Mum took overdose

[Lauren850]

My mum is a fiercely independent 91 yr old, living alone and isolated during lockdown. She had a bout of illness last weekend and decided to end her life by taking sleeping pills....only she woke up 12 hours later. She fell getting up but was able to call an ambulance a few hours later and is now recovering. I don't know how I'm supposed to feel - her attitude is that at her age and in not great health this was a completely rational and fair decision and her absolute right. The note she left for me and my brothers - which i retrieved yesterday while collecting stuff she needs - said this and to lie to everyone else especially grandchildren about the cause of death.
My teenagers both have mental health problems so she is absolutely right on this, right now I'm finding it hard to support them as normal with all this in my head.

My grandad overdosed on morphine at 90, got taken to hospital and died 3 days later. He simply said he had enough and wanted to be back with grandma (he rapidly went downhill after his 90th, had a fall and broke his spine in 3 places) Although it wasn't nice seeing him like that or knowing that he'd done that, we all completely understood why he'd done it.

For me personally, I'd much rather be in control of my own mortality than suffer.

Round here care homes aren't allowing visitors.

To be fair, the OP didn't really ask about whether her mum was right to attempt suicide. (S)he said that she didn't know how to feel about it herself, she currently feels alone in however she's feeling & she's partly angry that her mum would attempt suicide while her daughters are facing MH issues.

I think that shock/anger are rational reactions to a suicide attempt, especially if not previously discussed in the case of a the free choice of a competent, lucid adult. She didn't say that she had expressed these reactions to anyone (although I still recommend the trusted friend option).

Lastly, suicide can still be taboo depending on upbringing, family emotional fluency & religious belief/practice. However one feels about it in the abstract, I think what OP was looking for was a place to vent & to get her head straight.

Whilst I can totally understand how distressed you feel, I am afraid that I have to come down on the side of her appearing to have made a rational decision and that is her right. We have an unhealthy relationship with death in the UK. It would be wrong to suggest that people should be allowed to die simply on a whim, but many people are driven to extreme lengths through having no choice. My own father begged to be allowed to die - and had a DNR - for six awful months in hospital when they brought him back from death twice, against his and our wishes.

Informed choice is not a waste of life - keeping people alive when they have nothing to live for is cruelty. We are allowed to treat our pets better than we can treat our loved ones. If we had a more compassionate and balanced society then we could engage in these conversations like adults, and before the time might come that we would need to act on them.

I am so sorry . I really feel for you. My parents recently said they would end it altogether as they have had a good life but health problems are really getting to them now ( not the virus) I was devastated and cried afterwards . I am sure they did not meant to hurt me but it was so hard to hear . Now everytime I contact them I worry they have done something.

Evening everyone,

We're just popping in to explain the couple of deletions on this thread. We don't tend to allow posts that discuss specifics of suicide methods, we're afraid, so we've nipped in and deleted them. We just wanted to let you know.

We're so sorry to read about what's happened, OP. for you and for those on the thread who have had similar experiences.

It's Mother's Day in the US. Came across your post and had to reply.

My mother committed suicide at the age of 60. She chose a violent exit, which is uncommon with women. She did have a mood disorder which had been successfully controlled for years. Or so we thought.

What my brother and I didn't know was that she had actually tried, years before, with sleeping pills. She asked my dad to hide it from us out of embarrassment and guilt.

I don't blame my dad, but wish I had been told, because when he told me (I live out of state) that she was losing weight, had issues sleeping, complained of a constantly upset stomach, I would have considered those big red flags. I would have come to her immediately and seen she was truly not in her right mind. As I'd just had a miscarriage, I simply tried to call her more often and assumed she would reach out and get help as she had always done.

Not so.

The reason I bring this last bit up is because I'm wondering about your daughters. If they have been talking about suicide, might this not be a good reason to tell them? Let them see how gutted you are?

I don't see how you're going to hide your anxiety, guilt (?), anger, and distrust of your mother. (I can't see how you are doing it right now!) My teenager would definitely notice and wonder, "And all this b/c Nana had a fall...Is Mom losing it?"

My son and daughter know about my mother. My son was only three when it happened, and my daughter was not born, but as soon as they were old enough to ask questions, I answered as "age-appropriately" as I could. And not without a frank discussion about how deeply this has affected me and my family. I'm not positive, but I think they are (hopefully) "inoculated" against trying such a thing. Depression and suicide are now an open conversation. Not pushing this, of course, you know your daughters best. Just another perspective.

I'm so sorry.

BTW - the social worker's question was completely out of line!

I agree with what Yankee said about telling your daughters.

I also think we ought to have autonomy over our bodies and our exit in situations like this, instead of treating suicide like a dirty secret.

Some of the replies have been very lacking in empathy towards the OP.

It's easy for someone who is not emotionally involved to say that they understand the mother's reasons for attempting suicide and that OP "shouldn't" be angry with her.

In reality, if someone you love attempts suicide, it's devastating, it's normal and ok to feel anger and all sorts of emotions.

OP, I am sorry for what you're going through. I encourage you to call some suicide or mental health helplines to talk about how you're feeling about your mother and your children too.

Personally I'd be a mess and I'd be struggling with the feeling that I have to hold it together for everyone else.

Mental health problems are common in the elderly. Hopefully she has had full assessment and some treatment?

No it's not normal to be suicidal at any age. Older people have mental health support too.

It’s normal to feel anger and it’s normal not to feel anger.

There is not a textbook on this. OP is perfectly entitled to feel the way she does and her mother is, too.

I think we should stop patronising the elderly and should stop telling them how they should live their life. I’m not suggesting OP is doing that, it’s just a general observation.

