Adult DS becoming confrontational and potentially violent

[fadedviolets]

I do need advice, but please don’t be annoyed if I don’t do exactly what people suggest. I really need to make sure that I get through this with minimal impact to everybody concerned.

DS(21) has autism. He is fairly high-functioning insofar as he has no input from outside agencies and he doesn’t claim any disability related benefits, although this is mostly because he doesn’t accept his diagnosis - at most, he accepts he has ‘some Asperger traits’ but he doesn’t accept that in fact his life is seriously compromised by his disability. He has grandiose ideas (to study medicine, to work abroad) but they have no basis in reality - he thinks saying things in a determined tone is enough.

He left school in 2016 with three A levels, but didn’t get brilliant grades and became notably withdrawn and depressed afterwards. He was definitely quirky at school but he did have friends and seemed mostly okay. I have wondered if perhaps I over encouraged him, and gave him an inflated sense of his own importance. It’s hard to say. Either way, he didn’t do much after leaving school. He did have a couple of jobs but they inevitably didn’t work out. He then got onto a course in 2018 which had work experience and gave him a moderate sum of money. He was asked to leave that at the end of last year, and since then has done NOTHING bar have one job that lasted two weeks.

He stays in bed until noon, then gets up, methodically cleans his teeth and washes his face (but doesn’t shower regularly) and watches Netflix. Sometimes he would go to the gym. His hair grew wild and bushy.

I’ve honestly tried to be supportive, put him on my car insurance so he could get to job interviews, helped with claiming JSA (he can’t claim it now as he left his last job) paid for a haircut (relief I did it just before lockdown) and I do give him money but he squanders it. I know that’s unfair really but he does, he buys Niquitin (he doesn’t even smoke) and before lockdown would for example buy two bus tickets rather than a day one so end up spending £10 instead of £3.

Anyway, on Friday, he gave me something to look after () and I was in my bedroom at the time. My job recently disappeared due to coronavirus but I did get a large payoff. I have put this in an ISA and I haven’t told DS, possibly unfairly but anyway. I am doing freelance work for a company I used to work for and it is reasonably well paid, but very intricate and tricky to do from home. I have converted my bedroom into a quiet space to do this. I put the thing ds gave me to one side and then I fell asleep and I couldn’t remember for the life of me where to put it. To be fair to him ds wasn’t angry but he did literally turn my room upside down hunting for it. I begged him to stop but it was as if he couldn’t hear me - he very probably couldn’t as when he fixates on one thing everything else does fall by the wayside but even so it was absolutely horrible having your adult son rifle through underwear and jewellery box and perfume and cosmetics. (It eventually turned up in my hair straighteners case, if anyone’s interested.)

Anyway, this will sound ridiculous but I’ve been silently fuming about that all day yesterday. It brought back a really uncomfortable memory of my dad deciding as a teenager that my bedroom was too messy and he took it upon himself to go in, make sticky labels entitled BRAS, KNICKERS and sort my underwear. I’m not suggesting for a moment my dad meant anything inappropriate towards me in doing so, but it was just really humiliating having it happen (both my parents had the attitude that ‘it’s not your room, it’s ours, because it’s our house.’) So that, combined with endless ‘MUUUUUM, MUUUM?’ ‘yes, dear?’ ‘I’ve ... decided I’m going to apply for jobs in India!’ while I’m trying to do fiddly, intricate work (and yes I HAVE asked him PLEASE not to interrupt me) I’ve been feeling thoroughly stressed and fed up with him.

Today he asked for my debit card to go to the shop with, and I said yes and asked him to pick up a drink I like. I added that there was only now £20 in the current account, which isn’t a problem as I will get paid for the work I’ve done tomorrow. DS pulled an incredibly sanctimonious face and loudly said ‘ER, do you think you could try to drink water? Your habit () is costing us a fortune.’

