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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Sexless marriage, considering divorce, not sure how...

35 replies

BreakfastNotBREXIT · 15/11/2019 21:34

Frequent poster; name change for this one as I don't want it to be linked to my other posts as they have a lot of identifying info. Help
me, Mumsnetters. I’m at my wit’s end with this problem.

Sorry this is so long.

I’ve been with DH for 20 years, married for 15. We have one DC who is nearly 7. Our sex life has never been great and has been non-existent since we had our DC seven years ago. Our sex drives are completely mismatched to be honest. I don’t know if mine is average or high, but I’d say his is bordering on non-existent. We did do sex therapy through Relate about 10 years ago and it was some help, but now, although I'd like to have sex, I don't want to have it with him.

Other than this, our marriage is so-so. He’s reliable, steady, a reasonably good dad in a day to day way, but happy for me to bear nearly all of the ‘mental load’ and admin of our family lives. I’ve said on a number of occasions how unhappy I am to have to do most of the organising and remembering things, including all our finances, all our holiday planning, nearly everything to do with maintaining our house, school uniform, homework, dealing with any problems that come up etc etc. He makes vague promises to step up and then backslides.

Having said that, I wouldn’t have any worries about him taking care of DD solo and he does a perfectly ok job when he does. Also, he actually does more than most of my friends’ husbands…

We rub along okay together but don’t have much to say to each other. I am increasingly finding it impossible to imagine getting old with him and I'm having persistent fantasies of living by myself (obviously with DC half the time or whatever we agreed – we both work in education so there are a lot of holidays to divvy up). We are older parents so DC is going to reach university/job age not long before we retire. He is getting increasingly grumpy and stuck in his ways and is unbelievably tedious about politics. He’s only early 50s!

I went to see a solicitor recently to find out what my options are and we could split, no problem. We are lucky to have good jobs, equity in the house, etc and could afford to run two smaller households. As long as we communicated well I don’t think DC would see any massive change in lifestyle.

I have two problems. One is how do you discuss splitting up with someone who doesn’t really have relationship conversations and who is going along (apparently) quite happily? I tried starting a conversation last night and got nowhere much. He was all ‘oh I’ll try harder to do all that organising stuff’. He doesn’t mean it and it’s not the main issue, although I do feel resentful that he’ll talk this great talk about equality etc while doing a half arsed job that basically means I can’t take my career any more seriously unless I outsource even more stuff than I do already. Frustratingly, he has good admin skills when it comes to things he's actually interested in.

The second is, is the sexless marriage thing ‘enough’ to divorce over? I feel like it should be. I’m late 40s and am struggling with the idea that I’d have to be involuntarily celibate for the rest of my life. I don’t think I’d even mind if I was single and not having sex, as long as it was an option if I wanted to.

Do I give Relate or similar one more go? We’ve done that several times in the past and it was helpful, but I wasn’t thinking of leaving the marriage then. I honestly can’t see how we’d have the necessary conversations without a third person in the room making us. I find DH very difficult to talk to about anything important. I never feel he’s really listening and I feel the things he says are just to make me stop bringing the topics up. I am also worried that I’d feel terribly guilty as his mental and physical health is not great and he hates change and our families will probably not be very supportive of my decision. I’m certainly not explaining the sex thing to them and if I tell them he's got barely enough energy to hold down a job and be a dad and certainly not enough to be a decent partner too, I think they'd just assume my standards are impossibly high (are they?)

I think I know what I have to do but I’m not sure what/how to do it and I'm going round in circles. Help!

OP posts:
AnneLovesGilbert · 15/11/2019 21:41

It’s not just the lack of sex and there’s no bar of miserable enough you have to hit to decide you’d be happier without him.

It sounds like you’ve given counselling a good crack in the past and he’s not going to change so your marriage is stuck.

You don’t need a deep and meaningful which you know he’ll refuse. If you’re sure you can tell him you’ve decided you want a divorce and that you’ll be filing the paperwork. He can’t stop you, though he could be resistant.

MoreProseccoNow · 15/11/2019 21:49

No great advice from me, but I'm in a similar situation & it's really shitty.

I had the conversation with him about going our separate ways, but it's such a big upheaval. Selling family home, new schools/area, away from DC's friends. It's bloody grim.

But we haven't had sex in 7 years & I can't go on the rest of my life like that. I guess I've just reached my point.

You'll get there too, OP, one way or another.

