An admission of sorts (texting/emotional cheating?)

[NameChanged294749]

Long one, sorry. I posted at the time but had it pulled as I'd given too much away at a vulnerable time. Huge thanks for all previous support.

Some outcomes...

After weeks of protestations and I don't knows DP has admitted that he was aware there was something amiss with the way he was texting his new female friend (more regularly than any other contact bar me and his best friend, me not knowing about her beyond absolute basics given a long time ago when they first met and with no idea as to their closeness which he ended up concealing).

We have recently had a very calm talk through it all because I do want to work through it. This is the first time we have had a situation remotely like this in all our long relationship and I don't think I can leave him over texting. It hadn't escalated to anything more than the regular secret text chatting (nothing dirty) but as previous posters pointed out it sounded like a possible early stages EA and needed addressing regardless due to secretive and cagey behaviour. She is someone he sees on person every day anyway hence the excessive/intimate nature of bolting a very regular, evening and weekends texting relationship on top of that behind my back. Here are a few of his insights:

PROS

• he initially didn't tell me about her or their closeness because he is a man of few words anyway. Initially she had been a welcoming friendly face who had put him (nervous person) at ease. But he was aware she had become a go-to evening and weekends chat person very quickly and without my knowledge. By the time he realised it was something that needed outing he felt it was a bit late and he was scared about how to broach it as he knew that I would likely (and rightly) be concerned at the meaning behind the volume and regularity of texts and him having not kept me in the loop. He was worried about me saying 'she obviously fancies you and you're going along with it'. So he buried his head in the sand. He admits being a coward. (Please note I have NO history of paranoia or jealousy regarding female friends, he has several and I have a few close male friendships too).

• I pressed him about when/why he realised there could be an issue. The bit that felt off to him was the regularity and sudden go-to-ness of her, but he says he rationalized this as okay because he was so keen to make friends since his recent life change and she is talkative and friendly. And each individual message itself was 'safe' so when he checked in with himself it was easy to say nothing was wrong -- there was no over the top flirting or intimacy so texting could continue and I didn't really need to know, it was probably fine, just chat.

• He didn't dial it back after his own "realisations" and moments of questioning because he convinced himself he was doing/had done nothing wrong and to change his behaviour would have been to admit wrongdoing and make it real/make it a thing and he didn't want it to be a thing.

• He didn't know what was in it for her (which he admits is an issue but the uncertainty also let him continue to an extent as it wasn't definitely wrong) but he was apparently so certain in himself that it wasn't about fancying her or not loving me that he again managed to rationalise it to himself (we have now had the chat about how feelings can develop unexpectedly in intense/secretive relationships and he understands this was naive and risky.)

• He knows it was wrong to keep it from me and admits being a coward who thought he could just ignore the issue until it hopefully went away (which is stupid but not malevolent, I think?).

• He definitely loves me and definitely doesn't fancy her. (I can confirm she is not his type physically). It was more of an attention/validation thing, something to do/an opportunity to come across well in a new context but boundaries got blurred because he hadn't paused to consider where they should be.

• She did invite him to meet her to spend time together for a hobby just the two of them but he turned this down as he didnt want to go. It seems he knew this might have been going a bit too far (though he is still unsure of her intentions and still wants to think it has all just been plain friendly). He says he just didn't want to go point blank and wouldn't have accepted the invite from anyone else either.

CONS

• Apparent lack of self control: he says he realised after an evening spent texting her when I was out with the girls that maybe the situation needed reigning in. He proudly stated to me last night that this is when he decided he wasn't going to continue. I checked my calendar and then his phone and pointed out that he texted her again 2 days after that (admittedly in a more perfunctory way but certainly still while I was elsewhere and in a way that led to more chat). In a sense it seems he couldn't help himself and so despite his own realisations I'm not sure what would ever have been enough for him to stop of his own accord or bring this up with me, two things he claims he would have done eventually. I'm certain he wouldn't have as the two of them were only going to get closer as time went on and he already couldn't broach it with me. He agrees that he was perhaps on a slippery slope here (but still maintains no romantic interest in her).

• the absolute mess of it: it has taken weeks and several strops and arguments for this to come out so plainly. It has been like blood from a stone. The hobby/day out invite was only revealed to me last week. There was a lot of denial and self delusion it seems, with me being dragged along behind. This latest frank chat is the result of me saying look, this has gone on too long and I can't function in this relationship anymore. It was jump or be pushed.

