Help me to word my last ditch attempt

[lastlastditchattempt]

Disclaimer - I know that whatever I say will probably make no difference and I'm preparing to leave if it doesn't.

So DP and I been together for 14 years.

Increasingly he -

1. Is dismissive of me, only wants to talk about his interests, looks mildly irritated at times if I talk.
2. Tries to dictate lots of things around our DC, I have to fight for a say.
3. Snaps or sneers at me with contempt if I do anything he doesn't agree with, for example calling me 'pathetic' for using hand gel at a cafe.
4. Is not supportive or caring to me anymore. I had a family scare recently and he didn't say anything nice or hug me when I told him.

I'm getting to the end of my tether, I find myself hating his company and feeling hurt, going off him sexually. He refuses to discuss the relationship, tells me to fuck off if I don't like him.

I feel like I need to make one last effort to make him see before I leave, because we actually had a relatively happy relationship for so many years. This behaviour was mild and occasional before, but it's been gradually increasing for around 2 years to now it's almost all the time.

I'm struggling with how to word this ultimatum though. I think he knows he treats me like shit, so I doubt he will listen. He has depression but so do I and I don't treat people like this.

How do I word it? Every time I try to write something it is rambling, off on tangents, or not concise.

I've seen people write really well on here, help please!

word it? Id be telling him to leave. He is a nasty person and not someone Id want to spend any time with.

What a hideous example to be showing to your children. Please dont allow yourself to be treated like this any longer.

Why bother? Just leave.
Things aren't going to change with a well written ultimatum. Save your energy and focus on your future without him
Good luck

Ultimatums don't work.
Why stay. He's an arsehole.
You're wasting your time

I wouldn't waste any time wording anything . Even if he did promise to change it wouldn't last he would soon slip back into being his usual nasty self.

Please don’t make any last ditch attempts with this man. He sounds like he’s already checked out. I’d give him what he wants and just leave quietly. Get your ducks in a row first though. When it gets to the point that every little thing annoys a partner, they’ve already checked out, they just want the other one to pull the plug.

What's the situation with the house, do you have somewhere to go, how old is DC, can you support yourself financially. Dont waste time fretting about him, concentrate on planning your own future.

I know, I get it really I do.

The reason I want to give an ultimatum is that we had 12 years where things were mostly good and we were in love once. It's sad, but I absolutely will leave soon if no change cause it's getting unbearable. DC said to me please don't break up the family, think they overheard me on the phone to my sister. So that too.

Re your comment:-
"I feel like I need to make one last effort to make him see before I leave, because we actually had a relatively happy relationship for so many years. This behaviour was mild and occasional before, but it's been gradually increasing for around 2 years to now it's almost all the time".

He does not deserve any consideration now because he knows how he treats you and he does not care at all. He has ground you down over the years really to both yours and your kids detriments. He has been abusive towards you I would think your entire relationship and now he has further ramped up the power and control against you till its at this point.

Do not waste time in giving him an ultimatum now. These can only be issued once and if in the event you are not prepared or able to follow it through there is no point in issuing one.

Employ your energies instead on getting him out of your day to day life. What is the situation re the finances and property?. How can you be helped into ridding yourself of your abuser?.

I can just about support us financially on my own, but no doubt he'd make it difficult.
We both work and share childcare, but I can see him claiming to be the main carer (he's not, it's probably 65/35 me/him).
We rent and are poor in UK standards. I can rent a flat a family friend owns.

I've done all the calculations and yes it's possible. I'm scared of him going for residency and ramping up his "I'm the father, I have all the say" in anything to do with the DC.

I just want to give one last try so I know I did everything I could, iyswim.

What did you learn about relationships when you were growing up?.
Did you see abuse at home when you were a child?.

Things were perhaps mostly "good" for you only when things were going his way re you or when you were fully quiet and completely subserviant to him. Your needs to him did not and do not matter.

That "nice" man you saw initially was a mirage, never to return. You were targeted by him to draw you in. He presented an act to you and such abusers cannot keep that going over time. He has merely ramped up the power and control against you over the years.

tells me to fuck off if I don't like him

Well, do you like him?

As for trying, I think it depends how old he is. He sounds like he is aging into a nasty, grumpy old codger. There might not be anything you can do. Some men seem to enter their mid 40s as nice men and emerge the other end as complete wankers.

There is nothing to rescue and or save here and trying to be either never works.

You have done everything you could already. There is no reasoning at all with someone abusive, trying to be nice and or amenable makes him detest you even more. Abusive men always think its someone else's fault too; its never their own. Such men too hate women, ALL of them.

He is not going to somehow become nicer when you leave him; he will continue to remain both difficult and obstructive. Like all bullies though he is a coward.

Obtain that flat this family friend owns and move into it asap.

Do you honestly think that such a man would at all want residency of his kids; he is using that as a stick to beat you further with. He does this because it works for him, it keeps you cowed. If he really loved his children as well he would not ever abuse you as their mother. He wants you to remain this fearful of him so he can continue to mistreat and otherwise abuse you. He may be their father but he does not have all the say, neither is he the boss man of you.

Abuse like this takes time, years even, to recover from. I would urge you to make contact with Womens Aid as well going forward and enrol yourself onto their Freedom Programme. This will also aid you in your recovery from such abuse.

