So fed up with husband not pulling his weight

[HappyGoLuckyHippo]

Apologies for insanely long post but just need some advice, thoughts or kick up the bum, whatever’s going!
I’m struggling with marriage at the moment.
Background: My now husband moved straight from his parents into renting with me about ten years ago. He was never great with anything practical around the house as his parents (SAHM and handy father) had never asked anything of him.
He would sometimes wash up, hoover, shop and we got along ok as there weren’t that many things to be done. Anything “non-routine” e.g insurance, dentist appts, buying things for the house, looking into moving flats, planning holidays, fell to me.
We have since grown up a bit (at least in years!) and now have two under two. He loves and dotes on them and will look after them (only one at a time at the moment though) but nothing has changed around the house. I am still the one doing all the non-routine things which now includes child things (nursery, appts, car seat comparison, buying clothes) and planning for the future in terms of savings. I also do the bulk of the housework. Some of that is fine - I’m on mat leave and have more time around the house to do them (he works 3x 12 hour shifts a week).
Still, I am very resentful of being the one carrying all the mental load in the relationship which now includes the children. I have brought it up lots of times but nothing has changed. I don’t think he really “gets it” as he has never had to think like that.
Additionally, I have always felt that there is some sort of ‘barrier’ to him changing - sometimes I’ve wondered re social communication difficulties (I am trained and work in this area so not just a random statement!) or, to be honest, mild learning difficulties. It’s things like him not being able to change how he does things even when told and explained many times why it should be done a certain way - for instance needing to strap the children tightly into the car seats for it to be safe, or a certain programme on the washing machine only being able to handle a half load of clothes. There are many many many things like these, some important, some less so as I do often want things done the ‘right’ (i.e “my”) way as well, I’ll absolutely admit that! However, I am so frustrated by this and he obviously feels I am nagging him. Lately, anyhting he does do (e.g today I asked him to wrap three small presents for the neighbours as I have a chest infection) makes him “stressed” and grumpy.
It takes him so so long to do any task as well, with no “second gear”, for instance when he very occasionally makes dinner (which is great and he often makes a nice meal) he very careful prep, no multitasking (e.g no chopping carrots while the water is heating), and him standing beside the pot for the duration of the cooking time even when nothing needs done while I’m wrestling the two (hungry) little ones.
When watching (one of) the children, nothing else is done. I often manage to juggle the two of them and get some things done around the house, maybe a load of washing, some bits of tidying and the washing up for instance. He sees it as “I couldn’t because I was looking after the baby”. However, he always finds time to sit on the couch and watch TV or go on his phone even if he is looking after a child. This really really really gets me down and our house is always such a tip. He is also extremely quick to go for a “lie down” in bed for an hour or more without checking if he’s needed.
Social communication wise, he is extremely poor at talking about emotions and can just about manage ‘happy’ and ‘grumpy’ although often argues that “nothing’s wrong” when he is clearly unhappy. Discussing any relationship issues with him is met by him throwing the same thing back at me (Me “I feel that you don’t always x”, Him: “Well you don’t x either you know!”) in a way that always escalates it to a fight. He says he has no concerns whatsoever about the relationship and nothing he wants me to change (this is consistent over time), so I really struggle to get anywhere. I know for a fact I’m not perfect either!
I feel ok about our relationship some of the time - he really isn’t a bad person, just frustrating - other times I wish he lived elsewhere as his presence just frustrates me.
Lastly, leaving him would mean leaving my only social support network (his family) as my family are in a different country and no way would he let me take the children abroad to live (understandably from his pov). I also have no really close friends outside of his family.
I’m just so lost and feel like there may not be any fix to this. Any thoughts?

So he was crap before kids and you thought something would radically change when baby 1 came along? When it didn’t you thought maybe baby 2 would you be the catalyst?!

@NeedAnExpert Yes, that has definitely crossed my mind in hindsight and I agree. I don't think things were as obvious before the kids (more niggles than problems) and less needing done around the house etc as it were. Thinking about it things have definitely deteriorated the last few months.