So wise MN, what do you make of this and would you give it a go or LTB? I am wanting to work through it and he seems willing, even with therapy if needed, but I also want a reality check on the gravity of my decision.

Sounds like you nipped it in the bud. I reckon he somewhat enjoyed the 'relationship' he had with her, and he inwardly knew it was wrong, but it's difficult to say if it would have progressed had you not intervened. I wouldn't LTB, personally, but I would make it very clear what you want from him now.
The trouble is, some people find this texting malarkey to be addictive as it's one step removed from what I call 'real' life, and can therefore be seductive. It will require effort on his part to not engage with this method of communication with either this woman or another in the future. It will also be difficult for you to not to continually check up on him.

You have nipped it in the bud, and been able to have a frank conversation about it now (despite how tough it was to get here). So not worth LTB just yet.

To me, it seems like this was a validation exercise for him - feeling needed/wanted/able to contribute, more so than anything romantic. I'm not sure what else is going on in your relationship, or if he has always been a bit insecure/lacking in self esteem. He clearly always knew he was pushing the boundaries of 'friendship', but whatever boost/high he was getting from it, obscured any real sense.

If he agrees to therapy, then it is worth exploring, what he feels was missing in your relationship that he was getting with her, hobby aside. That would be my worry with an emotional affair - that if whatever he felt was missing is still missing, this could crop up again with someone else. Also, he needs to realise he's hurt you and broken trust with the poor communication - and that cannot carry on. In a relationship, you don't get the luxury of seeking your emotional needs elsewhere just because you don't want the hassle of talking to your partner.

While you work through it, don't lose sight of yourself. Throw yourself into you hobbies and friends and interests - so you don't spend all your time feeling insecure and anxious. Use this as a time to reclaim who you are outside the relationship, and also for both of you to re-connect romantically.

I wouldn't leave over this. I would go for counselling though with him to see what to do to strengthen the relationship so its not vulnerable to outside parties in future

I have been here OP-- similar kind of husband too- In my case I think he got a kick from an attractive women who he wasn't married to texting and being attentive at a point when marriage had got a bit humdrum and there were some general life issues too. he had quite a bit of professional success quite suddenly in life and had never really been the guy that women suddenly were 'very interested' in and I think it went to his head and suddenly you have some (in my case) bright pretty young thing, sending the 4 times a day 'how are you' kind of things. They do justify it as just friendship and in many ways it is, they make it far worse for themselves though by often hiding it , letting it get far too much and not really getting where the boundaries are. If I had a male friend texting me morning noon and night and wanting constant life updates, I know full well my H would have been fine it was Sid from accounts who was in his 60's, not attractive and there was no way i would be interestedhe wouldn't have been fine if it was Gavin in accounts42, good looking, well dressed, fun, recently divorced etc. They are not daft, they know full well you wouldn't like it, but they do like it-- so in many cases they hide it. (and make it look far worse on themselves). My opinion is if you are friends enough to be texting multiple times a day to someone of the opposite sex, then they are worth at least mentions in general conversation with your partner whether they know them or not.

Thanks everyone.

@yetmorecrap I totally recognise what you describe. Did you guys get back from this alright? I'm not sure how long its going to take as it has been so hurtful. I've lost trust but also the implicit respect I had for my OH. He's more fallible than I realised but I suppose we all are and that's life

Well we are still married but I also found out he’s got a very secretive and extremely regular porn habit (this from a quite ‘right on’ kind of guy and he still doesn’t know that I know this ’) — so all I can say is I’ve never felt quite the same, the over texting caused me to snoop and I got a bit more than I bargained for. We do get on, we are good friends and he’s extremely sorry he did stuff that hurt me so much - but somehow the ‘special’ I feel was snuffed out- it’s been 4 years now- not sure if it will come back. It has however taught me to never be so co dependent again and never presume someonecwont be a shit , even if it seems they love you to bits. I’m afraid my trust in all men has somewhat been severely damaged

I think he has been a selfish twat and had his ego massaged. I would be extremely hurt by his actions and feel like I could not trust him. Your story reads as if you have forced a confession. It seems like he is saying and doing whatever to stop the noise from you? Not sure if this is right as the other posters seem to agree more. However I am not sure how I would deal with the situation. I suppose he would need to proactively restore my faith in him unprompted and without a shadow of a doubt, stop contact the the other person

I recall your other thread. I think at that point you had decided to support their friendship.

How did he handle ending the outside-work interaction with her? What did he say to her and how did she react?

Was the amount of time they spoke a huge factor for you?

