Seeking a female viewpoint...

[thebrainygoldfish]

Good afternoon,

I'm interested in your views on my situation as I am having some trouble wrapping my head around what going on.
I'm going to paraphrase quite abit but the total time line is about a year and a half, but the accusation happened back in March.

-¦-

So my long time girlfriend and I split up.

In the following months I became really close to her best friend. The feelings were mutual and we connected like nothing I have ever experienced, she is really special.
Tried to keep it quiet but my ex found out.
Ex meets new man (nice guy!), now engaged.
Her mate and I continue to get close - its a slow dance and I respect her wanting to take it at a crawl.
Next thing I know I was accused of raping my ex whilst we where in our reationship. It is completely untrue, an out and out lie - This woman was my world for 9 years!
Of course she told her best mate, who instantly killed any chance of our friendship going anywhere - despite applied logic pulling her accusation apart.
I lost my entire friendship circle (of which she is still part)
It has destroyed me emotionally and caused me to contemplate suicide and try once.

Although they have never said directly to me I am told my 'friends' have since questioned the accusation as even the police aren't interested. (aparently she went to see them)

Fast forward to now and whilst I occasioanlly see my friends, I still am unable to socialise with them, stuff happens where I once would have been invited but now not.
The woman I had feelings for I see reguarly and we talk I'd say we are 'ok', and my feelings for her are still there.
I am told (not by her i might add) that we will never be anything more than we are because of the rape accusation - despite pretty much everyone else knowing me knows its a lie, know I am not programmed like that.
'Old fashioned in a 35 year olds body' I was once told - I see it I was dragged up properly (holding doors open, being polite, no drugs, no cheating, flowers on a first date kinda guy)

So my question is why? why would she believe it when others don't? This woman is supposed to know me better than anyone, she's seen me fat, thin, happy, sad, angry, drunk & sober and yet.....
What should I do to try and fix our friendship if nothing else? Is there anything I could try?
Also what would any singletions think if a guy told you, pretty early on that hes been accused of rape? (Im suspecting run a mile)

I am waiting on a appointment to see a counsellor to try and rebuild me emotionally as I am really struggling, having been a quick twitted pretty intelligent, pretty funny guy with all the confidence in the world and the ability to talk to women, I am now a overthinking husk, bearly hanging onto which way is up.

Thanks

I would definitely believe my best friend if she told me something like this, no matter if it was several months after (it took me about five years to tell mine about my sexual assault, by someone I was dating). I might not believe it from someone more distant to me, depending on the circumstances, but my best friend, someone I've been closer to than anyone else for years? Of course.

So it's not about why some women would and some wouldn't believe, it's about her trusting her best friend. I would also say that somehow, for whatever reason, she can imagine that you could do it, I think she would probably question more if she believed it just wasn't in your nature.

Having said that, I'm not sure about this "not in your nature" concept, with regard to you or anyone. A violent sexual attack is one thing but the kind of blurred line, coercive incident which more often occurs in relationships - I think a lot of guys could do this, because a lot of guys don't actually quite understand consent, particularly in a culture where men have been taught to make conquests, to seduce, to "get" a woman to sleep with them.

I'm not saying this is what happened, I have no idea and no one ever really will, but I can completely understand why your ex's best friend believes it and also think it's possible something happened that the two of you see differently. Either way, you won't be able to convince her, so you will have to let it go in relationship terms.

"Your need to make others do things your way , is palpable."

I read it as a need to convince people that he's not a rapist. I think I might feel the same if I was wrongly accused of something similarly heinous and had to watch friends, family and work colleagues look at me differently.

He's on here asking how to broach the subject with women he dates, and how to salvage an important friendship. I imagine 'they'll think you're a rapist no matter what you say or do and run a mile so stop trying to control them' is quite hard to take.

hellodarkness, i agree with your last comment, in fact, I considered whether to write anything at all, as i would hate anything i wrote to contribute more to push him over the edge. However, he has asked for female perspectives on this situation and that's what he's getting.
I'm sure it's not what he wants to hear, but hopefully with the counsellors help he can rebuild his shattered self confidence and find a way to move forward and perhaps, having more insight into how vulnerable women can feel and how these misunderstandings around consent can arise, may help him with future relationships.

