In laws - go no contact?

[MandB23]

I really really need some other perspectives and would appreciate anyone who could offer their’s.
It’s a long story.
I’ve been with my DH for 12 years. Early on it was quite clear the in laws didn’t like me very much as they felt like I’d ‘taken him away’ and we would spend more time with my family than his. We were 18/19 when we got together.
We had a bit of a fall out about 5 years in which started because they wanted me to go round on my birthday to get presents and me and my DH had planned to go for tea together. So we said we could come over afterwards. He didn’t live there at this point. They rang us throughout the evening to ask when we would be there which was a bit annoying when they knew our plans. We did get there at about 9 and I got annoyed because his brother and his gf were whispering whilst we all sat in the front room.
I said “if you want to whisper, why don’t you just go to another room”. They sniggered, looked very uncomfortable and then didn’t really say anything. They carried on with the whispering and I said to my MIL “I’m really sorry but it’s making me Uncomfortable and I’m going to go.” This caused a big argument where they told me I was ungrateful and rude and I’d been ‘dragged up’. I found that quote offensive. I was equally as offensive and said to my FIL that he’s a control freak and I won’t have him speak to me the way he does everybody else in the house.
This was the catalyst for a years worth of drama which led them to basically disown my DH. He worked for them at the time and they sacked him at work and told him to leave his company car. So he left work that day with nothing. They wanted him to choose and he wouldn’t choose them so that was that.
It went on a few years. They were quite unkind during this time with Facebook posts and I can honestly say I never wrote one towards them.
We made up because we had a baby and I basically turned up at their door when she was about 3 months old saying “are you really not going to sort this out?” And we did. We moved on. I thought. A few years of this and it’s been fine. Actually we were quite close at one point and they were there for me when our daughter was still born.
It started to change middle of last year and I think it was because I wanted to invite the FIL’s sister to my DH’s surprise birthday meal. They told me I shouldn’t but I said that I wanted to. There was one conversation about it but I didn’t change my mind. His dad then said well he wouldn’t come. I thought he was just saying this but he actually didn’t come and on the night my MIL made a fuss and we had to move people around so that she wasn’t sat near the auntie. I didn’t think much of this at the time but come September when my baby was born I noticed they weren’t really bothering with us and then looked back and realised that all of summer they hadn’t seen my eldest and had made excuses when usually they see her a lot and she adores them.
I then noticed FIL had deleted me and my DH off Facebook and just generally they had distanced themselves. They live a few minutes away but come December last year had only been round once to see us. Our youngest was in NICU for 3 weeks and when there they didn’t really bother either and we had to rely on friends a lot to help with our eldest.
I said something around Christmas time and it turned into an argument and then basically telling me to stop causing arguments and that I was making them upset.
They then sacked my husband again and didn’t pay him for the last week or his Christmas bonus.
It was awful. They said some awful stuff.
I said that I felt really hurt because I was so close to them after the still birth and I had his dad near me hours after giving birth and I felt comfortable around them when obviously they have never really liked me and I felt hurt by that. That it was all false.
They said that I’m always using my “dead baby” to get sympathy and lots of other horrible things.
Anyway I’ve continued to try and facilitate W relationship between them and the kids. My DH doesn’t want to know and won’t get involved. He’s obviously hurt by their actions and can’t manage that but it then puts pressure on me.
I have put effort into gifts for them this Christmas and they bought for the kids. The MIL has started to come and visit for a few minutes, just dropping stuff at the door. Since about Easter. I try to make her feel welcome and I want my kids to remain unaware of the situation. Covid has helped with that as that’s an excuse.
But, I’m feeling upset. Probably more than necessary. They bought my youngest a soft doll and she was really excited by it. I did a video of her kissing it and laughing and jumping around with it. She’s only 1 and I’ve never seen her his excited so I sent a message to say look how much she loves this - thank you so much, hope you’re all having a lovely day. Merry Christmas. She replied with Merry Christmas, thanks for the presents.
It just felt really cold. I was upset that she didn’t acknowledge the video and I realised it’s my own fault for giving too much and I need to take a step back and stop trying yo make it all ‘normal’ again.
But I’m really uncomfortable with her coming to my house and being normal to my face when she makes it clear in her messages that she still holds bad feelings.
Am I right to consider no contact?
My eldest loves her. But the rest of the family don’t bother and it makes things really awkward. They don’t come round or even ring on birthdays. And they also don’t really bother at all with my youngest. MIL brings things round for my eldest and just doesn’t really even speak to my youngest. It’s just really awkward and I hate the situation.
I think I’m feeling hurt that I’ve made the effort again and I realise I need to accept that it won’t ever be ‘normal’ between us.
But should I continue to facilitate contact which at the minute can only really be the MIL coming here and standing in the doorway for a few minutes. She has started to come in and sit
Down for 5 minutes.

