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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

If he wants to change, what to suggest to him?

45 replies

VihmaSajab · 13/11/2019 12:45

I wrote a topic the other day about my situation and now have reached a somewhat decision on how to continue. Long story again in the beginning, question in the end.

I want to have a chat with my partner about my worries regarding the future which are mainly related to his words, actions and mindset. He has told me on several occasions and also shown me with his actions that after work (on evenings, weekends) he wants to relax and chill and do fun stuff and he does not like obligations, responsibilities and commitments. He is also rather short tempered meaning that he gets easily upset over small things (long queue in store, something breaking, not having things the way he imagined etc) – just huffing and puffing and being gross for 10-15 minutes. Happens basically every day. Perhaps even more, I guess I have gotten so used to it, I tend to ignore and forget. When he cannot get something right in the first or second try, he throws the whole thing into bin (physically and metaphorically) and swears and blames the entire world and how "everything is now screwed up with everything". On few occasions he has lashed out very strongly and loudly. He says he just wants things to be stable and in balance and he cannot deal with things when something happens that disturb the stability. Most of the time he self-sabotages himself (though it seems he does not understand it), but then blames the whole world for his misery. E.g. – he had some tooth issues diagnosed in May, still hasn’t gotten these repaired (he can afford it money and time wise), I’m certain one day one of his tooth will fall out from his mouth and then all hell is released and the whole world is to be blamed for his missing tooth.

He has many positive qualities, too, otherwise I would not be with him. I am thinking about breaking up with him, though. But I want to let him know about the reasons before. If not for the sake of saving the relationship, then for him – to be able for him to know why it isn’t working out. It is not fair to break up and not say why; but when explaining it through break-up chat I am certain he would promise me the whole world and how he would change out of distraught. And it would be too difficult for me mentally to go through and clearly hear him out. And perhaps I have a slight hope that he might understand and change if I talk to him properly during good times? Most likely not, but I have decided I want to go through with it this way.

So I want to ask him how he sees our future in terms of we needing a house, renovating the house and raising children (things we have vaguely talked about we want in future) if he cannot cope with responsibilities, commitments and instability. My question is: if the chat goes reasonably well and he says he understands my worries and all and he expresses the desire to change and then asks me how can he change, what is he supposed to do – what do I say to him? It’s not like I have a list in my head what he needs to do at the moment or I have a magic cure. I do not know what he should do. Perhaps see a counsellor? Analyse himself? What? What do I tell him if he asks me how he can change?

OP posts:
Eckhart · 13/11/2019 17:57

If you don't want to deal with his post-break-up emotions, tell him you'd like him to leave by 'x' date, then stay with a friend until then, or have a little holiday/break yourself. You'll probably need the head space yourself to start dealing with your own emotions.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 13/11/2019 18:10

Your innate people pleasing nature is doing you no favours here, this man latched onto you also because of this

You can pack up his stuff and tell him that this is no longer working for you.

Before you go into another relationship I would urge you to seek counselling for your own self re codependency and people pleasing behaviour

Innishh · 13/11/2019 18:10

Exactly what Eckhart says.
Where was he living before he moved in with you? Does he have family or friends who would put him up for a week or two?

Bananalanacake · 13/11/2019 19:31

does he pay towards the bills and rent.

VihmaSajab · 13/11/2019 19:39

Well yes he has a brother in town and one or two friends. But he rarerly speaks with them so I tend to forger they exist...
He lived in a rented flat previously.

He does pay half the bills and food and entertainment etc. Everything is good in this sphare.

I'm starting to see the point you are all trying to tell me.. That I'm looking for excuses and trying to procrastinate basically. Feel so stupid but also it scsres me to death. I am much more good at other things, like my work or friends or hobby etc. This Situation however is making a weak person. I know I need to stop thinking about him and more about myself. It's like paralysing feeling.

OP posts:
TimeForNewStart · 13/11/2019 20:19

It is scary to end a relationship, it’s really hard. I think we put so much emphasis on how difficult it is to be finished with, we forget that it’s the one doing the ending will be going through a tough time too. But you only get one life OP!

merryhouse · 13/11/2019 20:35

He has told me on several occasions and also shown me with his actions that after work (on evenings, weekends) he wants to relax and chill and do fun stuff and he does not like obligations, responsibilities and commitments.