I was furious, and I won’t deny I snapped. He called me a ‘fucking cheeky git’ which HAS really annoyed me - it’s so disrespectful - and started bellowing. To be honest, I was finding it a bit intimidating and this is something we’ve spoken about before in calmer moments, about how he appears bloody scary when he’s angry and this is one of the reasons a few jobs haven’t worked out - and he came looming over me with his fist raised. Nothing happened but I was / am shaken.

I’m not sure what to do now. I do have an adult daughter I could stay with, but she’s a key worker and she has a fiancé and I don’t want to make things tense for them. I also have a partner, who would probably be pleased if I were to move in for a bit but I don’t know what I’d tell him and also it still seems a bit rude almost to plonk myself there.

I could possibly book a hotel or Airbnb normally but of course now I can’t.

So should I grit my teeth and see it out, move in with daughter or dp, or other option? As I’m feeling I just CAN’T stay.

What do you think would happen if you temporarily moved out? Would he understand the reasoning, and would he be able to look after the house? My concern is that as he seems to think your money is his, would he think you had given him the house to live in, and as he doesn’t realise he needs to wash would you come back to it being absolutely trashed?

Long term, I think you need to look at applying for benefits for him and getting him in a place of his own that he pays for, or you will end up supporting him for the rest of his life.

This is your home, you shouldn't be moving anywhere.

I would get him to pack his bags, even though he will likely have to go to a hostel.

I have a 10-year-old DS with autism. His dad, my ex-dp, was diagnosed with autism shortly after our son was.

The most important lesson I have learned on my journey to help my son is that ‘all behaviour is communication’.

My son is HFA, he is very verbal and very clever. But he doesn’t have the words to tell me how he feels. Like most neurodiverse people he ‘tells’ me how he’s feeling through his behaviour.

It sounds like your son is experiencing quite severe anxiety and is therefore trying to control his whole life, including you, in an attempt to alleviate his anxiety. Lots of people with autism, young and old, feel the need to control when afraid and anxious.

The violence and abuse you are experiencing is probably an autistic meltdown. These can happen due to anxiety, fear, overload, overwhelm, sensory overload, etc. It’s best to walk away and let the person work thru the meltdown them just quietly be there for them/with them once they’re out the other side. He doesn’t mean to harm you or scare you, he is experiencing internal trauma. It’s up to you to learn how to handle his meltdowns and help prevent them.

It also sounds like he is being very ‘demand avoidant’ another very typical autistic response to normal life requirements. For someone with autism who is demand avoidant even the smallest request can appear like a demand and cause them to shutdown in it, refuse to do it, even sometime become violent to escape the demand. One way to help get a demand avoidant person to carry out requests is to make them indirect. You’d say, for example, ‘I wonder if you’d benefit from a shower?’ or In wonder what it might be like for you if you had some money from benefits?’ Starting requests with ‘I wonder’ works wonders (pun intended )

Yes, he may be a 21 year adult but he is adult whose brain works very differently from yours and mine. Please don’t move out and leave him. Instead learn some more (I imagine you’ve already read loads about ASC) about techniques to help you and him live together more smoothly.

He needs you right now. This virus is scaring all of us, but it’s terrifying to people who cannot verbalise how scared they are.

Have you contacted social care to see under what conditions he would potentially be eligible for assisted accommodation? It might help to know if/when it could be an option and see about working towards that.

Thank you for your posts. It’s so true he didn’t choose autism - I need to keep reminding myself of this as it’s an ongoing battle not to see some behaviour as just designed to infuriate.

cranky, honestly, he isn’t eligible. He would cause chaos even if he was entitled and if he went, which he wouldn’t.

Does he understand that it's your money, not his - and as such saying that things cost 'us' a fortune is fundamentally wrong as he earns nothing and in fact, is 100% financially reliant upon you?

Would he be able to live independently?

OP, what an awful situation.

I think what is clear is at some point you are going to have to decide is he going to remain in your home financially supported by you forever?

I agree with @FizzyGreenWater.

