Decision time, what's going to do the least amount of damage to DC?

[mmmmmmmmno]

Apologies in advance as this is likely to be long and rambling...

Background- Married 7 years, together 10, 2 DC 5 and 7 yrs plus my 2 DC from exDH 11 and 13.

We have had a difficult relationship from the outset, I was head over heels in love with DH at the start, we knew each other from 10 years before we got together when we used to go to the same nightclub as teenagers.

When I was 16 I had my first serious boyfriend, he was abusive and violent but I was obsessed with him. He dumped me when he went to Uni, I had other relationships but this boyfriend would always come back into my life and I would fall fr I'm all over again, I thought he was my soulmate. I married exDH at 21 through fear of being left on the shelf (my sister had married the previous year and when I met exDH I had just been dumped). We had 2 DC together but I found him annoying. He was very passive aggressive and had a short temper, he shoved me a couple of times, once when I was pregnant as I turned the TV off when he was watching football. Anyway, I ended our marriage as the horrible first boyfriend came back on the scene and I fell for him all over again (not something I am proud of. this was 11 years ago. We were together just over a year, he was violent, sometimes in front of my DC. What I didn't realise was I was being groomed by him. I can't actually remember how found out the truth but he told me, probably to get in first before the police did it fr him. He had a criminal record and was on the sex offenders register for downloading and distributing child pornography, I finally got the courage to really end it and he attempted to strangle me, I got him off and left. I told a good friend who told my parents just to make sure there was no going back. He also left me over £13,000 in debt as I took out loans and credit cards in my name and give him the cash! Writing this all down for the first time makes it seem like some cray story, and not actually my life.

Anyway, a week later I bumped into DH in a bar, we remembered each other from 10 years before and got chatting. He was gorgeous and there was an instant attraction. I had vowed to be single for at least a year given everything I had put my children and myself through but he was different. We swapped numbers and things went from there. DH met the DC after about 2 months, he was great with them initially, bt then things started to change. I remember he was at my house one day and I had just changed DS1 nappy, he was only about 20 months old, I rolled it up and stuck it down and left it in the garden next o the full bin, DH came in and started having a go at me for being disgusting. Following this he slowly started trying to stamp his authority on how I parented my DC, lots of the time he probably had a point, I was too relaxed with them. A few key things I remember are him making them go to bed at 6pm instead of 7, him instigating us moving into a flat from my rented house as he didn't like the neighbours and he felt like it was just my home, him causing all sorts of issues between me and exDH, controlling when he could phone to speak to the DC, him picking on DS1. I have lost count of the amount of times I have ended our relationship but something always pulls me back. DH's dad passed away suddenly 8 years ago, I was like a rock to him and his mum, this seemed to soften DH for a while, I fell pregnant with DS2 and DH proposed to me. We married shortly after DS2 was born, I thought it may be a mistake and even cried on my hen do but went through with it because it was easier and I loved DH. I then fell pregnant with DD2 who is now 5. Things have always been bumpy but I have always tried accept my proportion of the blame, I think I am damaged by my past and project this onto DH. My 2 DH say they hate DH, even DS2 who is DH son regularly tells me he doesn't like daddy. DH had a very strict upbringing, he has carried this on in his style of parenting. He talks to all of us with this derogatory tone of voice if we have done something he doesn't agree with. When things are going his way he is pleasant and can be fun. Most of the time it's like living with the fun police.

We brought our house about 3 years ago, we have completely renovated it. DH has done most of the work as he has the strength and the skills required, I do not. He has made me help even when he hasn't really needed me to, leaving the DC bored and mischievous. I took them out once when my dad came to help DH with the work and everytime we fall out DH delights in telling me how I have done nothing to help around the house and how I just swanned off and left him to do everything. I have one lots of the work, plus all of the caring of he children and looking after the day to day running of the house, cleaning, cooking washing etc.

DH used to tell me I was lay when I was on maternity leave, I was often told I just sat on my arse all day. I now work full time.

Sorry this has indeed been long and rambling, to get t the point, on Sunday I told DH I have had enough, he was telling me all I care about is myself and I do what I want when I want, I told him what I really want is a divorce. He told me that I need to tell the kids, I said no, its between us, he went and told all of the kids to come out as mummy has something to tell them, I tried to save the situation and said we were going for our daily exercise, DH told them mummy needs to stop lying, that's mummy's problem, she lies. I took the DC and went out without him. We have barely spoken since.

What is the best outcome for the DC?
Is it best to stay with Dh in our home with the financial security that brings? DD2 loves daddy and would be devastated. DS2 loves him too but hates the was he is impatient and doesn't allow them to voice their views or have their say.
Or do I walk away, risk loosing our home and take DC 3&4 away from their father but give DC1&2 the relaxed life they deserve?

I think you need to focus on the children and your relationship seems toxic.

It is likely you will need to leave so you could start to plan finances. Do you have equity in the house? Can you afford to rent or buy?

