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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

If he wants to change, what to suggest to him?

45 replies

VihmaSajab · 13/11/2019 12:45

I wrote a topic the other day about my situation and now have reached a somewhat decision on how to continue. Long story again in the beginning, question in the end.

I want to have a chat with my partner about my worries regarding the future which are mainly related to his words, actions and mindset. He has told me on several occasions and also shown me with his actions that after work (on evenings, weekends) he wants to relax and chill and do fun stuff and he does not like obligations, responsibilities and commitments. He is also rather short tempered meaning that he gets easily upset over small things (long queue in store, something breaking, not having things the way he imagined etc) – just huffing and puffing and being gross for 10-15 minutes. Happens basically every day. Perhaps even more, I guess I have gotten so used to it, I tend to ignore and forget. When he cannot get something right in the first or second try, he throws the whole thing into bin (physically and metaphorically) and swears and blames the entire world and how "everything is now screwed up with everything". On few occasions he has lashed out very strongly and loudly. He says he just wants things to be stable and in balance and he cannot deal with things when something happens that disturb the stability. Most of the time he self-sabotages himself (though it seems he does not understand it), but then blames the whole world for his misery. E.g. – he had some tooth issues diagnosed in May, still hasn’t gotten these repaired (he can afford it money and time wise), I’m certain one day one of his tooth will fall out from his mouth and then all hell is released and the whole world is to be blamed for his missing tooth.

He has many positive qualities, too, otherwise I would not be with him. I am thinking about breaking up with him, though. But I want to let him know about the reasons before. If not for the sake of saving the relationship, then for him – to be able for him to know why it isn’t working out. It is not fair to break up and not say why; but when explaining it through break-up chat I am certain he would promise me the whole world and how he would change out of distraught. And it would be too difficult for me mentally to go through and clearly hear him out. And perhaps I have a slight hope that he might understand and change if I talk to him properly during good times? Most likely not, but I have decided I want to go through with it this way.

So I want to ask him how he sees our future in terms of we needing a house, renovating the house and raising children (things we have vaguely talked about we want in future) if he cannot cope with responsibilities, commitments and instability. My question is: if the chat goes reasonably well and he says he understands my worries and all and he expresses the desire to change and then asks me how can he change, what is he supposed to do – what do I say to him? It’s not like I have a list in my head what he needs to do at the moment or I have a magic cure. I do not know what he should do. Perhaps see a counsellor? Analyse himself? What? What do I tell him if he asks me how he can change?

OP posts:
PollyFeather · 13/11/2019 12:47

This isn't your job.

Sounds like a total head fuck to me. I think your instinct to end the relationship should take priority here. He sounds like a nightmare - do you honestly want to be psycho analysing him in this way?

PollyFeather · 13/11/2019 12:48

Oh and he's abusive by the way. Can't you see that?

AFistfulofDolores1 · 13/11/2019 13:05

As @PollyFeather says, this is not your job.

By taking it on, you're enabling his infantile behaviour once again: you're playing to his attitude that "someone else is always responsible, never me".

I'd cut your losses and leave. And be prepared to be told it's your fault.

Comtesse · 13/11/2019 13:09

He sounds a bit like my six year old. Not great OP. Do you really want to teach him to be a grown up?

WestSideSnorey · 13/11/2019 13:30

I know that people say couples counselling isn't the best but I do think in this situation it could prove beneficial.

Failing that I think you do just need to sit him down and say that you want a talk and that you need to set a time in the next week or so where you commit to sitting down together to do so.
I guess then all you can do is lay out what you have done here, explain that some of his behaviours are not just a bit tiresome but that they are making you think if the relationship will work long term, ideally without making it an instant threat but making sure that he does realise that this is serious and inaction will mean that there will definitely be no ling term.

When you've described the problems (and how they affect you) it really is up to him to work it out. You can suggest counselling or ask him to see his GP to see if there are any medications that could benefit him but once he has a clear picture of where the relationship is it's then up to him.

The other posters all describe him as abusive, I'd tend to agree with this but I'm not of the thinking that an abusive relationship has to end the minute someone realises it's abusive and I do think a lot of people abuse their partners without that intention and actually would be pretty horrified to realise that their actions are abusive, it's certainly been the case with my own DP who is an abuser but whom I won't leave (No safety issue or fear with me). I also believe that people can unlearn these behaviours and improve themselves but it's for them to work out how to do that and I don't think you can really guide him if he does ask as he may resent therapy for example and blame you or think that it is that way or no way and give up when the first suggestion doesn't help.

