How did you know it was time to stop trying?

[Adviceneededplease19]

Feeling very sad tonight.

I’ve been with my husband since we were 18 & 19 so 15 years this year. We have 2 children, a lovely home, he works full time, me part time, a holiday abroad each year and on paper it would look pretty good.

And yet at the moment we are living like flat mates. Flat mates that have to share a bed as there are no other places to sleep.

Most days there are snippy words or digs at each other. Not much gratitude, respect or affection between us.

Other days there are big massive rows to the point the children cry and beg us to stop shouting which I know isn’t healthy for any of us.

Other days are fine. We laugh, we go for dinner, just the usual couple things.

The trouble is this goes on a cycle, a few weeks normal, few weeks ok ish then a bitter, horrible shouty stage.

Neither of us has ever mentioned leaving or splitting up. But it’s got to a stage where the atmosphere is bad.

How do you know where you get to the stage where it’s not worth trying anymore? I can’t imagine how I’d feel if we weren’t together but can’t imagine how I’d feel if we split either. But I know I don’t want these arguments to carry on as it’s not good for anyone. I used to think that because I still cry about the shit times it means it’s still worth fighting over. But now I’m not so sure.

Firstly , and

Not a nice place to be in at all. Have you tried talking to him about this in terms of it being a problem for both of you, that you can solve together? Not an easy conversation.

I would also suggest contacting Relate - you might not end up going to relationship counselling, but if you do decide to, they can take a little while to find a suitable appointment.

Definitely try counselling.

Would it be worth counselling though when the same cycle keeps happening despite multiple discussions on how to salvage things? I’m so tired of this shit to be honest. Feeling unloved, unappreciated and basically useless

Poor you. It sounds horrible. I'd say counselling has got to be worth a go even if it just helps you to split up in an amicable way for the sake of your kids.

If you're going round and round in circles yourselves, a counsellor might be able to help with ways of breaking that pattern. Otherwise, they may be able to support an amicable split. It's worth a go, surely?

Yes. I was in a similar position. Gave counselling a good go. Things are still shite. At least I know I gave it my best shot.

I’ll put the idea to him and see what he says. All I know if neither of us are 100% happy as it is

You need to talk about it together.

Nothing will be resolved without this.

You need to talk about the things that are making each of you unhappy, and whether you want to do something about them.

This is important for future relationships even if you do decide to split.

During our counselling we learnt some really useful communication tools that really made me aware of the dynamics of our relationship (husband is basically the parent and I’m the child). Unfortunately in our case the communication and dynamics have worsened instead of improving but I now know that I really did try. Married/family life is really tough and fighting for your family is so worth it. It will take commitment from both of you though xx good luck OP xx

I could have written that! Apart from the fighting! We don't argue really. But I totally get it and like you I'm wondering where to go from here and if it's worth fighting for. I've been trying to figure out where we started drifting apart, I can see some unresolved issues that may have led to walls going up and both of us starting to check out. Can you pin point anything?

A major one for us, like most couples id imagine, was having our first child. He was unplanned and I was in my final year of university at the time. It was a complicated pregnancy as well resulting a 9 nearly 10 week early birth. That put a lot of pressure on us at 21 & 22. But it calmed around the time he turned 1 and both mine and our child’s health was 100% ok. Then after we got married and wanted a 2nd child we had 4 years of trying and multiple losses to then have a 2nd complicated pregnancy. Add to the fact I had a pretty traumatic incident happen about 18 months before I met him that really did change my life (as in move half way across the country for my safety and no longer able to see one of my parents as they were linked to it) I don’t really cope with emotional situations or stress well and just retreat till all blows up big time.

But it all boils down to us being unable to cope well with stress and pressure and not being very emotionally mature. I initially wondered if that stemmed from us both never having had partners before each other so we hadn’t had that life experience but now I’m not so sure about that.

