About to cull a friend but am I wrong?

[Whyjustwhy23]

Posted earlier but it’s outing and I put in some very personal info and MN kindly pulled it for me. So without the personal info!

Have a very best friend that I share everything with, we talk a lot, I’m learning too much!

We were chatting the other day, I’m OLD as is she, we realised we had both matched the same person, but I’d been talking a week and had a date set up, she’d not messaged as she didn’t actually like him. Fine.

Then it gets weird, she messaged me to say she’d gone on another site, got chatting to a person with one unclear photo and now she was sure it was the same man, they had moved straight to WA and been talking for a morning.

She showed me the photo, it’s from the profile we both matched on the original site. She then messaged him (she says), halted the conversation and says she had a go about talking to lots of people (unnecessary it’s OLD FFS) but never mentioned me.

Next minute I get a message from him pulling out of the date stating an awkward situation had occurred.

Now I would NEVER choose a man over a friend but I also will NEVER have a liar or a headfuck as a friend again. This is her second strike as she lied to me in a really weird way about something else around 2 months ago but I let it slide. So now I’m full on done. BUT am I seeing shadows where there are none? (Reminder this isn’t about the man he’s gone it’s about the headfuck/untruth). The reason I think she’s not being truthful:

• how likely is it he uses another site, she has never used, they happened out of the 000’s of people to match but he just has one photo and no name AND she’d forgotten that photo.
• she said that one photo wasn’t on his original profile. It is.
• she said she couldn’t see his image on WA which would have made it clear straight away, because she hadn’t added him to her contacts. Then she added him and it came up. That isn’t how WA works? Privacy is on you being in their contacts?
• she said she never said anything about me. But for him to say there was an awkward situation how can that be true? He’d have to be a fucking genius to work it out?
• he started to change his story during the day saying he had a personal issue...

Which makes me think the following is more likely:

• she decided to use the original profile to start chatting
• she then manufactured the entire thing to screw up the Friday date and did tell him she knew me
• when she realised I was working it out she told him to change his story

Occums razor would say the latter is true and I have a seriously odd toxic friend I need to cull? I wouldn’t even be thinking this if there wasn’t little red flags from before and I know in her interactions with others she likes to play games. I don’t feel comfortable.

But am I being wholly reactive and unfair before I hurt someone I care about? I really don’t want to lose a friend or be a bitch. She is important to me, but I’ve been used a lot and I have to be careful now.

Also as PP says, it is a lesson for you - if you remain friends, stop giving her any details from your online dating. She won’t like that if she is messing with you!

Don't question your gut instinct, trust it. Him referring to an "awkward situation" is enough for you to know she's been manipulative.

I think the bottom line is you don't trust her. She might be telling the truth, she might not. But if you're going to be second guessing everything she does (maybe justifiably if you already know she has lied to you) then it's not much of a friendship anyway

I think I will be second guessing, and I think I’ve ignored my gut a lot and paid the price. It’s so sad but I think it’s done. I’ll be swallowing discomfort all the time. And yes I would love to know what she said.

I guess I’ll totally out myself by saying what the first strike was, see if that changes anything.

I agreed to pick her kids up and due to a stressful week I was going day to day (new school for the eldest, international travel for work I’m on my own doing all this) anyway, gets to the day of pick up and she messages me from the morning to say how stressed I’ve been and I should stick my kids in after school and go to the gym to relax, I say no I’m getting my kids and is she meeting me at pick up as I need something from her. Now at this point wouldn’t most normal people say “no I’m not at pick up you are getting my kids too”. And remind me. Instead she repeatedly told me not to bother picking mine up at all until later. Which obviously then messed with my head and I had no chance of remembering! So I get mine, ask them where their friends mum was a she wasn’t there, they said x and y had gone to football. So off I trot. Get a call 10 minutes later to say OMG you forgot my kids!! Obviously I feel fucking awful, cancel my kids activities, drag my parents out to get my eldest from her new school and turn back round. When I get near school she texts don’t bother my neighbor has had to go for them. I offer to take them off the neighbour and have them late as she’s away in a different city with work, but no, I’ve let her down so badly she doesn’t want me to.

I feel fucking awful as I should.

Only, I went into school to apologise to teachers who may have had to hang around due to my mistake, and they say, very confused. Well we weren’t hanging around, their mum came and got them? About 5 minutes after you left.

So she wasn’t away, the neighbours didn’t get them, she waited until I left to pick them up, she’d spent the whole day expecting me to forget as it was a stressful week and texting me random “don’t go to school” messages to set me up to fail? And now she mentions it CONSTANTLY when I offer to help “oh I would let you but remember that time you forgot them?”.

Now I never said anything as it was my fault totally I hadn’t written it in my diary. But adding that to this and I start to feel really headfucked...

That's nasty OP, why on earth are you doubting your instincts when you can clearly see what she's doing? Probably because what she's doing is so bizarrely spiteful that you're struggling to comprehend why she would, yes? Simple answer is she's batshit, stop trying to understand/excuse her and step away from the crazy. It's most definitely not you, it's her and I don't actually think there's much wrong with your level of sensitivity to/tolerance for gaslighting and manipulation, you just need to trust your instincts more

Thank you, I think that’s it, it’s so bizarre to me I think I must be wrong?!