PollyFeather · 13/11/2019 13:37

No disrespect @WestSideSnorey but you are dishing out advice and in the same breath, saying you are in an abusive relationship that you have no intentions of leaving.

I despair sometimes - in general - of the shit that some women will tolerate and put up with in order to keep a man.

Toporama · 13/11/2019 13:39

Another one here who thinks this isn't your job.

I honestly think you would be better off just leaving and looking for a relationship with a functioning adult.

NightsOfCabiria · 13/11/2019 13:40

I read your other thread and I cant for the life of me see why youre planning a future with this man.

He’s like a child.

By all means see him for fun but think about finding someone more suitable as a life partner.

Redannie118 · 13/11/2019 13:46

This reply has been withdrawn

The OP has privacy concerns, and so we've agreed to take this down now.

Innishh · 13/11/2019 13:49

My question is: if the chat goes reasonably well and he says he understands my worries and all and he expresses the desire to change and then asks me how can he change, what is he supposed to do – what do I say to him?

This is your fantasy - your wishful thinking - your denial.

It will not go reasonably well, he will not express understand and ask how to change. It will be the opposite - he will kick off as he has done on every occasion to date.

You don’t need to point out to him that his behaviour is out of order - he knows this already and he chooses to lose his temper and behave in an irresponsible and abusive way.

Do not have babies with this man. No child should have to endure this.

Don’t waste another day of your finite fertile years with him.

Plot your way out of this quietly, by stealth, get your ducks in a row. Then one day just leave, block, cut all contact and don’t engage. Do some work to understand why you have stayed and accepted this treatment and why you think he will change.

Innishh · 13/11/2019 13:53

Have you shared his behaviours with anyone in real life - a colleague, family member or friend?

OxfordCat · 13/11/2019 14:39

Nope, it's not couples counselling.

This is NOT your problem. You should dump and move on.

But, in answer to your actual question... he has unresolved anger issues. He is deeply deeply angry about something (to the extent that he has buried it and probably wouldn't even be able to identify it or articulate it himself) and this anger is being released in the everyday interactions you describe. He needs psychotherapy (talking therapy). I expect he has deeply programmed childhood beliefs, and had a somewhat dysfunctional upbringing. But it's up to him to understand himself. He is an adult and it's HIS responsibility, not yours. If he knows his temper tantrums are wrong then he needs to take action to learn about his own psychology in order to heal. If he doesn't know his temper tantrums are wrong then walk away and don't look back.

MikeUniformMike · 13/11/2019 14:42

If he wants to change, what to suggest to him?
You say the word " Goodbye". Then you go, and never return.

VihmaSajab · 13/11/2019 15:06

Thank you all.

I guess I have a tiny hope (due to his good qualities), but mostly I am certain that the relationship will end sooner or later. BUT as I figured out in my previous post, I am unable to just break up with him. Because I am weak, I start to feel sorry for him, I feel I have been unfair to him, I do not want to make him a miserable man and so on. So I need to prepare it a bit.

I think (cannot be sure), that he perhaps really is not aware or refuses to acknowledge to himself his issues (yes, he has had some traumas in childhood) and his previous girlfriends did not "teach him" and if I do the same, his cycle continues. I am too people-pleasing and I really want to help people, thus I think he needs to understand that he has issues (ugly word, but I do not know better one).

BUT most of all I would use this chat as a tool for myself to ease the break up in the future. Sounds a bit cruel, I know. Basically I want him to know and discuss this peacefully and really see what he says and thinks. And then, if I still think I want to break up I have the opportunity to say that "hey, we spoke, you promised changes, nothing has changed, I want to leave now". It would most of all help ME to stay in focus and strong.

I am sure if I would just break up with him and tell him the reasons, it would all get really emotional and difficult and I would finally back down. It's crazy, I know. Moreover, he lives in my place, so he would need to leave and it would take some time until he has a new place... this is why I need such a strong plan to keep my sanity and stay strong during the break up.

I feel like a mean little witch right now, planning and scheming.

Why I asked what to tell him if he asks? Is exactly because I do not want to take any responsibility in his process of change. I want him to know my worries, I want him to understand his behavior and him to sort it. But I guess I just cannot say "I do not know" to him.

But I received good solutions from you, actually, thank you.