Personally i dont think you should leave your home but i can see you wish to get away from him and his frankly very aggressive behaviour.

He does appear to feel he hasn't any responsibility or that any expectation can be made of him.

I also believe you should be looking into assisted living for him, before its too late.

Either way, you have my sincere sympathy. Awful situation for you to be in.

Just lost a long post, OP! Its a tricky situation to be in, and I've been in a similar one, not quite the same, but def. some similarities. And it was bloody hard, my health was going down the drain, I felt stressed and on edge in my own home, and in the end my DS had to leave. Only you know the best thing to do, as only you are in full possession of facts and feelings of the situation. I still would try for advice and resources - social services, autism charities, housing, etc, as he does sound like vulnerable young man, and he also has an 'official' diagnosis. Really feel for you. Sending hugs. PS A break at your b/fs might be the right thing, give you time and space for a while too ....

Thank you, for listening as much as anything else. Everything is calm now, he’s apologised, I’ve apologised, all is well, for now at any rate!

He should claim benefits even if his last job didn’t work out. That doesn’t automatically mean he isn’t entitled. He will probably have to claim UC unless he has paid sufficient NI, in which case he can claim jsa.

This is emotionally exhausting and v fraught for you both.

It seems that he has an official diagnosis but zero treatment/support/adaptations in place.

Expectations are also not being managed. By either of you.

This set up is just going to keep failing. He is at risk of developing chronic MH issues from the stress of failure and then adding in inappropriate coping mechanisms (anger, addiction).

How much do you know about autism and how much have you built in adaptations to your lives?

He needs his denial to his diagnosis challenged so that he can look at options to make his life (and therefore your life) less stressful and more fulfilling.

I think Gutterton makes a lot of hard-hitting, but v insightful points.

Hopefully you can enjoy this period of calm, but you know it won’t last right?

I really think it will be valuable for both of you for you to reach out to any help or services as well that may be available. Mental health services is another possibility in addition to the ones I mentioned above. If push came to shove I’m thinking taking legal advice, MP, etc.

If I we’re you I’d try everything, there may be a lot of closed doors (that’s life unfortunately) but you never know you may hit gold.

Perhaps this is not your breaking point yet, but I have a strong suspicion it will be coming along anytime soon. Its not a great time, re Coronavirus, to get things moving, but you can make a start. Good luck.

Why have you not applied for PIP? He would also surely be eligible for ESA whether he quit his last job or not. He lost it due to his disability right? Have you applied to become his appointee?

Has he ever has an SS assessment of need? If not, why not?

When was he diagnosed? It sounds as if he’s living with nothing in place at all in terms of support and that needs to be addressed. Obviously it will take a while now due to the current crisis.

Can he be left alone if you move out? Does he understand social distancing? Obviously he is not getting the hand washing. Might it be worthwhile your partner moving in with you to support you with him, rather than leaving a vulnerable person alone?

I'm glad it's all calmed down.

But, as an aside and from someone who works in a shop, PLEASE don't send someone shopping who doesn't wash their hands. For both your sakes.

Just one more thing, you do know with certain kinds of autism (PDA for example), the person with autism doesn’t recognise authority in the same way, often in any way? The fact it’s your money, your home, is not something they recognise. Your DS may quite Entitled to tell you what to do, but at the same time not accept any rules or instructions from you! I don’t know if that’s your experience or not. But if it is, it can be v frustrating and anger-making. BTW what’s in your ISA account or bank account is not really his business in any way.

I think one of the difficulties with high functioning autism, is that it’s not always obvious unless you are living with them, in which case the difficulties (rigidity/agitation/control) become apparent pretty quickly.

I’m sure your son has some lovely sides, but living with him in the way you are I suspect hard to see, with all the turbulence. That was part of my experience anyway. As so many PPs have said I hope you get the help and changes you need.

Please apply for PIP on his behalf .

You can have autism.

You can be an abusive asshole.

And, shocking to many, you can have autism AND be an abusive asshole.

