How long before dating becomes a relationship?

[TheCatWithTheHat]

Just to set the scene, I'm a 45 year old guy who came out of an 8 year relationship earlier this year so am a bit rusty with dating. My previous long term relationships happened pretty quickly - we became an item after just a few dates, so maybe a few weeks to a month before we had the exclusive chat.

However I recently met someone online, and we've been dating for about 3 months now. We've both got busy jobs, so it's not always easy to meet that often, and have had about 10 dates in that time, although a couple of those involved her staying over at mine. We've also not slept together yet, as she's very shy and nervous about that, but we've got very close last time we saw each other and she did make a comment that once she sleeps with a guy it usually ends up as a relationship.

She is taking things very slowly though, and has said she doesn't want to put a label on things yet, although she does often talk and joke about stuff involving us in the future and refers to us as dating. I know she also talks about me to her parents, and best friends and as far as I know she isn't dating anyone else.

However, I'm starting to feel that after this amount of time, we should be discussing being exclusive and making it a little more official. I feel a bit uneasy at times as I really like her, but sometimes worry why she's being a bit reluctant to "put a label" on us.

So I just wanted to get some views of whether 3 months is still very early to expect this (I admit my views could be skewed by my limited experience), or is it reasonable to expect a little more commitment after this length of time? Or should I just stop worrying about any labels, and just accept that if she's happy to continue dating it's all good?

To me she is hinting at you that she wants you to tell her where you stand. Her saying she 'normally ends up in a relationship after sex' (yeah well I should friggin hope so after three months!) Is her saying 'I don't want to sleep with you until I know where I stand because i want sex to leas to relationships, but sometimes it doesnt'. Make your intentions clear: 'I like you and I want you to be my girlfriend'. Corny, but the best way forwards.

The only other explanation would be that she is hesitant because she isn't sure if she is that into you. And after 3 months, she really should know if she can see a relationship with you or not.

So lay your cards on the table and let the chips fall where they may.

Pinkbonbon is spot on!

Yes pinkbonbon is totally spot on.

This is lovely actually, you both clearly want to be in a relationship, but she needs the reassurance from you before she will 100% commit.

Have you met any of her friends? I suggest you tell her how you feel. She may well be being cautious, she may also be keeping her options open.

I’ve not met any of her friends yet, although I know she has been talking about me with some of them. From what I know of her, she’s quite cautious and admits she has a tendency to run when pressured, so I’ve been taking it slowly and giving her space, which has also caused problems in itself as she thought I didn’t fancy her.

I do worry she’s keeping her options open but I’m pretty sure she’s not dating anyone else - although that is a slight concern.

She has also had a lot of work pressure and stress recently that hasn’t helped matters so I haven’t seen her for over a week now, however we’re meeting again later this week so hopefully things will be clearer soon.

There is no way I'd consider a relationship with anyone until we'd had sex a few times. I would need to make sure he wasn't an idiot who thinks what you see in porn is real sex.

A further update on this (apologies for the long post), and I'd really appreciate any advice on what to do next as I'm getting quite anxious and confused about this now.

We met up a couple of days ago - she had offered to buy me dinner, and I had suggested doing something the following day (I assumed she would stay over, which she had done the last couple of times she visited) as I had the day off work. She was a bit vague on plans for the following day, which was unusual but I didn't push it, and figured I'd see how things went on the dinner date.

She turned up, and almost immediately said she was worried about the two of us, as she's not felt herself for the last few weeks - mostly because of something at work she's dealing with that is causing her a lot of stress, and has been ongoing for a couple of years. She also hates Christmas, and has really been struggling with work this month and dreads going in. She just wants to hide away at home, and doesn't feel sociable at all, and she's worried she won't be fun to date and she wouldn't mind if I walked away and found someone else.

I replied that I had no interest in dating anyone else, and that I really like her and want to be there for her, and do my best to make things work. We went for dinner, and then back to mine for a bottle of wine and we chatted until the early hours. It was lovely - she was very affectionate, holding my hands, hugging, kissing and we just chatted about random stuff mostly.