I read your post and want to give a big warning to those who remain in marriages like this because of the children. My parents had a similar "cycle" to their marriage. Fine, not so fine, bloody awful, shouting and screaming and then back to fine. It had a terrible impact on me. I was one of the children in the OPs post who would cry and ask them to stop shouting. Can I just ask you guys who think you are doing a service to your kids by staying in an unhealthy marriage that you are not doing anything but imprinting in a sub conscious level to your children that this is what marriage is. I am in my mid 50s and never married. The imprint of me crying and begging my parents to stop shouting is there in the background and reading this post has made me so sad for the OPs children having to go through this. Please separate, find peace, solace and grounding and teach your children that this is not how a marriage should be.

Wow OP. Your recent response definitely gives some ideas as to why you and your partner are struggling. You've been through so much it would be more surprising if everything was fine! Definitely counselling to talk about how those experiences have affected you. Even if you still end up splitting up.

litterbird I’m well aware it affects my children, that’s why I want to sort it. I’m from a broken home but it was all very swift and amicable and I only remember them arguing once. Then they split and it was pretty calm and they totally did the right thing splitting.

But I think we are in a different situation. Fundamentally we love each other we just are each struggling at the moment.

I’d never stay together just for the kids, I’m well aware happy parents make better parents.

I do wonder sometimes if it all comes back to me and my emotional shortcomings from what happened to me at 16

HI OP.

There was a lot in your last post... It sounds like you both follow particular patterns in your relationship and the cycle you describe is a product of that.

I would definitely suggest couples' coaching or counselling. If your DH won't go then go for yourself anyway for some individual coaching. It could change everything.

Good luck x

I really hope you sort it swiftly and seek counselling and mend your relationship either way. Please make sure that all future raised voices and arguments are kept well away from your gorgeous children. The cycle can be stopped whatever way it stops either from therapy or separation. Just a plea I make for you, your husband and the children.

It sounds like you haven't actually tried as such, yet. You sound like you still like each other. There aren't other people involved. You just need a reset button and realising what you mean to each other. There is hope for you both, if you both want a happier version of what you have now. Counseling would really help you.

to the point the children cry and beg us to stop shouting
This is not good OP, but you already know this!

I think you need some counselling on your own to come to terms with happened to you at 16.
If he struggles too then he needs some counselling.
Your whole adults lives have been with each other.
Neither of you have had the chance to 'find yourselves'
That has a huge negative impact on relationships.

Would it be possible to have a trial separation?
Each work on yourselves and then see how you both feel about each other.

This isn't currently working for you, for him or for your DC.
Some drastic measures need to be taken to tackle all of this.
It's not going to be easy but you need to do something.

I really don’t feel a trial separation would work. I’d worry he was off seeing other people / having a physical relationship with them seeing as we’ve only ever been together. Irrational I know as he could do that now if he was interested.

In the past we've talked about what we wanted from the relationship, how to change things for the better etc etc but it only lasts so long.

Counselling would help I think as it could pinpoint areas we haven’t though of perhaps.

Something has to change though as the atmosphere at the moment is so bad in the house you could cut it with a knife.

I’ve never considered counselling for my past experience as on the outside I’ve always said how fine I am etc and come across as quite cold / hard faced about it all but it’s still hard all these years later. Thank goodness for my lovely parent who’s stuck by me against the other parent.

And any ideas on how to convey to him that I’m not wanting to be physically intimate because I feel unloved? He seems to think we’re not being physically intimate because don’t love him. If that makes sense he can’t seem to get his head around that for me sex and love are so entwined but he seems to think no sex means no love. That’s another massive cause of fighting which I guess is the same for many couples too

What @litterbird said. Arguing parents is as damaging as hitting children. My parents used to scream at one another in a similar cycle and sometimes not talk to each other for a whole week. It makes children feel fear and shame. You need to both stop it or separate.

I don’t think you really appreciate how damaging your relationship dysfunction is to your children. I am surprised that your main reason for not trialing a separation, is the possibility of your H having a relationship with someone else.

If you want things to change you have to start doing things differently and It’s very clear that neither of you are equipped to deal with your issues on your own.

Counselling, solo and couples are a very sensible option.

Any recommendations for counselling organisations please?

He’s out tonight with our eldest child. I’m feeling so bloody low about it all I could cry