@MsDogLady - to my knowledge he hasn't addressed it with her. He just stopped interacting by text/social media. I find it odd that she hasn't contacted him though. They were exchanging messages at some rate,/regularity and for basically any reason they could find, then as soon as I found out and challenged him it seemed to stop from both sides. But he says he hasn't said anything to her and he presumes she has just got the hint that he no longer wants to be texting buddies. It is strange though as I had been expecting her to continue for a while and him to have to tone it down gradually.

He states adamantly that nothing has been deleted either.

@Pollypocket89 yes it was the regularity of it. He said himself it had become a "routine", I think hiding any sort of routine from your partner is weird particularly with another woman involved. Doing that when I wasn't around too, like playing single in his head a bit. If he had been open from the start I would probably still have said jokingly 'oh be careful you're not leading her on, she seems quite keen' and I wouldn't have blamed him so much for complicity.

Yeah I can see why you'd feel that way. Do you believe he wasn't attracted to her?

I think you need to be sure if you believe him or not. Are you sure it never went any further? I saw a text by accident on my OH's phone - he swore it was just texting but then the ow text me and told me it wasn't out. Eventually he told me he had lied and everything she said was the truth he just didn't want to lose me.

We tried for over a year. It just didn't work, my feelings changed and I just didn't trust him. What was there to say he wouldn't do it again?

If you are going to give it a go then I would say beware that it could be a bumpy road and be aware of your feelings. Your emotions may change day to day - mine did and that can be very hard to deal with. Finally, I ended it - it was just too difficult but I tried.

@Pollypocket89 I haven't met her but personality and interests wise I think she is his type. Very talkative and outgoing so he doesn't need to be, similar interests. But that goes for many friends of his and he has said she's not all that funny, more just chatty, and sense of humour is a big thing for him. Looks wise I would be surprised if he was ogling her tbh. She is a very different type to me or his ex, or any celeb I know he has crushes on. But I know it's not always about that and he isn't a superficial person really. I do find it odd he risked so much and acted so oddly for someone he wasn't into. But then he is a bit insecure socially I think and maybe it could be just that made him feel good to have the attention, wrong as it might have been to push those boundaries.

@celticmissey thanks. Yes I am definitely experiencing a change of attitude day to day, it is so tiring not knowing how I'm going to feel about it. I think I'm sorted then out of nowhere it all hits me. I'm sorry to hear about your situation. I think the fact he declined the hobby invitation does demonstrate he wasn't desperate to spend 1:1 time together in person.

I don't mean to be negative at all, I'm just speaking from my own experience but just make sure it crosses your mind to flip your thought process from him liking the attention she was giving him etc, to remember that she might be having the same conversations with her friends about the attention he was giving her...

@Pollypocket89 thanks. Yeah I am aware of that and have mentioned to him that if there is something between them or if he has even given her that impression then he can be damn sure that everyone else knows, especially the other women they are in mutual contact with. Particularly considering how much of a chatter/sharer she is. I think men don't always understand the way female communication works... things of the romantic nature are never kept private in my experience!

[quote NameChanged294749]@MsDogLady - to my knowledge he hasn't addressed it with her. He just stopped interacting by text/social media. I find it odd that she hasn't contacted him though. They were exchanging messages at some rate,/regularity and for basically any reason they could find, then as soon as I found out and challenged him it seemed to stop from both sides. But he says he hasn't said anything to her and he presumes she has just got the hint that he no longer wants to be texting buddies. It is strange though as I had been expecting her to continue for a while and him to have to tone it down gradually.[/quote]
I'd be concerned that they've switched to a different platform, tbh. It doesn't make a lot of sense that she would magically just realise at the same time that it should stop.

True, I think if I was her I'd at least ask wtf

Indeed. I am wondering how she's got the hint. He hasn't said anything and I don't think they've got another after hours platform. But the sudden change in her behaviour too shows me that she's not 'just like that' with everyone/all the time. I really was expecting a dialling down period, so as not to let on there had been an issue (due to context drama is not an option). That it's immediately gone cold from her side too as soon as he's stopped liking her social media things and texting suggests to me that she was very aware of the potential behind all the contact. She has also toned down her liking of his social media things, having previously been liking/responding to every item (3/4 per week). He had been doing the same. So her own drawing back seems almost like mirroring him a bit. I don't know for sure but I think that suggests she wasn't clueless? Of course neither was he, as much as he wanted to deny that to both me and himself. I do hope it's not that they're still entwined in some will-we/won't-we dance.

