Emotional affairs, crap behaviour - advice pls

[twatinaflatcap]

Hi everyone. I need some advice and I don't want it sugar coated, so I to turn to you lot to give me perspective. This is going to be long! Thanks to anyone who gets to the end!

Married for 11 years, together 14. When we first got together he showered me with love, praise and presents and one day it all just stopped. From that moment onward I didn't receive a Birthday/Xmas or other present from him.

He had an emotional affair whilst we were engaged and against my better judgment we married, I just didn't want to let my parents down who had paid a lot of money. Since, he has 'borrowed' a lot of money without my knowledge and not apologised or paid it back. Lies repeatedly about tiny things that make no sense and is believed by others to be a wonderful guy.

He retrained several years ago into a stressful job and has had several emotional or at least inappropriate relationships, msgs etc with women he works with (who knows he's married). He is aware they are wrong because he deletes them from his phone after every exchange, however he seems to forget to delete them from our joint tablet

The worst msgs were to a female colleague who made it clear they were not interested. He told her that were in a marriage of sorts and only here for the kids. The usual script. She makes his world light up and he's just so grateful he met her etc etc! He continued to msg her until she blocked him. The msgs he sent were awful and I knew nothing of these feelings. He admitted he believed he was in love with her, despite the fact he met her only 3 times, she wasn't interested and let's just move on!

After seeing these msgs I asked to see his phone. On other msging accounts he had conversations with colleagues about his feelings for this female colleague and his feelings regarding our marriage. Again I knew nothing about these feelings.

Long and short, he begged forgiveness etc and I allowed him to stay for the sake of the kids (2 disabled children) as long as he got counselling and arranged couples counselling for us. He did counselling himself but didn't arrange counselling for us.

Since then, which was 8 months ago, I've found msgs from two other female colleagues and to a male colleague laughing about how popular he is! In msgs to one, he is talking about taking drugs and having sex with them. In discussion with his male colleague who has also slept with her, he asked if she is likely to be discrete and understand it could only be a one time thing, because then it would be something he would have to think about!

I again told him that he has 6 months to arrange counselling for us and to again go back to counselling himself. If this isn't in place by then I'm divorcing him for unreasonable behaviour. He hasn't done this yet. I know he won't bother, he's relying on me to be the bad guy, as per usual.

During this time he has continued to profess his love for me and doesn't want to leave. But actions speak louder than words in my opinion.
I believe and have told him so, that he is here because he cannot afford to leave (have his own place and afford maintenance etc) and he's holding me hostage because of it. If this other work colleague had been interested he would have left without a second thought. I firmly believe that.

Also, he plays a violent game on the pc when our young children are awake. I don't believe it's appropriate. I do fully appreciate it is the way he relaxes when feeling stressed, but made it clear it is not to be played while they are awake and can walk in on him playing it. He agreed to this, but continues to do so. Twice today he has had to be reminded to wait till they are in bed. I have suggested he finds another hobby, even one outside the home he can go to whenever he wished too, to destress. I'm not in any way saying no to hobbies and feel like he does it to deliberately piss me off, regardless of how inappropriate it is for the kids.

He has 3 months left to organise counselling as per our agreement, I know he won't, yet will cry and beg for me to give him another chance - again.

He has a stressful job where he sees some upsetting situations and says all this behaviour is down to depression, and thinks he's had a breakdown.

I don't deny he struggles and have valid reasons too, but don't believe I should have to accept such shit behaviour. I also feel that he should look to moving into another area of work if he cannot cope with the demands of his current job, but he won't.

So ladies, what advice do you have for me?

And what are you teaching your DC?

That Daddy can do the fuck what he likes -as Mummy will suck it up?

I left an abusive DH. It didn't wreck my kids -it empowered them. My eldest will never ever let anyone treat her like crap ever. Period.

Why are you waiting around for him to leave you? Stop letting him call the shots and make the decision to end this circus.
MH in never an excuse to cheat or bad behaviour in a relationship and you would be better not trying to work out why he is doing or saying what he is, its all to confuse you. Focus on what you want out of this situation, if that's to stay, then stay but if you want to leave, then leave. Put the relationship decision back in your hands regardless of what he crys about.
If you leave him before he gets a new partner it might teach him something..