I think that's a bit unfair need. You don't expect people to change but things pop up as you live out your lives and you notice that they're not pulling their weight for example. Unfortunately this is extremely common between men and women. In my experience it is because a lot of women want things done sooner than the men. Not making excuses but for example if I leave my OH to it for a week he won't turn into a dribbling slob, he just does the dishwasher a little later than if I'd like. I can either deal with this and work on how I cope with that or leave him and find someone that has exactly the same preferences as me. Focus on the good parts of him and of course let him know that you are discontent with the split between the two of you . X

This is why there's a lot of 'LTB' on dating/Relationship threads whilst the person is still dating a fundamentally lazy, inconsiderate and sexist man. Because they never change (unless they want to, which is almost never). There are 1950s throwbacks, apologists and enablers who tell the woman to train the man, make lists, rotas, police the man like a child. But they don't change.

Funny, he has 'mild learning difficulties' but not when it comes to work, eh? Bet he doesn't get grumpy and 'stressed' when told to do stuff at work.

That's because he doesn't. He has learned incompetence. He has been enabled all his life. Of course he doesn't want anything to change.

This is a person who puts his own children at risk by not securing them properly in the car. Hey, then he won't have to take the two of them anywhere on his own! Result! Fuck up the laundry, result!, another tax he's exempted from. Take forever cooking dinner, then you don't have to do it as often as she'll want it done in time to suit those pesky hungry kids. Plenty of time to doss on the phone, though.

Hi OP,
I really feel for you as your story somewhat mirrors mine. I am now 20 years into the relationship, 13 years of marriage and 10 years of children. It has only changed for the worse.
I absolutely cannot stand the self-righteousness of ‘well, what did you expect?’ Or ‘why did you have children with this man?’. We fucking HOPED it would get better. We were wrong. That doesn’t make us idiots or unworthy of advice and support.
I’m ending the marriage in the new year. Just need to get through the holiday and get myself more in the mindset practically.

The only advice and support is to really leave them, though, because people like this don't get better because fundamentally, they believe they are the top dog in everything and everyone else is there to enable them.

I'm with you parrot and op. I'm 20 years in and 2 kids and sick of him not stepping up. When I look back over the years the signs were there but in isolation they didnt mean much . Now I put it all together it seems obvious. It's mainly been the last 6 years with the kids that have got me so mad and partly that's because I've changed. I was happy being in charge and organising everything and he was happy as a passenger. Now we have 2 kids and I work 60 hours a week I need a partner not a passenger. So I would never have had this realisation before kids. Sometimes its seeing people in different situations that causes you to change how you feel about them and you could never have seen that coming until you did new stuff ie have a family. My husband was good with baby number 1 but useless with multitasking since number 2. But I've changed too as I want more help with 2. I look back on our first week together and the state he was living in and wander why didnt I see it then? But I didnt have the life experience to know what I was looking at.

Men in general, I've found, don't do well with multitasking. Actually, neither do women, but we feel forced to. So that might explain why he feels can only safely watch one child or one pot at a time.

The going for a nap without checking with you first is unacceptable, and that happened in my house as well. It wasn't just here and there, occasionally, though, it was ALL THE TIME. I would suggest nipping that in the bud, or he will assume he can do it whenever he wants, and the frequency will (based on my experience) escalate.

Mine came from both of us having lived in our own apartments and both of us having young nieces and nephews. In my case, he always claimed that he had vastly more experience with living independently and taking care of little ones, and would throw that in my face. Of course it wasn't true, as I am older than him. Any time I disagreed with his way of doing things with our kids, it was "I had little nieces and nephews; I know what I'm doing", as if uncle experience trumped my input.

He also knew well more than me (in his mind) everything there was to know about keeping an apartment, a car, a lawn, minor repairs, despite me having experience in all those areas. Drove me nuts. When I pointed out (because he would not read directions and did not want my help) that he had just installed the screen door backwards and that is why the knob was on the wrong side, I got shouted at. I got shouted at a LOT, and he would always claim he wasn't mad at at ME, but that atmosphere was quite scary for me never mind the kids.

Whenever I would bring up that his behavior (and that included much more than what l've said here) was making me upset, and that I was sure there were things about me as well that he didn't like, he would always say everything was fine, he was very happy with his life and with me, including and up to the point where I told him I wanted a divorce. He was in such denial!

Not sure if any of this is relevant to your situation, but yes, you need to nip this stuff in the bud if possible, or find out, like me, that the bad greatly outweighed the good, and he needs to be an XH.

I decided I'd put up with enough, and dreaded the idea of retiring with him.

It doesn't sound like your marriage is off the rails yet; but do insist on continuing to communicate your needs to him without him getting grumpy.

