He is staying for the kids

[Sendhelpplease]

I’ve been with my partner for 9 years have children together. We had a good relationship until a couple of years ago and shared a strong connection, everything was easy and we seemed set to spend our days together. Got engaged, i didn’t feel there was any hurry because we had our whole lives together and the children were young so make the most of it instead of the financial burden of a wedding as well. After a difficult couple of years we are failing miserably. I want nothing more than my relationship and family to work, I don’t understand why it can’t work. He claims to still love me but won’t put any time or effort in to our relationship or even the children (without me). I asked him last night if he still want to be in a relationship with me, he said he doesn’t know. I think this is worse than just saying no he doesn’t!

So my question is what is going on here? He claims to love me and wants the family to stay together and to work but refuses to give any of us any effort or time. He then followed up by saying something about just staying for the children to which I said I wouldn’t accept that. He feels we have no future. A couple of days ago he spoke of us getting married one day. He seems to say completely opposite things every couple of days.

Anybody been here? Any advice? Anyone made it through something like this?

If he is not willing to put in the time or effort for family, you may be better apart for now.
It will give him the chance to see what he is missing, and force him to parent when he has the DC.
You can then decide if you want to nurture the relationship and build it back, or if it has run its course.
Good luck

If we were to be apart would he ever really know what he is missing if we still live together? It isn’t an option for either of us to move out.

Forget what he wants - he's flip-flopping like a stranded fish. Who knows what's going on with him?!

Instead, think hard about what you want. I mean what you want from him. What would satisfy you and make you want to go on having him around? See if you can put it into words and write a list for him, as in, these are the things I need from you to make this work for all of us. Keep a copy for yourself. Make sure there's nothing on there that you aren't already bringing or are willing to bring to the party!

Give him a week to think about it, then sit down with him and talk it through. Is he signed up or not? It's on your terms, because you only have one life and you don't have to stick around waiting pathetically for the scraps soneone's willing to drop for you.

If there's something on your list he balks at, ask him to explain why he thinks you don't deserve that thing.

If you're stuck for ideas, look at the words of the wedding service, or think about a good marriage you know and what that couple bring to each other.

@NewlyGranny have done this sort of thing, I want him to be involved in our relationship and family life. It’s pretty basic and realistic what I want and expect from him. I can’t understand it all, I’m at a complete loss.

It's very simple - step up or step out. If he doesn't want to contribute to family life, he needs to leave.

Sadly he's checked out if the relationship and if he can't be bothered with the kids now.... what will he be like if you split up.

Sounds like he wants you there to raise the children, but he's not on love with you anymore. I'm sorry you're in this situation.

If he's not all in...then something needs to be done to separate, because it will eat you up and affect your mental wellbeing.

He's not staying for the kids.

He's staying for the convenience of you doing the parenting, probably most of the housework and the status of marriage, without having to lift a finger. he's staying for the ego boost of being able to have you on a string.

If he was staying for the kids, he'd be active in family life, but no, he's a lazy fucker with the kids as well as a partner.

Is he bollocks staying for anyone's sake but his own.

Well, he clearly isn’t staying for the kids if he doesn’t look after them now. He’s looking for an easy way out and is trying to make you force his hand. Pathetic.

Get out of his head.
You'll never work him out
And get into your own head.
Whatever his thoughts, motives, it isn't working for you and he isn't making you happy. This is all that matters.
It's taken me over 4 years to realise that. You can not make anyone be the way you want them to be. It just doesn't work that way.
Mine lives in "I don't know" land. I've given up and made the decision for him.
We're splitting up.

As someone else just said he isn't staying for the kids as he leaves that to you. Would counselling help? Don't panic he will leave and do the pick me dance. But also by saying he is there for the kids, he is saying he is not having a relationship with you and will likely be off finding someone to fill the spot. And will then be saying its not really cheating as you wasn't really having a relationship

On the face of it it sounds like he is staying out of apathy and laziness.

If you think there is a relationship that can be rekindled I would insist you get some marriage counselling as you’ve tried talking to him and he’s flopping around like a fish as someone says up post.

Before you do I’d decide what you’d expect to see from him to make the relationship work (and hopefully he’ll say what he wants from you as part of counselling). But - I also think you need to think about how you would separate your lives if he really has no interested, I’d also get some legal advice on this now.

I think you are quite right to want to try everything to make this work, but equally you don’t want to spend the next decade as nanny and housekeeper.

@SandyY2K if somebody is checked out then does that ever change or is I just the end of the road? I think I could understand it more if he was saying he didn’t love me anymore but he’s not saying that. I feel he doesn’t though!! I’m furious with him.

@category12 he does seem really selfish right now and all out for himself. Do I leave even if it’s not what I want?

Thanks for all the responses to my post.

@Saving sorry you have been going through something similar. Did you end up telling him where to go in the end? Have you children together? I don’t know what to do, it isn’t good for me if we split right now and not what I want.