But that's just it. It looks like you do believe you should accept shit behaviour. 11 years of deceitful shit so far. Maybe counselling for yourself would help you get out of this quicker - you don't need his permission to do your own counselling.

Oh god, the woe is me FB post. What an utter cunt. Humiliating for you, but who cares as long as his ego is fed? Makes me want to puke.

He wants to stay married because it is useful to him for you to facilitate his life. If contact would be difficult post separation due to his job, that's his problem not yours.

I love my parents, but have never quite forgotten just how absolutely spineless my mum was in the face of similar behaviour. It killed my self esteem and respect for her for many years. She did eventually see the light and tell him to fuck off, after about 10 years after we first became aware that he was up to no good.

Ffs get out, you owe it to your girls. From the behaviour description, he may well be a narcissist. There is no hope with that type, none at all. Counselling as a couple would achieve precisely nothing- why not go alone and work on your self esteem?

The fact that you're asking us to tell you straight is encouraging. I think you know what to do, and just need a bit of support to get it done. Keep talking OP and hold your head high - the only person who should be shamed by his behaviour is him.

X post with @Opentooffers!

I was in your position, my husband did exactly the same for 17 years. Time and time again.

Each time i found out, he would beg forgiveness, say he loved me and wont do it again blah, blah, blah.
I never forgave or forgot but brushed it under the carpet.
He would behave for a few months and do it again.

I didnt feel able to leave because he threatened suicide.

Despite my threats he carried on as i had basically given him the green light to continue.

I made him leave 2 years ago, i had planned to leave when our DD was 18 (10 years after imade the decision) but when DD was 15 i checked his phone for the first time in years and he had asked a woman on a date and i ended the marriage that night.

He is still in shock and wont get over it, he cant believe i let every previous occasio go and then out of the blue ended the marriage.

My husband had a shit childhood, had depression for years, and apparently only did the emotional affairs as an ego boost and would never have left me as he loved me too much.
He thought i should have just put up with it.

The thing i realise now was the lack of respect he had for me as his wife and mother of his child. If he respected me he wouldnt have done it.

You cannot keep giving him ultimatums and when he doesnt do it just do nothing and carry on before giving him another ultimatum when he has another flirting session. You've given him the green light to continue.

Your daughters will cope, yes it will be very hard to start with but they will adapt.

As others have said you either put up and shut up and ignore everything he does but accept that you have a good life otherwise or you end the marriage and feel like a weight has been lifted, you're not waiting for the next time to happen and you feel free.

Leaving my marriage was the best thing ever, i try not to regret not leaving earlier.
I was with him for half my life, I know that the next half of my life will be so much better and less stressful.

If you always do what you always did you'll always get what you always got.

Life's not a dress rehearsal, this is it. Keep on carrying on like this and before you know it you'll be out of time

Thank you everyone. I needed someone to tell me straight and I knew I could rely on you all.

Although I've shared some things with my parents when the worst of the msgs were going on, they wanted me to work on it, don't upset the kids. My mum especially harps on about how great he is, how much he clearly loves me. It makes me feel ungrateful, like I'm overreacting and I second guess myself.

I gave him choices and time so I could prove to myself and everyone else that I did my absolute best to try and make it work. I didn't just give up. I have been hoping for the whole fairytale amicable divorce, where we can be great friends bla bla bla. Yes, I know I'm deluded!

He will never change, because he doesn't understand that what he does is wrong. He maintains he hasn't physically cheated, so that's ok. I feel more hurt by the emotional affairs. It takes effort to disengage and give your time to others.

Love is over-sold. What value is the love of a man who cheats and lies to you consistently, never minding the emotional harm he does you? I'll tell you - it's fucking worthless.

My ex loved me as much as he was capable of, but it was the same shitty facsimile of love that you've got with your bloke.

Love is only of value when it comes alongside loyalty, respect, care for your wellbeing, etc. Otherwise it's just a word and a performance.

Dear OP

His behaviour is abusive and one thing many abusers do is make themselves look amazing to the outside world because it enables them to continue the abusive behaviour at home. It makes a great smoke-screen for their true nature and they feed off the adoration which comes with it.