Whilst you may have nipped it in the bud, please don’t start fully trusting him yet. He could have moved to a different platform, as you’ve already said he clearly has no self control when it comes to contacting this woman. That being said I think he’s been quite honest (which is a rarity in these situations) and now he knows that you absolutely won’t stand for it, so if he carries on then I’d say LTB... for now give him another chance but just be very cautious. Hope you’re ok and I’m glad you’ve communicated and made your feelings known!

Thanks @Ariesbaby89

Appreciate everyone's input, thank you.

More chatting with him and I'm angry again. But it's so hard because when he explains what has happened I also feel guilt. I also appreciate he is trying to work through things for us and that it is difficult for him because men/emotions.

He says he got warm feelings from her attention, feelings that he hadn't felt with me in a while. Not romantic as such, he claims, just happy/validated/excited to be wanted and that someone took an interest in him. I'm sure she was doing it romantically, hence him feeling "special" around her and wanting more of that, but he claims he definitely wasn't feeling romantic back.

I'm so hurt. From my POV I've never stopped being interested in him. He gave me the impression he was fine and happy with me/us but it turns out he has been very unhappy for quite a while. Personal things. I tried to support him last year, came up with strategies to make him feel better about himself and I thought they were working. I always tell him I love him, support his independent activities, always wanting contact when we lived apart for a while to the extent I would censor myself a bit because I didn't want to annoy him by messaging all the time or suggesting too many Skypes (which he never suggested back despite apparently being lonely...). To top it all off he didn't want to be intimate. I thought it was because of the personal issues and was waiting for him to come to me when he was ready. I felt quite shit in myself through all this but thought we had a plan in place so tried not to take it personally. But it turns out he didn't fully open up to me about how bad and lonely he was feeling and just "withdrew". He wanted to be strong for me or something? Well look how well that's turned out...

I'm so angry at him for letting all this happen and keeping me in the dark but I love him and feel sorry for him. But his difficult period was last year and it's now that he's lied to me about his secret regular texting relationship with another woman, jeopardised our relationship. I'm so confused and hurt. I thought I was doing an alright job. Not perfect, I'm no Stepford, but good enough.

Things have got much better with him personally since the start of the year (partly related to the life change that brought them into contact). The "bad period" was from before he even knew this woman. But now it turns out I hadn't been attentive, loving, or supportive enough when he had been down and apparently that's some significant context for what has happened. He doesn't blame me for this (indeed he hasn't accused me in these terms, but that is essentially the picture being painted). He knows he didn't let me in or give any hint he needed help/faked being okay, but essentially what he has experienced is needing help and not getting it from anyone including me. And so the difficult period created an unresolved distance between us that I wasn't aware of. That's where there's been space for this outside party.

Now I feel like I've been punished for not being attentive and validating enough, but really unfairly because he made out that things were fine and he wasn't in need of any more support than I was already giving. When I tried to help him with things I was concerned about with him it didn't go anywhere or he fobbed me off. He continued to say he loved me and I was perfect. Anyway, obviously the simple uncomplicated validation he found with her was enough to perk him up and that's why she was a secret.

I'm glad he is admitting it. He says recently and even before I caught on to his odd texting with her that he has been feeling more on track with himself and us, especially when spending quality time together. Great... except he was texting her right in front of me during an activity together the day I got suspicious last month. If things have been improving lately then why do that and not enjoy the activity together - I was there, I was giving him my attention, I was being present for him. But he still wanted to talk to his secret friend then too. I don't fully get it. His difficult period had been improving but its like after he shut me out he forgot to let me back in or something? So even though I was there giving the attention and being loving he wasn't feeling it? I understand he is trying to work through things honestly for me and I appreciate that, I'm just so confused and hurt. We had a nice holiday together a few weeks before the texting ramped up. I thought we were feeling close, but apparently not enough to ward this off.

And his process has left me feeling so angry. Why the hell should I now validate this person who betrayed me? If I wasn't doing it the way he needed before then I sure as hell don't feel like it now (well that's how I feel when I'm angry, anyway). But he needs it from me or he'll continue being unhappy and will find it elsewhere. I think we still love eachother but surely it shouldn't feel like this?

It's such a mess. Sorry for rambling.

But now it turns out I hadn't been attentive, loving, or supportive enough when he had been down and apparently that's some significant context for what has happened.

All part of the cheater's script. It's now YOUR fault he got giddy over another woman

Pathetic.

Get couples counselling (or individual counselling) for support.