Why are you trying so hard to be liked by such despicable people? It hints of desperation

@EKGEMS God knows. I’m no angel and I know I could have handled myself better at times. I couldn’t ever treat anybody the way they’ve treated their son though.
I suppose I’m hopeful that things could be ‘normal’ again one day. But I suppose that doesn’t exist because clearly the whole time I thought we got on well, they didn’t really like me and it was all just pretty fake.
Yeah, you’re right. As harsh as your delivery seemed. I guess I am desperate to be liked by them. But I never have been and I need to accept that.
I still don’t know what the right thing is though. I guess I take a step back and stay out of it completely but my husband won’t manage the situation himself and I feel for my daughter. Their house was like a second home to her for a he first 5 years of her life. I really feel like something is being taken away from her and I don’t want to be the person to do that.

They’ve sacked their son twice because of petty disagreements?? They’re control freaks and you’re well rid of them.

You all sound as bad as each other. You told his brother off for whispering in his own home 🙄. Your mil thanked you for the video but you wanted more? You're never going to have a jokey friendly relationship with them. They tolerate you but they don't like you and you don't like them either.

I think it is time to accept you can’t change things and move on.
Let DH dictate the relationship. DC will accept whatever you tell them.
In time DC2 will realise they are being treated differently to DC1 and this is not fair.

Your second child cannot be overlooked like this. It's not going to work in the long term. If that remains the way it is now, your eldest would have to lose this from her life anyway. It would be too damaging for the other child.

One of the few areas that I think that me and DH have got right in our marriage is that we are each in charge of our own relationships with our parents. We are pleasant to each other’s parents - we have a nice conversation with them when we see them but the decision as to how often we see them and for how long and where and when is the decision of the child not the decision of the in-law.

Your husband knows what relationship he wants with his parents - very little as they have (your words) treated him horribly - so let that happen. Slowly withdraw your eldest from MIL, protect your youngest from being “the unloved one” and get on with your lives.

You are the main problem here .

You are prioritising your own relationship with them .

Listen to your husband ... he wants no contact ... you should be following his lead.

You are causing damage to your husband and children by continually drawing them back into the drama .

Another one who'd like to hear the other side of it. You sound really hard work and dramatic, to be honest.

For what it's worth, I'm NC with my sister (for extremely good and very personal reasons) and would not want my DIL deciding she's inviting her to a party with me there. I would ask her not to. And I would then decline to go. Your FIL was clear about it. You didn't think much of this - but it clearly upset them greatly that you pushed ahead with this and they avoided you all summer. Why did you do this when they'd asked you not to?

Much of this seems to be them drawing away from you and distancing themselves. The arguments from what I've read are you saying things, and starting it. It feels like they are trying to be polite but are tired of the dramatics. Whatever they answer you seem to take issue with, but it's fairly clear they find you hard work and pushy.

Fuck that shit;they are vile;who sacks their own son leaving him and their own grandchildren with no income?

And the "using your dead baby" comment is unforgivable.

Can you DH find a job elsewhere?;I'd distant yourselves;drop birthday/Christmas presents on the doorstep,text them on the dad to say Happy birthday/merry Christmas and maybe a once a month WhatsApp message with a few photos of what they've been up to and how they are doing but don't let include stuff about yourselves.