The grandiosity of his plans and his escalating violent tendencies make me think he may need to be re-evaluated for psychosis or personality disorders once quarantine is lifted. This is not "normal" autism behavior for someone high functioning enough to have any hope of achieving independence. He needs to either face reality and seek benefits because he's incapable of controlling himself and his own behavior, or take some accountability.

Holding people with ASDs totally blameless for their actions isn't the way to find acceptance for them. It's just not. I'm clinically diagnosed with an ASD myself, so I'm speaking from personal experience as well as the experience of many friends with ASDs.

I agree womb 100%.

However in this situation it’s not clear if the v basic levels of support and understanding are in place. I would imagine that such an unstructured, unbounderied, unrealistic environment would be v challenging.

As they say on here - might explain it - doesn’t excuse it.

I’m really glad it’s calmed down for you too.

Please though look to the future when this virus has all calmed down. The ultimate goal is one day he is living somewhere perfect for him and that you get your peace back you’ve rightfully earned over the years- please get the ball rolling for that. I know it’s hard I really do but use this as a motive to have him happily settled elsewhere in the next 2-3 years? It’ll only get harder and harder long term to sort this out.

I think it does depend what kind of autism though Womb, as some aspects are v hard to “normalise” including rigidity and being easily agitated. The point I was making is that it can look like “asshole” behaviour, when it isn’t, and the person appearing to behave badly is struggling in some way as well eg the need for control, hidden anxiety. And can be remorseful or apologetic once they realise they’ve overstepped the mark, not always though.

However I do agree some clear boundaries would help up to a point and certain behaviours should be made clear that they won’t be tolerated.

The key to me though is probably changed or adapted circumstances, which it looks like OP could get some help for. Magic I think has a positive and hopefully realistic idea for the future.

I shall bow out now, and anyway OP has not been back.

People whose rigidity and easy agitation is impacting their loved ones, if they are adults, have a responsibility to those loved ones to pursue therapies and coping strategies that will help them make better behavioral choices in the future.

Someone who's actively working on integrating into society and learning social rules looks very different than someone who's taking the piss, refusing to admit they have a problem while hoping others will pick up the broken pieces they're leaving behind. If you insist you don't have a problem, then you need to adhere to the standards of humans without a problem.

This son wants to play it both ways: to be treated as an autistic person when he's behaving poorly, and at all other times like he's got no mental health issues or developmental disorders. Well, you don't get to do that. You can either recognize your differences and work to put yourself in line with the behavior expected of you and owed by you to your loved ones and society (and, in turn, expect some leeway people wouldn't give to someone without autism), or go on saying you're not different but take it on the chin when people notice the ways you're not living up to expectations.

Are there any local organisations that can help? For instance, my brother is supported by a local autism charity which provides a support worker. They normally meet up and go to do social things once a week, and the charity also runs various clubs and meet-ups for people with autism. They also support the family - for instance, they helped my mum to do a PIP application for my brother, making sure she got all the right buzzwords and phrases in there. Might be worth a google to see what’s available in your area. They may be easier to access than NHS help or PIP, and be able to offer you both some advice on useful next steps.

OP Google supported living for adults with autism, there is quite a lot out there and there are companies that specialise in providing the support and any care that is necessary to help them live an independent life. It really isn’t too difficult to get help and they will even help your son apply for the necessary benefits.

My best friend lives with her ASD son (26). There is NOTHING in the way of support available. Literally nothing. Because he lives at home and she therefore 'cares' for him, there are no bodies who are interested. It may be different in cities (we are very rural), but she is often at her wit's end, having to go everywhere with a full grown adult bloke in tow, but there's nothing else to do. He can't work, he has a couple of voluntary jobs but that's all.

So everyone saying that OP should get help, that there is support and help etc etc - there often isn't. And what there is depends on where you are and what your situation is. My friend would literally have to throw her son out into the street (which she never would) in order for him to access one ounce of help - and that would take months and months to come through.