Sorry, I meant your last sentence, hello

As much as it is quite grim at least you are getting a real representation of what many women will think.

My recommendation is to ditch everyone and move to another part of the country and hope this accusation doesn't follow you there.

The woman I had feelings for I see reguarly and we talk I'd say we are 'ok', and my feelings for her are still there.
I am told (not by her i might add) that we will never be anything more than we are because of the rape accusation

You sound like you are deducing her thoughts without actually asking her. If you were so in tune and special to each other, you ought to be able to sit down and talk about whether she wants to have a boyfriend/girlfriend relationship with you. If she says no, then there could be a variety of reasons why not (it's possible that she might never have wanted that sort of relationship-even before the accusation- because she didn't want to get with her best friend's ex, because she didn't want to be seen to be getting with her best friend's ex, or maybe she just doesn't fancy you).
You can ask why not but don't expect an answer, and remember the answer she gives may not may not be the real one, or a logical one, but don't push it- she doesn't owe you an answer.

She also does not owe you a relationship, so don't try to persuade, explain, filibuster or guilt her into "giving it a try", or assume that she will change her mind over time. No means no...right?

Its difficult OP because women sort of have to believe each other with this sort of thing.

Honestly? I was raped once by a friends boyfriend. The only reason he had an opportunity was, frankly, because "everyone thought he was a nice guy" and I never thought in a million years he'd do that to me. I learnt my lesson, I dont trust men at all anymore, I take women's witness as much more likely and always err on the side of caution.

Does that make.me a bad person? No, it makes me a member of a subordinate class who is more vulnerable than she'd like to be.

You've no idea what its like being female and knowing that even a man you trust could easily rape or kill you.

Let her believe what she wants, move on and try to find a partner among the literal billions of women who are not friends with your ex.

Very few women lie about being raped OP.
I think you have to move on from all of them and make new friends.Your done with this lot totally.

I'm not sure why some pp are determined to believe that op must have done something to warrant the accusation

Because 99 times out of 100 they have. Shit for the 1% but shitter for the women this happens to. Having had more than one close call with a few #niceguys who absolutely believe they are innocent, I wouldn't touch someone accused. Not in a million years.

Sorry but I would be the same as her OP.

A lot of the times You hear "he was such a kind/normal/good looking guy" when someone is talking about a rapist, so while you think she knows you and have this amazing connection, it's not something I would want to risk at the start of a relationship.

She did kick boxing as a fitness regime and knows how to look after herself. (confirmed having been on the end of her right hook once during a sparing session)

I know you're putting these details in so we'll see you as the Nice Guy you are but...lots of women here will have been raped or had experiences that with time and age they think were actually a bit rapey (so rape but we call it that to maintain our sanity). I think very few of those women will have ever thought 'if only I'd known kick boxing'. You seem to think that rape is something Very Bad Men do to Helpless Women. It's not really helping your cause.

As to the 'new person' thing, I can't see why this accusation would follow you around if it is all put to bed. But if what you say is true 'my vengeful ex said I raped her because I was trying to shag her best friend' would probably cover it.

Your on a lose lose here I’m afraid.
If my best mate told me she’d been raped I would believe her. Sadly

If you are genuine you have really misjudged the tone of the relationships board on MN in coming here for reassurance. This board, had you looked, you would see is thread after thread of women being mistreated, hideously, by men and their families. This is not an ‘innocent until proven guilty’ place.

Anyway. Answering your question based only on what you’ve said. I’d say she’s gone off you as whether she believes the rape accusation or not you were in the fun, light hearted early stage and an accusation of rape kills that dead. To ‘stand by you’ she’s have to be really certain you were ‘the one’ and totally innocent. When the fun stopped she probably decided that being with you was too much of a sacrifice (her whole social circle?) and understandably backed off. She’s just not that into you.

I genuinely hope your counsellor helps. Good luck.

You need to move on with your life and forget this girl whether you like her or not. Maybe she has spoken to your ex about the entire relationship and doesn't like what she heard, regardless of the rape accusation. Besides the allegation this girl is way too close to home, it was always going to cause problems. Get some counselling. Acknowledge that we can't always be with someone despite wanting too and try and move on to a happier, healthier relationship

The OP's comments do raise issues for me.