She did say a couple of things that stood out though. Since we first met, she's been clear that she wants to settle down, get married and have kids - which I've said is my goal too. However she's also admitted the thought of this really scares her, and she wants someone to convince her to do it. She also hinted that her trust issues come from a previous relationship - I'm guessing possibly someone who was aggressive, as she was worried I would get angry with her for suggesting she might not be in a good place to date. She's not very emotional usually, but cried for the first time in a year apparently as she said I was being so nice and understanding.

She also said I was unique amongst the guys she's dated in that I want exactly the same things as she does, and she doesn't feel she needs to convince me. She also mentioned that she always takes a long while to feel comfortable enough to sleep with someone, and she's just about at that point with me now.

She didn't feel comfortable staying the night so she went back to hers in the early hours of the morning, but we agreed to meet the following day - however when I spoke to her the next day to confirm what time to meet, she had changed her mind and said she needed time to process what we'd spoken about.

I really like her, so don't want her to throw this away but am not sure how to deal with this. I sent her a fairly long email saying how I feel about her, and that I'm willing to give her time and space but that I don't want her to throw us away just because her job is stressing her out.

It seems that she may be depressed, which is understandable given her work situation - but other than just telling her I'm here for her, and giving her space I'm not sure what else I can do? And I'm scared of losing someone I really like because of something out of my control.

She sounds flipping hard work!

Have you been to her home?

Met any family?

Are you sure she’s single?

Sounds as if she is depressed and suffers mental health issues. One of my friends is in a similar position. She wants the whole marriage and kids things but it scared that if she lets someone in they will eventually be scared off by her mental and other health issues. I can only suggest if you think she is worth the wait that you reassure and just be there for her.

She is hard work, but also by far the nicest girl, and best connection I've had in a long time so I think she's worth it. But I probably need to set a deadline in my own mind for how long to give it - although the thought of walking away at this point is really hard.

I've not been to her home or met any family yet - although she's very nervous/cautious about safety, and was (half) joking about me being able to murder her if I had her address. I'm sure she's single, and also pretty sure she's not dating anyone else.

I know she's told her best friend about me, as she sent screenshots of a conversation with her friend referring to me as "your guy" and screenshots of something funny she found about me online. She's said she talks to her mum about me too, and also mentioned meeting her friends for the first time last night, and whether I'd want to introduce her to my friends.

Thanks @dramaqueenforlife - that's what I'm starting to think too. It does sound very similar to your friend. I've suffered from depression too previously, and know how easy it is to push people away who care for you.

Seems slow ... we are a little older but after one date were desperate to see each other again, after a month I would happily move in except boring life issues and geography prevent it. I definitely think you do know! I dated maybe a dozen or more men prior to meeting my now partner and felt like I was interviewing them, they were nice enough but ... Love swoops you off your feet, it keeps you awake at 1am (actually I'm an insomniac), it's painful being apart ... I would seriously evaluate what you really feel because 3 months seems a long time to still not really know where it's going - by contrast I'm job hunting there!

@lifeisgoodagain - I know what you mean, and I feel that about her. I knew after our first date that I could see myself with her long term. She also mentions things about us having a life together (family, moving elsewhere) so I think she might feel that too.

I just have to be patient as she admits she has issues opening up to people, and also this work thing is causing her a lot of stress and getting in the way of life.

It's been a day now since I emailed her with what I feel, and the last reply I had was her saying she's thinking about it yesterday afternoon. It's tearing me up not knowing what she wants, and also knowing that it isn't me that's the issue but something out of my control.

Oh god bin her and move on

If this was the other way round this thread would be full of 'he's married'. Or 'he's not into you'

In your 40s 3 months is a long time to wait for sex, most people know what they want and what they will tolerate.

I really wouldn't be wasting my time

She sounds very similar to me.

She needs time, but you shouldn’t feel obliged to do that if it doesn’t work for you.