My gut says however hard this will be, I’ll see her everyday at school and kids will be upset about no sleepovers with hers, I can’t be friends with someone like that anymore. I’ll be happier without.

you just need to trust your instincts more

This

I've had friends like this, trust me dc will be happier that you're not putting your energy into this friendship. I have no doubt either that your memory is worse around her (dv victim, I get the questioning yourself). Maintaining this friendship is toxic to your mental health and sense of stability. People are radiators or drains. This one is a drain and seems to get a kick out of trying to drag you down.

She sounds craycray OP. Distance yourself but be cordial.

The two incidents you have experienced are similar. Along with her admitted MO with ex's I'd say you are 100% right. She's got serious issues.

I wouldn't confront her about it though, just gently drift away. She was a close friend and you've told her things about your life that she can use in future batshit plans. Don't give her anymore ammunition. Be busy and unavailable. No need to poke the crazy tiger.

Agree with a dignified silence and distance. She is a dangerous woman and will pull further stunts if you slight her ..... so reverse v deftly out of this. V tough.

Agreeing with @Thickums she is cray cray.
Distance for cordial is the best thing. You can still say hi, without having to deal with her. Avoid minding her kids

Yep she has somehow sabotaged your date for reasons known only to herself. The thing with the pick up at school is beyond weird, might have been tempted to say something at the time or since along the lines of I went into the office to apologise and was told you picked them up and frankly didn't know what to make of your behaviour.
And yes, reasons enough to pull right away.

That whole school incident ..... why didn’t you say “that’s not true - you picked them up - the teachers told me” ?

I get that you were confused etc when it happened but when she is repeatedly using it as a stick to beat you with and goading you - why can’t you just say it? You can do it coldly and calmly - you are not in a flap like at the time?

She is jealous of you and wants to set you up to fail - she is dangerous - but you know this and had opportunities to call her out - but some misguided FOG (fear, obligation and guilt) has paralysed you.

Who does she the dynamic remind you of?

Kitty fair. The dynamic reminds me of years of non confrontation, behave behave behave. They are nice really...

I should have called it at the time.

That’s great Whyjustwhy to have worked that out.

We are all conditioned to be too nice and too forgiving and to put up with too much shit for far too long.

I have ended up with a pile of shit people who take up my time and do not have my best interests at heart because I am “too nice” - I am now culling these CFs to make space for nice people and I am listening to and trusting my gut much more closely before I commit my time and energy to new or ongoing friendships.

I am teaching my 14 year old DD to get her “bitch detector” set on high alert, to swerve the “drains” and move on swiftly without drama — I am only working all of this shit out now at 48 ..... what a waste of my time !!

Wow! That first incident is a doozy. She certainly likes to have people on the back foot. Run away, run away 🏃 🏃 🏃

Not a waste of time if it helps your DD avoid the same mistakes! Don't beat yourself up, you're doing the right thing. Agree with PPs that you need to subtly distance yourself - no big drama and certainly nothing that she can call you out on, just being less and less available until she's out of your life for good

Eek! She sounds like the kind of person those bad american Jealous Mom movies are based on.... Definitely trust your instincts. She's one to avoid. I would just walk away quietly, though, without any sort of confrontation or even an open explanation. She sounds like she could get really nasty if she knew she was being 'dumped'.

She's mad as a box of frogs. Save your sanity and distance yourself now!

Thanks all, someday sorry to hear about the DV and glad you are in a better place now. You are right, it messes with your memory and you question.

Margot funnily enough my eldest DC always reacts badly to any plans with her, she will be ecstatic, maybe she’s ahead of the game! Middle DC is going to be gutted but it has to be and if she uses the kids for ammo then all bets are off.

Thank you Kitty I know, 42 and still working this crap out too! Tiny bit pleased that at least this time I’ve seen and not excused the behaviour like in the past! Even if I’m over reacting I have to go with my gut.

I’ve just gone totalt silent, will be cordial at school. Fuck this is going to be hard and I am very very worried about what will come. As I’m absolutely sure it will.

But I have as much on her/

Is she your only friend? I would not make a bit dramatic "no friend of mine" gesture, i'd just chat to her less and less, be busy when she suggests plans, and ffs do NOT tell her anything else about your OLD adventures!

Just basically dial down your interactions with her until she is peripheral to your life.

You haven’t over-reacted at all..... under reacted if anything in the past with her. Your assessment and actions now are a sensible assertive calm dignified response - feel proud of that. Don’t rise to anything she does or says .... you need to escape under the wire without triggering one of her land mines!!! Just chuckle at her predictable attempts to get back at you. Indifference is the best response.

If it was just the OLD thing I would say you are being massively precious as really in that respect she didn't do anything wrong. I think it's ok on these date sights to be talking to lots of different peope but she obviously pulled him on it. Whether because she felt threatened he was talking to you, or she wanted to get one over on you, well who knows.

Regarding everything else though, fuck that for a game of soldiers, she sounds very odd. I mean, she sounds like she is one of those who can get in your head and persuade a person to do what they don't want to do. She got that guy to cool things with you, so yeah who wants a friend like that.

Assuming you've been friends for quite a while she's probably been undermining you for a long time.

I had a weird friend like this, she was my next door neighbour and the kids were best friends but eventually I just realised that everything was a lie, everything, she literally couldn't be honest about what she'd had for breakfast 😁

I kicked off and stopped the friendship in one fell swoop, which I regret as it affected the kids, I would have been better to just withdraw slowly but then I don't think she would have let me.