Just do the planning quietly and then move on when you can. Avoid any further escalation or threats to leave as you H will just bring the children into it and it must be horrendous for them.

Then remain single...your children have gone through so much and they only have a few more years left of their childhood.

we have about £120k equity in the house, half of that doesn't go very far. I have just worked out what my maximum purchase price would be and all I could buy would be a 2 bedroom flat, no good for a family of 5.

Although different back story, I too am in the early stages of splitting up with husband. It’s really really hard when you are stuck in the situation to see the wood for the trees. I think you may be entitled too more tbh. Organise a a call with a family solicitor, a lot offer the first call for free - I had one yesterday and it was really really helpful. I think you need to put your children first, it sounds awful (my situ isnt much better !) but kids need to go first. The little ones will thrive and the older ones will be able to breathe. Good luck !

thank you @NewHorions2020 it's nice to know I'm not alone.

It's so much easier said than done though,, I know he will make it difficult. I feel bad to making him loose his home and not be with his children as much. He is so grumpy all of the time though, one part of me thinks it would be better for his relationship with them and the other part of me worries about him having contact without me there to constantly stick up for them, or explain their feelings and behaviour for them.

I think you know you have jumped into all of your relationships very randomly hoping that this person will be the one for you so I won’t bang that point home on you. That issue is for you to address once you are out of this marriage as if you don’t address it you could easily find yourself back here in 5 years time doing the same thing with a different man

Your DH sounds awful to all of you this surely cannot carry on so you need to take steps forward and don’t let him bully you into staying. You need to get legal advice as you may not have to take 50/50 of the equity and you need to find out your position. He is going to be angry/afraid of you doing his so his intention towards you is to be so horrible you don’t dare attempt to take any money or control over your own life.

What can you afford to rent? One of you needs to leave. You won’t get housing benefit as you have a home but if there is DV you might be able to get some support from Women’s Aid have you tried to call them?
You might have to consider a new area that you can afford

Get some legal advice, family support and your finances together sooner rather than later. If he will move out to give you space then ask him to do so

And stay safe

Your DC will suffer in the medium to long term if you stay with this man imo. I think situs like this get worse rather than better sadly x

Similarly op I was in 2 abusive marriages..
Things I would have done differently post Ltb...

No contact between MY dc and second exh. Save your dc from more abuse.
Exh had enough rope and he did indeed 'hang' himself in that his hatred for me turned OUR dc against him until they went nc.
He is indeed a sad lonely man now.

All your DC will be happier if you leave.

Some lenders (eg Newcastle BS) include CMS payments as part of your affordability for mortgage lending. Have you worked out what you would be entitled to for all 4 kids? You might be surprised how much this bumps up your affordability

Leave, he sounds like a complete dickhead.

@Menora I could afford to rent somewhere, DH will not leave.

@Windyatthebeach sorry to hear that but we’ll done for getting out. DH isn’t violent, he is just grumpy and sucks the joy out of lots of things. I don’t think he means to, it’s just the way he is. Although, when he is out with friends he is different, happy, funny.

We are in the process of selling our house and buying somewhere else, things have been delayed due to Covid 19 but should be ready to exchange when the restrictions are eased. I need to convince DH to go ahead with the sale but not the purchase. He won’t agree though and will just cancel it all.

I feel so confused, I know what I need to do but I can’t help worrying I’m making a mistake.

@Stronger76 I have only worked out for the CM o am receiving from exDH for DC 1&2 as DH won’t pay without being forced to and that could take months.

I hope you can find the strength to leave this man. I know right now you think this is stable and ok. I did too.

My children were 11 and 5 when ex left me. I would of done anything to keep the family together. And sold my sole.

He was a loud shouty angry man who had no patience with the children. I was always refereeing his parenting. It was a strained atmosphere

My youngest adores her dad. The past nearly 3 years now it hasn't been easy. He has gone for up 10 weeks with no contact. No child support for over 2 years. And the children being ignored at contact. My eldest refused to go.

His Circumstances have changed recently. And due to lock down ex has been here for 3 days a week. He has no where to see the children. And I. Am Working and supporting my isolated parents. So this arrangement suits us best.

It is really strange. And he is on his best behaviour. But the children are much more calm and relaxed on the days he isn't here.

It has helped the eldest build bridges with their dad. But I have built and calm safe home over the years and the children are better people for going through the split.

Stay strong. And give your children a safe and happy home. I'm glad I did. And it has taken lock down to see how far I have come.

@mmmmmmmmno the sooner you put in a claim, the sooner he will have to do the right thing.

When I was in a similar situation I moved out into rented property. It took 3 years to force the sale of the house (I found a really empowering solicitor who showed me I had the ability and strength to do lots of the legal legwork myself to slash costs).

The day I moved out was the scariest of my life. There were some very dark days in the months and years after that. But every day got me closer to my freedom from my ex and the abuse he inflicted on me and the children.