No, no abuse at home. I had a good childhood. My father whilst he is a very loving father and would do anything for us, can be a bit dismissive and self absorbed. My mother was lovely and they loved each other, rarely argued. She was an anxious person and I am too. That would be clutching at straws though to blame it on my childhood.

We were genuinely happy for a long time. Honestly. There were hints of nastiness (not just to me, to others his family too) but I think he reigned it in cause he didn't want to lose me. Maybe he has checked out like someone said?

@MiniTheMinx No, I don't like him much any more. Although at times he is good company and makes me laugh.

Yes re age! He's worse now. He is 42.

@Zolaanna

Ultimatums don't work. Why stay. He's an arsehole. You're wasting your time

I agree with this and the other posters saying just leave.

And once you start going off someone sexually, I don't think there's any return from that.

lastlastditchattempt

We learn about relationships first and foremost from our parents, what did yours teach you?. A self absorbed and or dismissive dad and an anxious mother do not make for an ideal combination. They gave you between them a poor example of a blueprint or reference for your own relationships in adulthood.

re your comment:-
"We were genuinely happy for a long time. Honestly. There were hints of nastiness (not just to me, to others his family too) but I think he reigned it in cause he didn't want to lose me".

He never checked out, he is now showing you what he has been like all along. He is showing you his true colours. He did not want to lose you because if he had, he would then have to find another woman and that takes work; work he did not want to do!.

He may well have reigned in some overt aspects of his behaviour because he could sense that if he pushed you too far you could have left back then. He did just enough "nice" behaviour around you to make you doubt your own judgment re him and keep you in line. Such men like this are master manipulators, he has really played you throughout your entire relationship. Your boundaries were such that any red flags were either not recognised or otherwise brushed over (this about him being nasty to family members being a case in point).

Honestly if you want ultimatums to work you have to have some very clear examples of what you want him to change. It's not enough to say 'be caring' you have to say 'hug me when I'm upset' and you have to say 'talk to me respectfully' and tell him what the opposite of that is. Otherwise how are you measuring the ultimatum's effectiveness?

My own view is that if it's one behaviour that's pissing you off you can issue ultimatums but he just sounds like a horrible controlling and grumpy twat and you can't stop him being so with an ultimatum. Sorry. I just think you're making work for yourself and the end point is going to be the same (if you really mean it, and you should).

A dog would be good company and could make you laugh. Its still no reason to remain with such a man. Abusers too can be nice sometimes because if they were not, no woman or man would want to be with them. This from him is also really a part of the nice/nasty cycle of abuse and that is a continuous one.

If you can afford to leave then make plans to move into your friends flat. You will be happier although it might not seem like that at the moment. You already anticipate him to get difficult iver childcare so you know deep down he is not a good person to be around. How old are the dc. People change, show their true colours, fall out of love all the time. Do you really want to spend the rest of your life with him?

If you genuinely want to find out if there is anything to save then you need to ask him if he wants to do that too.

The ultimatum gauntlet has already gone down with his, if you don’t like then go. You are now going to counter with, if you don’t change then I go. Which seems a bit pointless and dramatic. It implies neither of you have the guts or will to end it.

But you need to ask the question of yourself and of him, do you have the guts and will to keep it going. If either of you answer no then you have got to let it go.

In reality you, him and the children are holding onto to a bad family dynamic because you fear change and the unknown. All of us can tell you than the change will be for the better. For all of you.

I applaud your attempts to keep your marriage going especially if you both have depression , but refusing to discuss the relationship and telling you to "fuck off if you don't like him" leaves very little room for manoeuvre. I am not sure there is anywhere to go after that. If he won't discuss his side of the story or discuss his reasons for feeling or behaving the way he does, then how can you resolve issues?

He is basically telling you that he is not prepared to compromise; he is saying, stop complaining, shut up or f* off (in effect). Sorry you are in this position; it sounds really really horrible for you . And I understand your instinct to not rock the boat for your DC, but honestly, you deserve to be treated with respect, and it's important they see you not putting up with that.

I agree with the others in that there really is very little you can do at this point. I do however totally understand needing to be sure you e done everything you can before you uproot everyone and everything.

In you position I wouldn’t open a discussion, whilst he may not be prepared to change anything about his behaviour, it also seems he doesn’t want to discuss it with you either. This will be because A) he knows he’s in the wrong and treats you poorly and B) because whilst he knows he does this, it’s just fine by him, changing that behaviour is a bit too much effort/can’t be arsed. So he’s very much sod you Jack, I’m alright!

I would say or rather better message him the following....

I don’t know about you, but I’m not happy, I can only presume that you are not happy either. Do you want to continue this marriage, or would you rather part on hopefully good terms and we can both move on and be happy? I don’t want to live like this the rest of my life. I don’t want to inflict miserable parents on the children either. How do you feel about a separation?

Don’t make it emotional, keep it factual and just ask him the question. Hopefully this will get across to him how serious you are, and perhaps give him pause for thought in how he treats you.

The only letter you should leave for him is one that reads "It's over and I'm gone."

Talking, or writing, at this point will have no real affect. Actions i.e. You moving out, might be enough to shake him out of it, but I doubt it. Make your moves, actually move, and see his reactions. There is a very, very small chance he might recognise what he is losing and why.

I would very seriously get your ducks in a row and ensure you can evidence that you are primary parent, child benefit in your name etc although you could claim one DC each and agree 50:50.

Sadly I think this is who he really is :(