I think having kids is a game changer. You have to step it up a notch and often men don’t bother.
I had one of these too. Found him on day one of bringing baby home filling sterilised bottles from the hot tap instead of boiled water. It didn’t really get any better from there. We are now divorced.

Thanks for thoughts and perspectives everybody.
@Newbie7077 thank you for the positive slant and yes there are positive things.

@FruitcakeOfHate Agree regarding the learning difficulties thoughts. He manages ok at work, although does get very stressed out there as well, especially just now due to circumstances in the workplace. Just wish he would come home with a big smile happy to see us rather than a grunt and "I'm going to bed" after I've been at home for 12 hours. And then refuse to talk about it.
Regarding the learned incompetence - there is a bit of a point there but he believes that he is "doing loads" and I feel this comes from never ever experiencing running a household.
I've had words MANY times about the car seat now (including youtube videos of crashes etc) and it seems to be making a difference. He is very aware that I'm always glancing to check the straps though...
And yes I have definitely considered leaving.

@parrotonmyshoulder Big big hugs to you and I hope you feel much better after you are away from him. Is your husband aware that things are coming to an end at all?

@Stuffedcrust55 your "happy to be organising" vs "passenger" has struck such a chord with me. I still wouldn't mind too much if I didn't have the added pressure of the little ones.

Will check back again as Christmas stuff is calling!

He sounds thick as shit. And his parents knew it.

What does he do for a living?

@Ihavehadenoughalready that sounds absolutely infuriating!! I so relate to the "everything is fine" stance, which means you never have a chance to talk things through. Sounds like you made the right decision for you.

@MitziK Ironically he is in a really high stress client facing care sector job... And he's really good at it.
His family (large extended family as well) worship the ground he walks on which has made me doubt myself at times.

Honestly, thanks so much for all your input, good and bad, just good to hear I'm not mad to be annoyed at least. I'm sorry to hear so many others are/were in similar positions!

Similar here. It hit home when we had the kids and wasn’t noticeable before. Two of our kids have disabilities and because I’ve been at home everything has fallen to me. I never expected loads but support would be nice like taking an interest in their therapy but he thinks he does loads. But he picks the bits he likes for instance hanging out the odd bit of washing. He can then say he’s helped. We’ve had many conversations over the years about and I’ve given up. He’s not interested enough to be bothered. I’m also going back to work next year after 10 years out so I imagine my plate will be even fuller as he’ll expect me to do the same but with a job. I resent him hugely.

You need to sit down and really talk to him and try and resolve it. I’m not saying it will make an difference but it is worth a try.

My ex was like this. He was older than me slightly and had lived independently. He was also in a professional job. However at home he was absolutely bone idle and I just got worn out. I had to sort out all bills/admin, holidays, every trip out, organise all events. In addition to my longer hours job than his I also had to cook, clean, shop, wash, iron. All while he sat on his games console like a lazy fucking whale. He never ever put his clothes in the laundry basket, just on the floor by the bed. He bought a coffee maker for the bedroom that spat hot sticky, sweet coffee everywhere because he was too idle to go downstairs and make a drink in a morning. He never once cleaned it, it stank.
I used to get up early hours to take HIS parents (who I hated) to catch coaches/trains etc when they were going away because he couldn’t be arsed.
If I confronted him I’d get gaslighted and it was all my fault or I was told not to do it!!! I spent so much time in tears and exhausted. He used to tell me to give him jobs to do when I was at work. The last time I did it he washed my dry clean only suit jacket in the machine, took it out of the washer and left it screwed in a ball on the floor upstairs. I just looked at it and thought ‘that’s what he thinks of me’. He promised to change of course as I was moving out. Far too late by then, I was so disgusted with him all the love had died. He was a lazy pig. I’ve never looked back.

This is why I am refusing point blank to have kids with my partner until he learns to remember the occasional jobs like insurance etc and does cleaning around the house without being told to. Currently he doesn't remember anything, and he only remembers to do two of 'his' jobs which is cleaning the dishes and emptying the bins (he only does the kitchen one, the bathroom ones don't exist). I have tried writing down lists of what needs done, given him his own jobs etc. Doesn't work.

So I withhold children until he does. Doesn't bother me, I'm not that keen anyway and certainly not by myself. He knows this too, so it's up to him to change. He might think I'll change my mind but it won't happen.