Firstly, just because someone is "old-fashioned" or is the "flowers on a first date, kind of guy" doesn't mean that someone can't be a rapist.

Also, I found the comments about the alleged assault disturbing. It wasn't that the OP could never do such a thing, respects women etc. It was that he wasn't late for work and that she also does kickboxing. Victims often freeze when being attacked, also as she was at her parent's house, maybe she didn't want to upset her parents? Maybe she didn't realise she'd been raped. Many victims don't even realise until after the incident or they block it out.

I think the OP needs to watch his behaviour and look at how he has possibly committed this act. I don't buy the "nice guy" act. I think the OP has come on here for some kind of justification but I've seen too many of these stories. I work with victims of Sexual Violence and so many perps see themselves as "nice guys".

Your friend feels differently about the accusation to the rest of them because she has a lot more to lose if it turns out to be true. They're not at risk of you forcing yourself on them, she could be.

As for how I'd feel if a guy told me early on that he'd been accused of rape, yeah, I'd almost certainly cross him off my list. Really soryy, I know it's very unfair, but see above. I would have a lot to lose and I wouldn't want to risk it.

There are others who might feel differently, so don't give up.

Well he fixated on he wasn’t late for work, because most people would fixated on the part of the story that proved they didn’t do something

Someone says you raped me and then you were late for work due to that. I might concentrate on the fact I was never late for work too.

I really think for your own sanity choosing your partners best mate as your new flame is a very bad idea. Of all the women in the world you chose her? Please get out more, find new friends and potential new partners. If you are such a great catch at 35 you should have no problems.

@user1479305498 Totally agree with you. I don't know anyone personally this has happened to but I know it happens. Look at what happened in Celebrity Big Brother this year, the false accusation by that Roxanne whatever her name is from Emmerdale, she near enough tried to destroy Ryan Thomas's life if that don't convince others that women are not only capable of lying but manipulating then nothing else will.

OP sounds like your life has been blown apart and that's awful. If I was you though I'd cut all those so called friends out of your life and look to make some new ones they clearly aren't friends and as for your ex's best friend as much as it probably hurts I'd forget about her and start picking up the pieces of your life, hopefully counselling will help you do that. I'm sure at some point the truth will come out it always does in the end but in the mean time just focus on you and sorting your life out.

I believe the current stat for false allegations is 4%. This 4% include those where a statement was withdrawn (for possible intimidation), the Police decided there was no crime and for a multitude of other reasons. The likelihood of an actual false allegation is minimal. Plus the "I'm a nice guy", "she is physically strong" excuses? Sets off all the warning bells for me. If I was the friend I'd be supporting my friend and also breathing a sigh of relief that I'd avoided a potential rapist.

OP sorry this all sounds awful for you. I hope the future will be better.

This means the woman was never into you. Dump her. Get her out of your life completely.

In your shoes I would investigate suing your ex for slander. You may get a written apology, as a settlement.

I have known men falsely accused of rape.

If the facts as presented were told to me, I wouldn’t accept them as a given fact, particularly if the couple stayed together after the “rape”.

You have lost a past, as in your past is not going to continue into your present.

Yes you could look at it as a loss, or you could look at it as a fresh start with new friends and new connections.

People do lie, they lie all the time about all sorts of things. If you have not done the things you have been accused of then there is absolutely nothing to worry about, just understand that you’ve seen the darker side of a human-being and that some of them are incredibly messed up.

It probably feels like the most grave of injustices, but is it really? Now you know the centre of these people, are they really any great loss to you? If they never allowed you to tell your side of things and did the ‘guilty before proven innocent’ trick, i’d say they were never your friends to begin with.

Move onwards and upwards. Infact, why not move jobs, move towns, make a new life for yourself and let bygones be bygones.

You’d have been interviewed by the police by now if there was any real evidence, suspicion or belief by them that you did indeed do this. If they have not even interviewed you... that speaks volumes.

I've known more than one woman lie and make it up. Sorry op, the fact that you're Male on here usually goes against you regardless of the situation.
Bin them all off. Don't move away as previously suggested (unless you want to) you are the victim, you shouldn't have to run.
False accusers make things harder for real victims.
Good luck