BreakfastNotBREXIT · 15/11/2019 21:57

I'm sorry to hear that, @MoreProseccoNow. To be truthful it is mainly the thought of the giant heap of admin and explaining to everyone that is putting me off. We are fortunate in that we could stay in the same area if we want to, which I think we probably would. If I had to move area as well I'd probably bottle out...

How did he react to the conversation, if you're willing to share that?

@AnneLovesGilbert I know, you're right, you don't have to meet some sort of objective test. I am actually not miserable at all - that's part of the problem - but my head is telling me that I can't just sleepwalk on like this.

OP posts:
MoreProseccoNow · 15/11/2019 22:05

Unfortunately, the conversation did not go well. He wants to stay together but so many things have killed my feelings got him (his affair, his depression & laziness round the house). So it's part of a bigger unhappiness.

Until about 18m ago, I thought we could turn it round, but things have got worse, and it's gone from rubbing along ok to cannot stand being in same room.

Maybe you're just not there yet?

Would you think about some counselling on your own?

BreakfastNotBREXIT · 15/11/2019 22:12

Oh dear. That's not a bad idea about personal counselling. I can get it through work, I think. I have spoken to a couple of friends and they were both a bit shocked but not particularly surprised, if you see what I mean, which told me something. I think we could turn it around, but I'd have to do nearly all the work, and I just don't want to any more.

I have a horrible feeling some of the factors were there right from the beginning. I wish someone had given me a good talking to in my 20s, although no doubt I wouldn't have listened.

OP posts:
Teaandcrisps · 15/11/2019 22:16

Could you go for a temporary separation?

Obviouslynotobvious · 15/11/2019 22:21

I think the sexless marriage is only a part of the problem. Have you and he (although he may be happy and blindsided) let things slide so much you don't want to invest in the marriage now?

I would suggest Relate again if you have not checked out already. Not for sex therapy, but relationship work generally, so you can truly look back whatever happens and say my marriage meant something to me and I worked at it by taking action, reading books, going on courses etc.

Best of luck.

cazza7777 · 15/11/2019 22:35

You have just described my life near enough...
I'm just at the moment having marriage councelling with my DH
I'm so fed up..I feel like I'm living with a stranger and I know I can't carry on like this. I've never felt so alone..I know that it will be a nightmare to separate and I just don't know if we can be fixed or how I start the ball rolling to leave..

Big hugs Op xx

Zofloraqueen27 · 15/11/2019 23:13

I just wish wives who find themselves in a sexless marriage would look into their future.

Being in a marriage where there is no love, sex, intimacy is truly soul destroying and you will grow old with your self esteem smashed to pieces. I understand (oh how I do 😢) when the op says she doesn’t even want to have sex with her husband - it only gets worse believe me.

You will resent him when he is unwell, has sad times, feels depressed etc with the view “why should I care about YOUR feelings when you completely dismissed MY needs and“. Please do not let your husband make the unilateral decision that YOU will never have sex again.

How will you feel should he become old and dependant on you - and you will become his carer? Will you really want to provide personal care, as well as endless emotional and physical care?

Zofloraqueen27 · 15/11/2019 23:17

.............Please don’t put up with this awful relationship - pleas believe me it will get worse and you will end up sad and frustrated at the huge loss of a vibrant part of your life. Please don’t settle for his decision to reject you - you are worth so much more than this.

You will hopefully find a man who loves you and wants you to be as happy and fulfilled as he wants you to make him feel.

ScreamingLadySutch · 16/11/2019 07:12

Do you know why he is so lazy and disengaged?

It sounds as though 'wife' has become 'mummy'.

There is one silver cloud though - that you do all the admin, means you know where everything is.

AgentJohnson · 16/11/2019 07:36

The time for him to make more half arsed promises has passed. You aren’t asking for a divorce, you’re telling him you want a divorce.

You need to be clear what you want yourself before you can communicate with him because he will always look to maintain the status quo. Therefore you need to make clear that not only is maintaining the status quo not an option but divorce, is the only offer on the table.

Not wanting to stay in a marriage is a good enough reason for ending one.

Miketv3 · 16/11/2019 07:42

You don’t need permission to walk away from a relationship. This one sounds dead to me. He will resist as he is obviously happy as it is.

If you have already done relate, I don’t think it will work as he has switched off and is just hoping you will deal with it.

Personably id be having the divorce talk rather than skirting around the issues.