@unicornsarereal72 wow, well done, sounds like you have come such a long way.

Refereeing his parenting is exactly what I do. He says I undermine him but he has no patience with any of the DC, he is harsh and shouty. But I know he loves them. He works hard, and is careful with money, we would not have our home without him, he works full time and then up until recently has been coming home and working on the house. All of our weekends were taken up working on the house. He does this for our family. His mother can be harsh and emotionally cold. He has a brother who is 14 months older than him but his parents always favoured the brother. He is musical but incredibly lazy, does nothing to help his mother now, everything is left to DH. All BIL does is get MIL to take them out to lunch etc and all the maintenance of MIL house is left to DH.

DH is old fashioned in some ways, he is only 37 but is very authoritarian in how he handles the kids. It is a busy house with the 4 of them but he seems to want to run the house like an army, everything has to be done as soon as he says so. A few weeks ago he was doing some finishing touches to the house, it was the weekend and his shed where all the tools are kept was in a big mess from where he just put stuff away in there after working on the house. He got all the kids to empty the shed for him. His reasoning was it is something they can help with whilst he is doing other work, otherwise he would have to do it like he does everything else. He then put it all away in the right place. I can see his point, the kids just play or watch tv so why shouldn’t they help out. It’s the way he goes about it though, he doesn’t ask them nicely to help, he tells them and makes it sound like an awful chore. I think he feels really hard done by.

I also work full time but due to the covid situation I am working from home whilst trying to home educate the 4 DC, it’s not easy. DH is still going into work everyday. I have kept it all quite relaxed at home, things are strange enough for DC without adding to their stress forcing them to sit for hours and do extra work. I have to go into work 2 days next week so DH will be staying home with DC, DC 1&2 are dreading it. DH has already said it will be different when he is home.

@stronger76 that sounds awful, 3 years! Glad you are in a better place now.

It isn't too long for your dc to be able to leave home and youmay regret how they feel about their childhood.

Do your dc get on with their father? Have they ever wanted to live with him?

You mention that you tried to end the relationship many times prior to marriage so it suggests that your H isn't going to change as seems to have an issue with control. Does he pretend to be kind to the children when others around?

There will be ways to run your own house, it maybe tricky financially but it will be do'able. Have you explored mortgage raising capabilities? Are there other assets like a pension as this could offset the equity and maybe enable you to receive more.

Leaving will mean planning so start the work and step by step you will get there.

You need to follow through with leaving him. The CMS will make him pay his share for the kids.

@Techway DD1 does not go to her father anymore, she felt left out and ignore there so as soon as she turned 12 she made the decision to stop going. DS1 usually sees their father regularly but isn't at the moment due t the virus. He has the option to go and live there but has chosen to stay at home. He doesn't really pretend to be different with the kids when other people are around, he is a little less full on but even his friends have commented in the past about how he is with them. I'm in my mid 30's so don't have much of a pension yet, 4 lots of time off to raise babies has taken it's toll.

I could buy a 2 bed flat and sleep in the living room, that is something I am exploring.

I just can't see myself going through with it though. There are good times too.

Indeed look into buying that two bedroom flat.

Those good times are likely to be solely on his terms, what you could also be describing with that is the "nice" part of the abuse cycle. The nice/nasty cycle of abuse is a continuous one.

Like practically all abusers, yours is refusing to leave too. I would seek legal advice re obtaining both non molestation and occupation orders. The emotional harm being done to your children in they seeing this is incalculable and will likely manifest itself further in their own relationships as adults.

It sounds like your children have always come second, leave and put them first for once.

@AttilaTheMeerkat oh my gosh, that's true, the good times are only when we are doing what he wants us to do. He is going to make my life so difficult if I leave.

I wish he was reasonable, we could sit down and talk it through, but he won't, he is resentful and angry.

Why fixate on buying a place straightaway? You could rent somewhere, while looking into shared ownership and various options for housing over the longer term. Home ownership isn't the be all and end all, and in the next couple of years who knows what will happen to the housing market due to the economic effects of Covid.

OP take it from some one who’s been there - you really need to start taking responsibility for your own shit and stop drifting.

I guarantee you that if you leave and are happy - your kids will be too. But I think your a long way off leaving as you don’t actually know what a healthy relationship looks like.

I'm in exactly the same situation as you. Only
our home has no equity, I earn minimum wage and have nowhere to go. I will have to claim UC which will take ages to process.
If my circumstances were like yours I would leave tomorrow!
Just saying! You know you have to get out, it's soul destroying for all of you.
I have to wait and save and then wait for a rental to come up in my area.

@category12 that's a good point but if I rent I will end up spending all of the capital on rent and that is the DC inheritance.

@Summersunandoranges I left last year, I moved out with the DC into rented accommodation. DH was angry, but asked me to go to counselling with him which I did. he seemed to wake up to his behaviour and change but over the last 6 months he has slowly settled back in to his old ways.