You cannot possibly have children with someone like this.

Everything else is detail. Whether you're enjoying it right now, how you sort out any split, who comes up with how he could change; it's all incidental. If you ever want to have children, then at some point you are going to have to split up with this man.

rvby · 13/11/2019 20:41

@VihmaSajab wow, you seem to actively hate yourself and want your life to be as difficult as possible! Why do you obsess and perseverate over things that have literally NOTHING to do with you? Has this worked for you in the past?

Have you ever had success telling people how to be grownups? Serious question.

Of course he will beg and plead and so on and of course he will say he'll change. And of course he won't. That's what happens in breakups.

Can you not just save everyone the heartache and runaround, and end it? Can you see that it would be so much kinder to both you and him to rip the plaster off? It's cruel and manipulative to put your desire not to look like the bad guy ahead of everything else, it's prolonging his agony for your benefit.

You are not going to die from guilt. It's just a feeling. let it happen, pay it no mind, continue with the breakup. The quicker you get it over with, the kinder to both him and you.

rvby · 13/11/2019 20:43

If you ever want to have children, then at some point you are going to have to split up with this man. I completely agree with this as well. All this wringing your hands and imagining he might want to change (never mind that he never will!) is worthless and meaningless. It's as plain as day, there's nothing here for you.

cacklingmags · 13/11/2019 21:08

OP you sound like the kindest, sweetest person and full of compassion for this man, but it will do you no good at all. The most bottom line here is not even your happiness - it is children - that if you stay with this man children may very well arrive - how do you explain to them about their not very nice daddy. You are a lovely person, find a lovely man for your own self because you deserve it, but also to be a lovely daddy to your kids.

VihmaSajab · 18/11/2019 10:50

The thing is, he is lovely in so many ways (like reeeeeaaalllly lovely and this is what's keeping me). Expect he is a pain in the ass in so many other ways. And yes, I have a very-very hard time making the decision and sticking to it whatever it is. I'm going to find a counselor to help me.

I had the chat with him, by the way. Short conclusion is that basically he said to me that when the kids arrive, he would step up and until then he wants to rest and chill because when there are kids of course he cannot do it. He said that if kids need something, then he knows he must provide it to the kids. That he wants to be a good father to the kids. And if needed, of course he can handle everything and take responsibility and make commitments.
I asked, why he thinks the same behaviour is not needed currently. He said that currently these things affect only him and he doesn’t care that much of him, meaning that if he wants to rest and chill and he won’t make a doctor’s appointment, then it is fine because his health is affected, but if the children need doctor appointment, then it is not fine to choose resting because the children’s health is affected.
He said of course he would not get short tempered in front of the kids. I asked why is it ok to get short tempered in front of me? He said he did not know, but later said that he knows it’s not OK and he will try to hold it back.
I told him I have hard time believing him that he will step up if he cannot show me now that he is capable of doing it. He asked me how can I ensure that I will be a good mother and behave reasonably etc, how can I ensure that I do not turn out to be someone who freaks out about children or get depressed or whatever when the children arrive. Telling me that no one knows what the future brings, why stress about it now.

OP posts:
Innishh · 18/11/2019 12:21

Did you follow through looking into counselling for yourself? Or did you slip back into your fantasy of changing him?

Actions now, not words or promises for the future, tell you who he is through and through.

He will be a shit father, just like he is a shit partner (and brother and friend by the sounds of it).

It will not be possible for him to change - he doesn’t do responsibilities or commitments now - and he will not be able to go from 0-60 when a child arrives. Most v committed, supportive partnerships find the unpredictability, unrelenting workload, chaos, exhaustion of you children v v challenging.

Your children at a minimum deserve a calm and peaceful home with attentive parents working together. Don’t inflict him on them.

You said that you are scared to leave, paralysed. How did you function before he came into you life?