OP posts:
BertieBotts · 13/11/2019 15:20

The thing is, if he wanted to change, he would just do it. Why would he ask you for advice about how to do it? Why would he think that you know better than him about how he can change? If he wanted to, he would seek out self help books, or ask people, or google things occasionally, or go to his doctor, or look for therapy, or courses.

He isn't doing that because he is happy with the way things are now.

If he decides to change because you want to break up with him, that is not self motivated change and it is usually not genuine in the desire. It's just him saying what he thinks you want to hear - which if you've asked him to get counselling or read this or that book before, he'll already know.

I agree please do not have children with him. I had a child with a man like this and it is the biggest regret of my life. I regret choosing him as a father for my son. It has harmed him.

MikeUniformMike · 13/11/2019 15:23

Just leave him OP. He'll never make you happy.
You are in that position where keeping him happy is keeping you busy.
You will never achieve it.
Do you really want to add a joint mortgage and children into the list of responsibilities?
Get out.

OxfordCat · 13/11/2019 16:25

Don't over think it OP. As I said, he needs therapy but you are not responsible for him. "It's not working for me right now" is a good sentence that no-one can argue with. Calmly repeat, "I am not prepared to live with your anger issues" and advise him to seek help but don't be surprised when he says he doesn't need any / he can change etc etc. This has happened too often now. Trust your gut instinct!

On another note, once you have got rid of him, you might consider some therapy for yourself to understand your people pleasing tendencies and possible co-dependency? It might help you to install firmer boundaries and higher self respect for future relationships OP. Good luck Thanks

Batqueen · 13/11/2019 16:34

Read the book ‘Mindset’ by Carol Dweck. Sounds like he has a serious case of the fixed mindset.

He can change it, you can’t ‘make’ him change it and he probably won’t.

You might find it useful to help you realise why you need to find someone with a growth mindset like yours.

dontgobaconmyheart · 13/11/2019 16:41

OP, your life is worth more than being this man's pseudo mother. He is not your son so this isn't on you, it isn't love to put up with it either; it is just under selling your own value in a chronic and damaging way. It is wasting your life and your efforts are wasted anyway.

He does it because he gets away with it presumably and because he has serious emotional issues that he feels entitled not to have to work on. He sounds extremely unattractive and an unsuitable partner for anyone, let alone a parent.

I would be asking yourself why you are dead set on backing the wrong horse OP, and agree with PP that therapy for yourself to understand why you are taking on a burden for an abusive partner feels acceptable and normalised.

Shoxfordian · 13/11/2019 16:44

You're not his therapist
You should tell him it's too late to change for your relationship, good luck to his next girlfriend

Interestedwoman · 13/11/2019 16:45

He needs individual therapy, couples therapy might be helpful, but individual therapy more so, because it is about his inability to control how he expresses his emotions and stuff, which is a problem in his own right, but also may be influenced by past trauma, and processing that with an individual therapist could help.

Couples therapy wouldn't be so good (though I suppose it could be done alongside individual therapy) because possibly his emotions, but definitely his actions, maybe down to him as an individual being fucked up (which is not an excuse, he still has a choice in how he acts.)

VihmaSajab · 13/11/2019 17:08

@BertieBotts Thanks, this is a really good point: The thing is, if he wanted to change, he would just do it. Why would he ask you for advice about how to do it?

Yeah I know I'm probably overthinking. But I do need some Kind of firm plan. If I could just tell him, back my bags and go it would be so much easier. But I must make him leave my home which makes it so difficult. I cannot just throw his stuff out and lock him out, I could never do such thing. So probably he would be around at least a few days and I could not stand his emotions.
I'm not making my life easy, am I.

Agree with the counselling. Been thinking about it, even looked for therapists, but still waiting to make an appoitment.

OP posts:
Besidesthepoint · 13/11/2019 17:09

He can't change what he cannot acknowledge. You telling him what to change doesn't work because he needs to see it for himself.

If you need a reason to break up with him, wanting him to change is the wrong reason. Anyway, it sounds like the deeper problem is that you don't see a future together. So there is your reason.

BertieBotts · 13/11/2019 17:21

So are you going to stay in a relationship with him because you don't like the idea of kicking him out? This is madness.

TimeForNewStart · 13/11/2019 17:38

I cannot just throw his stuff out and lock him out, I could never do such thing

Yes you could, you just don’t want to.

If he asks how to change say that it’s important for him to come up with his own plan.

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