He is refusing counselling together or alone. He doesn’t think he needs it. I have pointed out it isn’t just how he is to me because he isn’t putting time in to the children either.

he does seem really selfish right now and all out for himself. Do I leave even if it’s not what I want?
Presumably you don't want a relationship where he is completely disengaged? And you don't want your children to grow up thinking this is normal?

He wants to give you the absolute crumbs and it will destroy your self-worth to stick around for that.

Your best hope of getting him to re-engage is to do the 180 and kick him out/end it, make him really feel what he is losing. And only accept him back if he can sustain a genuine change in behaviour and proves it.

Doing the pick-me dance and accepting his crumbs will make him despise you even more than he appears to already. Don't do it.

You might find that once you've made the jump you won't even want him back. But accept nothing less than a full loving equal relationship. You deserve better than he's offering.

@Saving I see you said you made the decision for him. How was he with that decision?

@category12 That’s interesting you said that about despising me because I often feel that at times and I’ve no idea why or what it is I’ve done!!!

You haven't done anything! It's all him.

I suspect he's following the midlife crisis script. www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/1527705-Midlife-crisis-this-is-the-script

Hi Op,
You ask, "Do I leave even if it’s not what I want?"
Well, in this situation you can't have what you want, which is for him to love you and be involved in family life. That is not happening now and I don't think it will ever happen.
So what is the second-best thing you want?

Is there a possibility he's having an affair? Just similar experience here

There are a lot of things similar to this script the past couple of years. He is currently clinging to the edge if the bed right now.

The second best option is I get myself in a position to financially support myself and children alone. I do everything for the children so I would not miss out on the help.

No I don’t think he is ha I feel an affair

@sendhelpplease yes we have 2 young DCs. I've been in counselling myself for 4 years now, talking through all our issues etc. We went together a few times to an RL counsellor, but there was a lot of work for us to do as a couple at home. I would do the work and DH wouldn't. He would then show up at counselling behaving much differently than he had behaved all week. The counsellor evidently began to feel sorry for him aa each time he revealed hiw he felt he got this huge par on the back, even when he revealed that he didn't think I deserved much disposable income because I was "only working PT." Despite me doing everything for the DCs.

The counsellor wanted me to feel relieved that DH was finally sharing feelings but the opposite happened- I was extremely hurt by the things he revealed.

So RL counselling didn't work for us. I'd approach RL counselling with caution tbh, it is pointless if DH shows up differently than he does in real life.

So I had more solo counselling and worked through what I was needing in life. It has taken me years to get to the point of realising that I have to end things. I have been preparing for this for 2 years now, you can't leave straight away in cases where there are young DCs involved and you don't work or work PT.

I have a plan now. My ball starts rolling around March time. I told him very honestly in September my plans. He asked for 1 month to make improvements, which I gave him. The first 2 weeks were actually much better and I thought he might be changing for the better. But he proved in the final 2 weeks that he can't keep this up consistently.
I told him honestly that I was disappointed by his efforts. He is plodding on now as normal and I remind him daily of my plans to leave him even on pleasanter days.

SandyY2K if somebody is checked out then does that ever change or is I just the end of the road?

It depends on why he's checked out, but usually they won't check back in.

I think I could understand it more if he was saying he didn’t love me anymore but he’s not saying that

The thing is he won't say he doesn't love you as that could prompt you to end things, which isn't what he wants.
He may also fear you living with another man who gets to see his children more than he does and if course there's also jealousy at play.

The current set up works fine for him as he doesn’t have to do much in regards to family life.

@Saving well done for having a plan and leaving what you now know isn’t good for you. Are you sad about it? Do you wish you’d left years ago? Sounds like you’ve had a terrible time with it all.

@SandyY2K it all seems pretty grim. This seems to be happening whether I want it to or not.

@sendhelpplease no I don't wish Ieft years ago. Contrary to MN advice, I'm glad I stayed for my young DCs and continued being very much around for them. I know that when they're at school, things will change dramatically and I will return to FT work in order to become independent financially.

Some days I feel sad that DH hasn't been able to prioritise family over himself and that it's come to this. Other days, I feel excited for the future.

The toughest part is where you're at now and wanting him to change. It is exhausting and actually made me physically ill. Do take care of yourself and speak to a trusted friend or family member about how you're feeling. I'd really recommend counselling too. I even used to take my newborn with me to appointments at one stage. It's so important to keep talking.

You don't have to do anything about this right now, but do watch and observe him. Take a step back,look at your life. Look at the path he has chosen. Is this what you want long term?

Yes, you are not in control of this, OP, and it's tough. It takes two to make a working relationship, especially with children. You can't make him step up.

Here's one too: love isn't words, it's actions. Don't ask him whether he loves you: observe his behaviour. Make notes for yourself if you need to. When he's around you, what is he doing to show love and commitment, or the opposite? Don't wonder and wait for him to say it when he's showing you clearly every day.

Especially when what he actually says varies so wildly day to day. His words are meaningless but his actions are meaningful.

Just ask yourself, is this what live does? Is this what a loving partner does? How is this action showing love for me? Is this how a loving father behaves around his previous children?

Let him show you and believe what he shows you.