They are batshit crazy and will continue to dominate your lives until they are pissing themselves and unable to remember their own names.

If your DH wants to go no contact, follow his lead. He knows them a hell of a lot better than you.

Plus you cant let them play favourites to the detriment of your younger child. Thats not fair.

I would move like your DH wants to do,leave them all to it.

Your husband wants nothing to do with them, yet you're still pushing for a relationship.

They told you not to invite the aunt, yet you still went ahead. However nice she is you don't know the reasons why they don't get on and you were letting your FIL know that he's not a priority.

They ignore your youngest, yet you want them to continue their relationship with the eldest. Well that's going to be absolutely shitty for your littlest when she's old enough to realise. Especially if she knows you tried to encourage a relationship with them.
Your insistence to go against everyone else's wishes is weird. I don't understand your agenda or motives but it seems to be all about what you want, regardless of anyone else's feelings

I agree with pps, you're all as bad as each other. You don't tell someone off for whispering in that context, you might think it but you don't say. You certainly do not go against the wishes of your fil to not invite his sister to a party, especially given you don't even know why he didn't want her there. My dm has a very fractious relationship with her siblings and it would upset her very much to be forced into a situation where she had to act like everything was ok in front of them. That was seriously odd of you and your card was marked from that point.

Them sacking your dh is totally out of order but you all seem to like the drama of it.

I do understand wanting to make the effort for your dcs to have a relationship with them but you either do it without any expectations or just don't do it, it's not for you to facilitate. It's for your dh. Remember you don't have to like your pils, they are just people, ideally you'd make an effort to not let any dislike show but this has gone far beyond that point!

You need to grow up and stop being a drama queen. Your dh wants nothing to do with his family so back him up ffs. You’re behaving pretty nasty to your dh. Where’s the loyalty? Why did you want to push for normal with his family after the horrible things they have done? You allow them to treat your kids differently too. Be a better wife and parent.

The aunt thing - they didn’t really make it clear how unhappy they were to me.
We had one conversation where it was the MIL who said something like “don’t invite her, we never see her and my friends are more family than she is”. Thats to her - her friends are not close to us. I explained that she would be upset when everyone starts posting on Facebook about it and how would we explain that she wasn’t invited. We do see her on special occasions and she makes the effort. She then went down the route of saying well it upsets her that the auntie doesn’t bother with the FIL as she herself would love to have a brother and she doesn’t understand it. That was kind of it.
The thing is - to faces - they are pleasant to each other. They speak occasionally and as far as I know they pretend and put on a show but just slag her off at home. That’s how they are. Fake.
The FIL didn’t say to me he wouldn’t come but I heard that through my own brother who used to work for the company.
I just thought surely not!!!
There’s a lack of communication and they didn’t say to me that they would be upset. It seemed more like they were just being awkward.
The whispering thing is old news. To me anyway.
I don’t understand holding onto grudges. Especially with family. I was just trying to explain that this big fall out has happened before.
They will royally kick off if we stopped contact. I’m trying to have an easier life. I’m not trying to add drama. It’s all well and good that my DH doesn’t want anything to do with them but he’s as bad at having a conversation as them and has instead just chose to ignore them rather than actually telling them what he thinks.
I just think they should be polite at least. I don’t think it’s fair that I’m doing my best to help encourage the relationship with my kids and they are rude to me a lot of the time. It was over a year ago and they are clearly stil
Holding on to anger. Fine, do that. But if they expect me to make all the effort and arrange everything it seems pretty unfair.
I feel a bit stuck because the drama from stopping contact would be huge. So my only
Option is to just move away but I’m not sure I actually want to. Not for them, but for my own family.

Why will they kick off if you go NC?

And sowhat if they do? Your DH is prepared to move away in order to get away from them, why are you disregarding his wishes and persisting with this.

And why don't you care that your youngest DC is ignored? That would be an absolute deal breaker for me!

Why does EVERYTHING have to be a big statement with you... 'going nc' (fucking annoying term not even grammatically correct !)

Why can't you just STOP ...
Stop trying to form a relationship that your own DH doesn't want.
STOP trying to form a relationship with people who don't particularly want one with you . (Or certainly not to the degree you want one) .