Dunno what to suggest for you though. Other than leaving him, best you can do is go on holiday for a week and leave him to it. Once he's by himself he will either have to sink or swim. I think he'll just get his family to do it though.

Sounds like learnt behaviour. You need to stop doing stuff for him and make him grow up. Sounds like he's been pandered too and knows how to take advantage when he can. He doesn't sound like he's got learning difficulties if he can hold down a high stress job.

He has a good skilled job so you saying learning difficulties is an attempt to explain away rather than admit he’s a bone idle selfish git at home. How can he not take on board the importance of strapping the DC in? Sounds like he’s opting out, expects you to carry the load, is there a positive to staying with this useless lump?

Lazy bastard. Simple as that

@ChristmasSweet oooh yes, bins here as well! I put my foot down (or had a mini breakdown...) and said I am NOT emptying the kitchen bin anymore as I hate doing it, and he has actually taken this on board and agrees this is his job now! He has also taken it on himself to put the bin out on bin day! Small victories!
But yeah, apparently you only need to do the dishes, bins, load the washing machine and put it on (but not hang, fold or put away) and occasionally clear the coffee table for all the housework to be done! Somebody else just comes and magically sorts the rest, grrrr.
Bit late for me to withhold children but good on you!

@Mummyshark2018 good call on not pandering. I've done the "not really washing his clothes" thing and he will eventually do it but often hangs only what he needs for the next day and leaves the rest in the machine. Cue me dumping his laundry on the floor to do another load the next day. He often proceeds to eventually putting the wet pile back in the machine because it's in his way.
To be fair, he occasionally does hang clothes up...
As for other stuff, he'll very rarely get to the stage where it's annoying him so I end up doing it, or asking him to do it with him agreeing but never actually DOING it.

This is turning into a rant but his favourite argument is "you have no idea how much time I spend thinking about you and the children". How does that offer me any practical help?

@JKScot4 I would agree he probably could if he decided to. I suppose that's what's so frustrating. He is pretty clueless about house stuff and if left to do it would make such a bad job and get so stressed that it would end up being more work for me

Oopsposted too soon by accident....

I would dread leaving the insurance stuff to him as he'd end up getting us a deal without what we need for double the price and I'd be so angry!

@rumred Noted! Short and simple!

"you have no idea how much time I spend thinking about you and the children".
That’s hilarious 🤣🤣
When he’s looking for his tea or clean socks just tell him you were too busy ‘thinking about him’ what a tube!

@JKScot4 I might try that one.

Honestly, reading your comment about the insurance, all I can say is, so what if he does?

I think you need to step back hand over stuff and forget it. If he gets rubbish deals then what does it actually matter? As long as you are insured. And why do you even need to look up how much it costs? What concern is it if yours if he is the purchaser? Why do you feel you need to check up on him? Does he ever check up on you?

I think this is where you need to surrender the mental load as well as the control.

You have my sympathy. You could have been writing about my STBXH. (Name change as some details may be identifying when combined with other threads and we've not told anyone yet)

These things creep on on you, well they did in my case. What seemed a fair division of labour when it was just the two of us became more and more a case of me doing nearly everything. When we had children, I started doing more and he didn't. That simple. Hindsight is a wonderful thing but how can we know that a man won't take on more of the load when children come along? If the load is fairly evenly balanced before? In my case I can see it with hindsight as I had more of the mental load, pre-children, and he had more of the physical load. But at the time I thought that was largely a practical divide as I was quite ill. But he hasn't even increased his share of the physical load post-children. He is very good st saying all the right things - we talked about all this stuff before having children, a lot!! But Ive learnt that he always says what he thinks I want to hear, not thinking about the consequences of what will happen when I find out the truth/his actions clash with his words.

These issues have caused a lot of strife in my marriage. I can also identify with the communication issues you describe! Ultimately, my husband has just turned out to be/into a selfish liar. His "inability" to take on more of the load reflects the fact that deep down he wants to keep his life the way it was pre-children but also wants to be a father. He cannot see how incompatible those two things are. It's escalated to lies, financial abuse, etc. So it's over.

That was a lot about me, I'm sorry. But I wanted to show you're not alone and not to blame for not spotting this in your partner. If you trust someone and you are able to adjust to the changes/additions that children bring to life admin and housework, then why would you assume he won't be able to? You have every right to be angry and resentful. Perhaps counselling would help? Set some clear boundaries for him about what you need?

I hope you find a way forward.