You said you wanted to use this thread to plan your escape, step by step. Everyone is here to help you so that. But no one will say:
“Wow, congratulations - good for you - so delighted to hear that he will transform an amazing father overnight. Lucky, lucky you - and your lucky little babies when they come along. It will be idyllic. Why wait start making them now. And yes of course he should get in all the relaxing and chilling he can until them - why even get out of bed for the next year. How fabulous!”

Yes he can be really, really nice. Of course he can - but just about enough to keep you hooked in - totally manipulative. If he upped the contempt you might kick him out so he just has to give you the minimum of contrived “nice” to get to stay.

fedup21 · 18/11/2019 12:28

Short conclusion is that basically he said to me that when the kids arrive, he would step up

I hope you can see that this simply won’t happen.

Take a person with unresolved anger issues and remove a lot of their sleep and most of their free time. Add to that a partner that they already use as a whipping boy.

What impact do you think all this is going to have on him, you and a child.

Don’t do it.

CosmoK · 18/11/2019 12:35

Short conclusion is that basically he said to me that when the kids arrive, he would step up and until then he wants to rest and chill because when there are kids of course he cannot do it.

Nope....it'll never happen. Do not have children with man.

Innishh · 18/11/2019 12:42

Hope that you spotted that your feelings and needs are not even on his radar.
He talked about how he will change for his children (won’t happen) but for now nothing needs to change as his needs are 100% met.

Where are you in this? Your are not even on his mind ! Some imaginary babies are ahead in the queue.

What is your relationship history? And what was your upbringing like?

12345kbm · 18/11/2019 12:42

As has been suggested, you sound co dependent OP. Did you grow up amongst addiction or with a 'helpless' parent that you had to look after?

This is not a relationship, it's a project. You already know the relationship is over, and you're obviously struggling to finish it. It's hard finishing a relationship, letting go is never easy, even when it's sucking the life out of you. Happier times await.

Aussiebean · 18/11/2019 12:44

To quote Dr Phil ‘the best predictor of future behaviour is past behaviour ‘

There is a good chance that you will be a good mum because you don’t fly off the handle at small inconveniences. Something that happens ALL THE TIME. trust me.

The chances of him stepping up in the future. Nil. Because he can’t do it now when it is relatively easy.

RantyAnty · 18/11/2019 13:04

When he's at work does he have a short temper, swearing, throwing things around and throwing them in the bin?

Thingsdogetbetter · 18/11/2019 18:19

Do you really believe that none of his exs ever told him why they were breaking up with him? Not one told him he was lazy? Not one told him he was aggressive and angry? None of them? Ever? How about the friends he never sees? Or his brother he rarely sees? None of them have ever said anything? He's managed to behaviour like this his whole life and NO ONE has ever said anything?

Come on, admit it to yourself. He's been told. Again and again. Now you've told him. And he STILL sees no reason to change. The best he can come up with is he'll TRY to hold it back. Not deal with the reasons he's so angry. Or stop taking things out on you. Just 'try'.

If he can change for children and realises his behaviour would be shitty to them, then he could change for you and realises his behaviour is shitty to you. But he won't cos he doesn't care enough. Do you really think he'll suddenly flip to a decent human being for kids? He's supposed to love you and he's not willing to do it for you! Why would it be different for dc? Are you going to risk having dc with a man who makes promises for the future, but can't be arsed to actually prove anything first?

FizzyGreenWater · 18/11/2019 18:38

he said to me that when the kids arrive, he would step up and until then he wants to rest and chill because when there are kids of course he cannot do it. He said that if kids need something, then he knows he must provide it to the kids. That he wants to be a good father to the kids. And if needed, of course he can handle everything and take responsibility and make commitments.

Total, total, total bullshit. If you are daft enough to stay with and have kids with this aggressive, insecure, childish specimen then you'll bitterly regret believing this.

Everyone, EVERYONE is telling you to leave him. He isn't 'untaught' - who taught you to be a decent human being with a sense of perspective, eh? Parents yes partly, but mainly just BEING NOT A TWAT. He's not some poor helpless specimen in the raw.

He's just a bit twatty, a bit nasty, not really very clever or mature.

Move on now or you will have a poor old time of it.

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