AccidentallyOnPurpose Sun 31-Jan-21 23:07:00
The thing is it could go very well or seriously wrong. No one knows.
.....
That's true, same with any relationship really. Nothing is perfect.

He is doubtful about her diagnosis which is why he wants a second opinion. He also doesn't like the amount of drugs she is prescribed which make her zombie-like, he says that is typically American. However he isn't with her at the moment. She is extremely paranoid but maybe you would feel insecure if your loved one was over the other side of the world. I've never been in that position. When they get together again it will obviously be clearer.

There isn't anything I can do anyway, best if I try to think of other things unless I cannot avoid it.

OP posts:
AccidentallyOnPurpose · 31/01/2021 23:24

He also doesn't like the amount of drugs she is prescribed which make her zombie-like, he says that is typically American.

That's a red flag for me. Fair enough to seek a second opinion,there or here , but to function normally she will need medication regardless if he likes it or not or how he feels they make her.

He doubts her diagnosis and her treatment. I assume he has no MH background? That's not good.

It seems to me he's burying his head in the sand a bit and hoping it's just a Big Pharma/American thing,rather than the reality he'll possibly have to live with.

What happens when she comes here and the diagnosis is still there, possibly the same meds and side effects?

You seem awfully worried about him, but stop and think for a second what effect his mind set might have on her and her chances of living a normal life.

adultingforever · 31/01/2021 23:30

I know someone who has schizophrenia. I asked him whether or not marrying would be a reasonable thing for a situation like you describe. His response was "No way. Every relationship I have had has ended because of bad things I did." I would listen to him.

EarthSight · 31/01/2021 23:40

I have to say, the concern is understandable, but I found your post rather odd.

What is your relationship to this man? Mother, father, aunt, friend? He's in his mid-30s and I assume you are much older? You say he's very closely related to you, but then you call him 'a chap'. Not 'my relative', but 'a chap'. Just makes you sound like an anxious neighbour, not a relative.

Xoxoxoxoxoxox · 31/01/2021 23:48

My great aunt has schizophrenia and sadly her children were taken into care, and later it transpired that one of the children was also schizophrenic. It may have consequences for him and he does sound like he has a little bit of a savior complex, the way he's decided that her treatment is wrong without knowing the full situation.

LizFlowers · 01/02/2021 00:05

You seem awfully worried about him, but stop and think for a second what effect his mind set might have on her and her chances of living a normal life.

I think about both of them and of her child who is 8 I think, and delightful.

I hope he knows when to back off if she definitely does have schizophrenia, and leave it to the doctors. You have to remember she only received the diagnosis last year and they haven't been together since January 2020.

He's a very laid back sort of person in many ways though can be over focussed on work ideas and abstract theories - but he certainly loves her.

I'm sorry if I am vague in some ways. I don't want to 'out' either of them. I'm pretty sure neither would be posting on Mumsnet but friends might and recognise them from what I say, or him at any rate. All his friends are very caring people most of the time but at the end of the day, it's not their lives we are talking about.

Very sad about your great aunt, Xoxoxo, and her children - but treatment has surely improved since her time.

Thanks for all comments.

OP posts:
MuckyPlucky · 01/02/2021 00:11

OP- you say you worked for the NHS for many years so have ‘witnessed many things’. This makes very little sense on its own. The NHS is the UK’s biggest employer. Working for the NHS does not in itself make you a specialist in MH nor render you as having ‘witnessed’ anything more insightful than the rest of the general population.

I too have worked for the NHS... as a clinically-trained MH professional. I have witnessed things directly relevant to your situation. I have a lot of clinical and personal experience working with people with schizophrenia, as well as having a long-term severe MH condition myself.

You are well-intentioned but come across as not very enlightened or experienced about these vague ‘’many things’ you claim to have witnessed.

Maybe read-up on SMI, and on bigotry and on the double-standards between how MH and physical health conditions are perceived/portrayed.

HTH.

GrumpyHoonMain · 01/02/2021 00:16

If she isn’t treating her condition then yes I would be worried too. I had a family member with untreated schizophrenia and it was terrible to live with her - we never knew when she’d blow up. Several members of my family have it actually in my mum’s family and there seems to be a genetic component so I would be worried about passing it on.

But none of this is your business really. You can give the info to your friend and direct him to resources but I suggest you keep well out of it.

MrsTerryPratchett · 01/02/2021 00:21

Immigration is extremely hard. Add to that medical coverage and it's difficult with any medical condition. I would be making very sure that she was able to be covered moving countries because being left without care would be awful.

Apart from that, he's a grown up.

LizFlowers · 01/02/2021 00:40

Her condition is being treated.

Mrs TerryPratchett, I hadn't even thought about immigration problems. I just assumed she would come here and they'd marry or he'd go there and marry but their intention is to settle here. If we hadn't had the pandemic they would be here now.

He is certainly a grown up and quite a mature, sensible one so I'm sure all will be well in the end. There's nothing I can do anyway except be a listening ear.

OP posts:
LizFlowers · 01/02/2021 00:44

MuckyPlucky:

Maybe read-up on SMI, and on bigotry and on the double-standards between how MH and physical health conditions are perceived/portrayed.
.......
Oh I know about that all right. The mental health services really are the 'poor relation' of the NHS.

I don't want to be vague but also don't want to out myself, him or her. Though it concerns me, it is their private business.

OP posts:
CharlotteRose90 · 01/02/2021 02:42

It’s normal to worry but unfortunately this is your friends relationship not yours. Schizophrenia can be managed and treated correctly with the right medication. She needs another check up for sure. My auntie had it and never had an attack for years on medication. The mental health stigma is definitely around and needs stopping. Regarding immigration if he plans to support her and marry her she’ll get a visa for here. Not sure about the states though. Good luck to them I say people deserve love

Shaniac · 01/02/2021 05:27

I agree op i would be very worried. No one is saying people with schizophrenia are bad people or murders. 2 of my cousin's are schizophrenic and it can be downright terrifying when they refuse to take their medication and do dangerous things. One of my cousins has spent a lot of time sectioned because of it.

Whats worrying is bringing someone recently diagnosed feom America to the uk with a child and no familiar family and friends support for her. Bad news.

RantyAnty · 01/02/2021 07:02

You're his mum aren't you.

If he really wants to marry her and have a life with her, why doesn't he simply move there?

Hes far more wordly and would have a much easier time adapting there than expecting her and her child to move to him with no family or friends.

What else besides a couple of melt downs make her schizophrenic?