Just live your life . With your DH and your kids. Leave MIL to have the relationship she wants . Which sounds already fairly low contact.

Stop framing your life like it's some kind of continual FB status update. In fact get off FB , there is literally NOTHING positive about it. You will feel better.

tricky

To be fair your post reads like something from a melodrama. Oh the irony.

Sorry but you sound rude and unpleasant. Why cause an argument and verbally attack your FIL on your birthday? That's crazy. And why invite his sister when he told you he didn't want her there and wouldn't be coming if she was there? Also crazy. You're relying on them for your DH's income and got him sacked. You're in the wrong and need to keep your drama to yourself.

@XelaM I suppose it depends on your idea of rude.
I personally think it’s rude to sit in a room with visitors and whisper. I wouldn’t do that. They think it’s ok.
I don’t think it’s rude to say “I’m going to leave because that’s bothering me” in a calm way. I don’t think I’m obliged to stay in an environment that’s making me feel uneasy.
I don’t think it needed to be a drama but it ended up being one because they don’t like people standing up for themselves and seem to treat everyone like shit and expect to be treated like royalty.
I don’t want a relationship with them. Id just like them to be polite and I don’t think it’s too much to ask. All this because I invited someone to a party.
I don’t think they get a say actually in their adults sons party guest. When there is no particular reason for us to not invite her and we get on.
Depends how much autonomy you have from your parents as an adult. But why do they get a say? If there was a reason then fine but there wasn’t. And also if they’d have properly communicated with me how they felt then I could have maybe understood. But they didn’t. They were just being awkward at the time and added people to the list that we don’t see.
I don’t feel it’s fair to sack your son because you’re not happy with who is invited to a party. That’s weird. I can’t believe so many people think it’s ok. Yes, they employ him. But does that mean they own him and his private life.
I don’t know. We’re adults. Doesn’t seem right that they fall out with us and treat us horribly because of a party. That’s childish. An a year on? And they’re not over it. Strange. We were very very close and it all seems daft but they clearly aren’t letting it go and instead want to make things awkward so I guess I stop making an effort in gifts and communication and be as cold as them.
Not really my style though. I tend to let go of grudges and get on with my life and I’m not cold with anyone so I’d have to force it.

It's not just a random party guest though or even your own side of the family- it was your FIL's sister. How odd that you wouldn't respect his wishes not to have her there. My father and his brother had a massive falling out and (even though I never fell out with my uncle personally) I wouldn't dream of inviting him to a party if my dad didn't want him there. I also don't understand why you would put your FIL's sister and some odd "principle" above keeping the peace with your in-laws. Your behaviour is deliberately antagonistic and that's not the way to be if you want to have a nice relationship with your in-laws, especially since your husband works for them!

As for the whispering- so what?! They may have been telling each other something completely innocent and didn't want to disturb the flow of the general conversation. It's totally weird to case drama over something so trivial.

Case=cause

@XelaM they haven’t had a massive falling out though. Have you read all my updates? They are pretty pleasant to her face and just slag her off behind her back. Their has been no fall out. It would be odd to just not invite her?
I’m not going to be manipulated because of a job. I’m not going to live my life and make decisions because he worked for them. You shouldn’t have to. Love for your son and a job should not be conditional on how compliant you are to their wishes and demands.
I guess we don’t agree on that.
We are better off without them. I’m not regretful of my actions. They’ve proven how horrible they are over and over again and I should never have made up with them the first time.
I think they are horrible and nasty people. His dad is a total narcissist and he’s only happy if he’s in control of everybody and everything.

I think you're right OP. People on MN either love or hate someone who stands up for themselves. You are literally a control freak's worst nightmare and they were never going to get along with you.

I assume your DP no longer works for them. If he does I would suggest he gets a different job so that he is not reliant on them.

I think perhaps with your Mum having passed on a few years back you are looking for what you consider to be an "ideal family ". I am afraid you are not going to find this with DP's family so I would cut my losses and follow DP's lead of NC. You will feel much better once you accept this is the situation.