I honestly can’t believe some of these insensitive posts! So sorry you’ve had to go through this OP I can understand how distressed you must feel.

It’s no different to finding out your DM was in a terrible accident but survived. People have to understand all of the complex emotions that family and loved ones deal with when it comes with suicide, the guilt, the helplessness, the blame, the anger and the self blame. It’s very complex unlike a natural / situational death. Yes anyone can decide to take their own life if they choose but it non the less harder on loved ones.

I find some replies on here a bit strange. On an emotional level an attempted suicide of a parent is devastating for a child of any age.
On a caring and practical level, it 's not about accepting it - that's wrong. It indicates suicidal ideation which is a mental health problem. She will have been assessed by the crisis team prior to discharge.
Does she have depression OP?

I am sorry as it's obviously upsetting for you OP but I hope I can do this for myself if I ever need to if I am lucky enough to get very old. The alternatives seem way worse.

I find some replies on here a bit strange. On an emotional level an attempted suicide of a parent is devastating for a child of any age.

Absolutely.

On a caring and practical level, it 's not about accepting it - that's wrong. It indicates suicidal ideation which is a mental health problem.

Maybe but not necessarily. Some older people with disabilities or chronic ill health are just very dispassionate and rational about their options, with no low mood associated to their decision.

At least now OP gets a chance to talk this all through with her DM.

Wow - thanks everyone for your replies and especially for he amazing empathy and kindness some of you have shown. You're right, the whole debate about the ethics of suicide misses the point about how it feels. I keep coming back to 'this is not normal' and statistically that's true. The sad thing is that now - at 91 - my mum has mental health services all over her but it's 50 years ago she really needed help. Her life and ours could have been so different! It's fantastic the world is changing but I'm sad for all these years of having a parent i was expected to help and never could.

Lauren850. I am sad she has gone. It broke my heart that she felt it was her only option. I couldnt be angry at her, she was in pain mentally and physically. She wasnt living, she was existing. I have to honor her decision and feel no animosity, just sadness.

I have no idea why my previous post was deleted either

theoldtrout01876 I'm so sorry for whst you went through and can begin to imagine your pain. It's upsetting that your post was deleted as it contained nothing anyone could regard as offensive or damaging in any way, just the mention of an actual suicide. Seems to confirm the strength of the taboo - suicide must be kept secret and not spoken of directly.

It's upsetting that your post was deleted as it contained nothing anyone could regard as offensive or damaging in any way, just the mention of an actual suicide. Seems to confirm the strength of the taboo - suicide must be kept secret and not spoken of directly.

No. I’m sure @HebeMumsnet will correct me if I’m at all wrong, but what I remember is MHHQ taking specific advice from suicide charities after a couple of tricky threads here, and adopting a number of modding rules and measures after that, including removing specific mention of methods. It is not to do with taboo, but very much prevention.

General advice to mainstream media from the suicide charities is the same - don’t mention method of suicide, in case it inspires others.

OP you mentioned the supposed suicide taboo much earlier in the thread, saying it prevented you from talking to friends about your DM’s attempt.

I am in southern England, born in the 1970s and I found that extremely surprising. Maybe the taboo is more specific to your family and community or culture than you suppose? Maybe also generational? (Although you can only be 10-15 years older than me.) Anyway, I mean this encouragingly. We have had a tragic suicide (of a twenty something, a couple of decades ago now) in our family and I’ve never found there to be a taboo. So rest assured there are people out there who don’t feel that, and support you can find where no such stigma or repression will apply, and MN are not imposing a taboo either.

Arietty i find that post really patronising. Ok taboo is the wrong word but if you're seriously telling me people find it easy to talk about suicide you're having a laugh. I work in mental health services - in one of the most multicultural area of London - and even when it comes to a patient no-one has known well, it's deeply shocking and upsetting. Telling people about your family member being suicidal or actually killing themselves is hard because of what it puts the other person through to hear this. I've seen this many times when telling people about my older daughter being suicidal, often after an incident where I've had to make an emergency exit to be with her. It's deeply shocking and disturbing and the more you express, the more difficult it gets - it forces the listener to confront pain and fear - that's what i meant.

It wasn’t meant to be patronising. I’m aware there are cultural taboos in some communities but I’ve never -in a personal capacity - found anyone under 45 or 50 who shied away from the topic unduly.

I hope you find some support, anyway.

Arrietty
Are you a mental health professional?

It may be statistically uncommon for a woman of your mother's age do this but I don't think it is unusual at all for people of that age to opt out of life more subtly - which really amounts to the same thing. My husband's grandmother at 90 decided that she did not want to live anymore after recovering from a fall so she just stopped eating. The whole family viewed it as a act that was 'very her'. She was incredible stubborn and had very firm opinons (I am trying to be nice but she was a hard woman to like to be honest). It was a horrible thing to witness and understand but the medical staff told us it was not unusual at all.

@Lauren850 really sorry to hear about your mother's suicide attempt, I think that at any age it's hard to have a suicidal parent.

I've been suicidal in the past & thought I was completely rational & now I look back and realise that, no I was actually mentally unwell & depressed.

It annoys me that often mental illness such as depression, various types of dementia or psychotic behaviour in the elderly is treated as acceptable by some when actually it is not a natural part of ageing at all!!

My Nan threatened suicide aged 91 due to being mentally unwell- we didn't realise at the time but she had underlying dementia with psychosis which she was sectioned for in the end.
After treatment she recovered from the acute psychosis & stopped feeling suicidal.

I hope your mum gets the treatment she needs, meanwhile you do need some support. Maybe your gp would know how to access support?