My gut instinct is to walk away. It really does sound like she's leading you on and/or keeping you dangling to be honest. I've never really understood this sort of uncertainty. She either likes you or she doesn't. We have all been hurt in the past but its not your fault or your problem if she has issues - its up to her to work through them. In fact, its unfair that she is going online looking for a relationship when she's clearly not ready.

She will continue to mess you around forever and a day. She needs to sort herself out before dragging someone else into her life to pull down with her.

Move on

I wonder if shes married??

After 3 months you'd want to see if the connection is good during sex too. Dont have to marry someone you have sex with but can explain why she wont go that far if married. Maybe you talk to her, husband doesn't do that bit. Either way shes using you

You clearly like her a lot. I think I would set a deadline in my head. Don't pressure her but just be ready to walk away. She knows how much you like her and is very lucky to have met someone so patient. I disagree that all 40s people jump into bed quickly. People are different and some like to be sure, there is nothing wrong with that as long as she's not messing you about. She might just be the type that sex is something you don't take lightly, I am like that and I'm in my 40s. It's not a moral thing, just my way of protecting my heart. I do not have mental health issues, just cautious and risk averse with matters of sex. I'd like to meet someone like you who respected that, many don't. Most don't in fact. Give her a while to process it but be prepared to protect your own heart too and walk away if necessary.

Taking all the posts together she actually just sounds traumatised. Not manipulative, just traumatised. Depression often accompanies that, but as a secondary issue.

It does sound like a full on conversation so I can understand her needing time to process that. She shared things that probably made her feel very vulnerable.

If you are not up for building a relationship with somebody with trauma who will need things done differently, may react to you and the world differently to how you're used to, and will likely need most things to be taken more slowly, then it's only fair to both of you to call it off now.

If you do decide mutually to continue is then you may find it helpful to yourself and her to learn a little about how trauma affects people - in the same way as I am sure you would want to learn more if you formed a relationship with someone dealing with any other disability or chronic health issue. E.g. Hearing impairment, you wouldn't expect them to suddenly have perfect hearing in order to co your dating you... You'd adapt and learn.

Having been hurt in the past in the way everyone has is not the same as having been traumatised. They are completely different things. Trauma can be lifelong but it doesn't mean people should be prohibited from forming connections with others.

I leave to after Christmas and new year is done . Then have conversation that quoted up thread .about how much you like her .
See how it goes to valentine's day .
You do need to tell her how you feel.

Thanks again for the replies - I do really appreciate you all taking the time to read and reply.

She has said that she takes a long time to feel ready to sleep with someone, and it often frustrates guys that she's dated in the past. It's quite unusual I guess but I don't have a problem with it as long as I know it's not just because she isn't into me. In fact, I rather like it as it means if/when it does happen it means something special.

@ohwheniknow - I think you've hit the nail on the head. Something happened to her at work a few years ago that has caused these ongoing issues, and it's impacted her life outside of work too. So much so that she has struggled to even talk about it to me, but she has opened up about it now.

It's actually something that I've had to deal with previously too, and funnily enough it was one of the things that she picked up on when we started speaking as she wants to be with someone who understands what she's dealing with.

I'm more than happy to be patient with her, and give her time and space. I'm just scared she'll pull the plug on us because of this funk she's got into. But I've done all I can at the moment, and just need to give her some time and space to process what I've said - the advice to wait until after Christmas and New Year is good, so I'll just try and keep occupied over the next week or two and not expect to hear from her too much.

Wow I can't imagine waiting for over 3 months to sleep with someone I'm dating. Sex to me is part of knowing if I like someone.

Exactly what ohwheniknow said. And I'd add that it sounds like trauma from many many years ago, notnjust the recent thing at work.

Op- I'd also be examining whatbitbisnin you that makes you so drawn to this ambiguous/withholding woman. Is this an attachment pattern for you? Most men wouldn't find this as exciting and alluring as you seem to. No offence meant