Most abusers can charm the pants off anyone. They have a colossal sense of entitlement and are unbelievably manipulative - hence the love-bombing at the outset (typical of an abuser, btw). They also don’t believe in their partners’ reality - deep down he sees you as a thing which he owns and can treat however he wishes. It also helps isolate you from family and friends who can’t quite believe the truth.

Please read “The Mind of the Intimate Male Abuser: How He Gets into her Head”.

Please explain to your mother that your H us engaging in abusive behaviour and she needs to educate herself and help her daughter get herself out of this destructive relationship ASAP. Get some friends onside as well. You may find that a few see through his charm or can be helped to do so.

Your DDs may struggle with change but they will get over it and actually you have rights too, including not living with a bastard who continually demeans you. The upheaval of separation will be difficult but temporary - the scars of growing up in a relationship where their father treats their mother like shit may well be permanent.

Good luck, OP, and keep posting here for support.

“Love is only of value when it comes alongside loyalty, respect, care for your wellbeing, etc. Otherwise it's just a word and a performance.”

And this, with bells on. As often said on MN - love is not enough. By a long shot.

If you're still having sex with this worthless sack of shit then you should think about getting an STI check. Obviously he's got a nasty case of wandering cock trouble.

I have given him this chat to read. He is doing a wonderful job of acting contrite!

I have told him I am divorcing him and he is to pack up and leave my home by Wednesday.

Thank you ladies, I needed that talking too🍷

@twatinaflatcap
Yay - good for you.

Just remember that any promises he makes will be broken within months.
Men like him cant help themselves, they need the ego boost.

I am so proud of you! Normally these conversations involve lots of “Yeah but....” justifying and minimizing his atrocious behaviour - and then the poor OP comes back with another thread with another version of the same story.

Stop asking for his permission to end your marriage, and stop waiting for him to take it out of your hands either.

Your kids WILL get used to a new schedule, you won't be able to keep things exactly as they are now forever, no matter what happens now. Life IS change, and that applies to ALL of us..........

So stop making your kids the excuse for your inaction.

TELL him it's over, and his bags are packed, and show him the door. No amount of crying, blame shifting and words of remorse or regret can bring back the love and trust that has been lost. When it's gone, it's gone.

YOU are the only one who can help yourself and your kids.

And neither you or your kids can begin to live properly until you take action...........................

I just saw your update.

Congratulations on being ready and able to take the action needed.

To your 'DH', accept what you have done, and the fact that your actions killed all the love and trust between you both. Accept that you must ALL begin to move forward with a new normal. Support your kids physically, emotionally and financially. Respect your wife's wishes.

Well done 💐

Fantastic update, well done.

I have two disabled children too, and change can be very hard. However, they WILL get used to it - even if it's tough at first. Have you thought about using social stories to help? I find those really help with transitions and changes.

You've made the first step - now just stay strong. You deserve better than this shitshow.

Good for you. I thought this was going to be one of those unbelievable threads where you convince yourself to keep 'trusting' him.

Oh and get him to pay back the money he owes you. Useless, lying, sponging cunt.

Please follow through.

This is no way to live, with a man who treats you so appallingly. I guarantee you’ll feel better for leaving.

He continued to msg her until she blocked him. The msgs he sent were awful and I knew nothing of these feelings. He admitted he believed he was in love with her, despite the fact he met her only 3 times, she wasn't interested and let's just move on!

This was enough on its own to make me snort with laughter.

How old is he? 12???? Hold on, I don't think I would have done that even at that age!!

He's all over the place. Totally unreliable and trustworthy. The only thing you can predict is that he's unpredictable. You can't set good foundations with someone who's like that. It will never work. It must be awful to see him cry like that - a lot of well meaning, empathic, sympathetic women can't help but fall for that.

He wants to remain in the relationship because things are good for him, thank you very much. You fulfil his needs and he knows a lot of other women wouldn't put up with his bullshit.

And as for your parents - they are a disgrace. Tell them everything and I do mean everything and then tell them that seeing that is incredibly bad for children and you won't be subjecting yours to that kind of childhood and if they can support you they will be seeing a lot less of all of you. Cheeky fuckers. No wonder you doubt your own judgement! Thank his god mumsnet!

Thank god for mumsnet I mean!

And if they can't support you they will be seeing a lot less of you! Bloody phone..