“I want a divorce as I am really unhappy and don’t think that anything will change this. Can we talk about the practicalities of this”

I think women often try to be “nice” all of the
time but doing this means things drag on.

ivykaty44 · 16/11/2019 07:50

Explain how you feel you’ve come to the end of the road and sad as that maybe, it would be far better for both of you to separate now and amicably than continue and have a negative family life which would affect everyone badly

Fakeflowersaremynewnormal · 16/11/2019 07:53

If the marriage is sexless then the rest of the relationship would have to be better than normal to make it worthwhile.

BreakfastNotBREXIT · 16/11/2019 07:55

Thanks, guys. I have done a lot of books, therapy, trying to talk etc already. It always comes down to it takes two to tango: you can't fix something the other person either doesn't work on or doesn't think is broken. I don't know why he has made less and less effort over the years but it's not just to do with me. I had a revelation a while ago that he puts in minimum effort in nearly every aspect of his life, but with relationships, that kills it eventually.

The things you describe are very much on my mind, @Zofloraqueen27. He's had a few bouts of serious respiratory illness and it's been just awful. When he feels ill he completely checks out of family life (understandable - but I wouldn't be able to do it unless I really was at death's door). We have parents in our late 70s and early 80s (fortunately all pretty healthy) but obviously the question of who's going to care for whom is on your mind when people are that age.

We spent two weeks apart this summer and while I found looking after our 6yo stressful at times, it was good and sadly I didn't miss him. It was a bit of a wake-up call!

I do indeed do all the admin and finances and that is a good thing. I'm just quailing at the amount of admin that's going to be required and no doubt I'll have to fill in his forms too. And house moves, arg.

Flowers @Zofloraqueen27, @cazza7777, @MoreProseccoNow. It is shit!!

OP posts:
Fishflame · 16/11/2019 07:56

Same problem here... it's been at least three years since my husband told me there would be no more sex. He blamed pain from an hernia op he had several years before.

There is no intimacy or physical affection whatsoever.

I totally understand your predicament Thanks

BreakfastNotBREXIT · 16/11/2019 07:56

Yes, @Fakeflowersaremynewnormal. That's exactly right!

OP posts:
Fishflame · 16/11/2019 07:59

Oh and I don't entirely believe him about the pain as he does weigh training without and problem Hmm

Miketv3 · 16/11/2019 08:06

It’s not the pain. He is lying. The top and bottom of it is that he has lost all desire to have sex with YOU. I bet if you split he would have having sex again within months. He has basically checked out of the relationship but likes the home comforts it brings and the fact he gets to see his child daily. What he is probably hoping for is that you bring the relationship to an end so he is not perceived as the bad guy. This applies to the OP too.

RandomMess · 16/11/2019 08:10

Honestly it's over but you want it to somehow be by miraculous mutual agreement but it's not going to happen.

Tell him you've been to see a solicitor and you're filing for divorce. Stop the conversation at that and see how it takes before he wants to talk properly.

RandomMess · 16/11/2019 08:12

One of the reasons you can give him as well as the lack of sex is that you are not bringing up DD to believe that in a partnership one person does all the work and has all the responsibility and somehow men are incapable of running a home and doing 50% of parenting.

OhioOhioOhio · 16/11/2019 08:18

Oh leave him. You don't need to discuss it. Just say it.

ittooshallpass · 16/11/2019 08:35

OP this marriage is over. Tell him you want a divorce. Don’t do his paperwork! In a very short save of time you’ll wonder why you wasted so much of your precious time on him. It is soul destroying trying to breathe life into a dead relationship. You are in a great position financially, just get the ball rolling and allow yourself to be happy.

Zupermumm · 16/11/2019 08:47

OP I completely understand where you are coming from, and it’s sad that there are so many of us in this situation. We have also been sexless for 6 years now, and almost everything he does irritates me. He has anger issues and the main reason I don’t leave is because I can’t bear the thought of leaving my two boys with him, without me being able to step in when he is arguing / putting them down. No physical abuse but the verbal abuse is unbearable and he is constantly taunting and arguing with our boys. I dream of finding someone who will find me attractive, and look forward to his work trips where I can relax at home without hearing his bickering and put downs. I don’t think it’s going to get better. I plan to leave in a couple of years and have started squirrelling away a bit of money each pay so no can make it happen.

Not sure why I shared so much, but wanted to let you know that I hear you and send you live and strength to get through this until you decide to separate in the future xx