Is he just rude or....

[NC19892]

So I’ve been with my partner for 7 years, we have a daughter. Recently we have been experiencing issues and started therapy, much to his dismay. Ever since we started this anytime he walks into any of my families homes he won’t talk to anyone, not even a hello, not to my mum and yet all of them have been nothing but nice to him dispite his treatment of me. He’ll walk into the homes, straight past everyone and just nothing as if he owns the place then will speak once they ask him how he is. I have brought it up to him and said it’s out of order.

My question is he just being a rude and sulky twat or could it be his way of coping?

Yes he is being a rude cunt and I can't see why your with him or even taking him to your families homes.

He is only coming to my families homes as we aren’t currently living together while we go through therapy so comes to see our daughter.

But the lack of respect for my family and myself in him doing that is just beyond.

Yes, he’s rude.

He is an ignorant twat. Your family are very tolerant.

I would not allow his behaviour to continue.

Tell him he finds his manners or he is no longer welcome to meet at your family's home.

No excuses, he’s pig ignorant

What? So you've started joint therapy?

Could it be he feels exposed and that other people know about it?

We are in couples therapy yer @Fronette.

At first I thought maybe it’s because he feels exposed, but then I realised he went back to being fine.. it’s seems it is when I’m not doing something that he wants that’s when he won’t talk to them and will just be rude. I mean if you really feel exposed just say you know what I can’t be around your family at the moment. His family try talking to me about our relationship but I still say hello and ask them how they are, am I comfortable with it, no, but I can’t walk into someone’s home and not say hello

He's pissed off because he doesn't have control under someone else's roof.

Why are you in counselling, and presumably you used to live together?

I smell red flag soup!

We did used to live together, in therapy for a whole bunch of reasons but to summarise lack of

Respect, I have caught him sexting in the past and just basically his selfishness.

And perhaps @Closetbeanmuncher, my family and close friend have said they think he is a manipulative controlling twat. Only went with counselling to give it one last attempt

He's incredibly rude. No reasonable adult acts this way in another person's home, most especially when it is the home of your wife's loved ones.

I'm not sure whether it's possible to retune your brain and learn manners at his age, but I have my doubts. Seriously, what an rude idiot. Sorry.

I'm inclined to agree with them NC, he sounds vile.

Sounds exactly like how (ex) DCs father used to behave (the rudeness), and unfortunately for me that was only the tip of the iceberg. Best decision I ever made ending the relationship.

My worry for you is that he will make the right noises during therapy whilst still remaining a poisonous twat underneath. These types are very good at putting on a show (when it suits them).

@Closetbeanmuncher, if you don’t mind me asking was your ex a bit of a my way or the highway type of twat (and by highway I mean grind you down or pacify you to still get their own way).

Mine is and I’ve slowly realised this fact and also how his needs/wants and imagine come before our daughter. For instance he took our DD around the PIL house, not a problem I suggested it but I also told him to make sure she keeps well hydrated (she is bf but weaned and will sometimes refuse water as she wants milk, which she won’t take from a bottle or beaker) and that she is his main responsibility if she is extremely upset to bring her back. She was gone 3 1/2 hours, only drunk under 150ml and her nappy was dry, she was quiet and just totally out of character! I said why didn’t you bring her back if she was upset and not drinking, his response ‘oh she was fine, she had 4 wet nappies today’ (this was at 5pm). My problem is I’d leave him right now if I could, but that really made me question if he’d put our DD first. Like I love love my family but if I need to do something for my DD and it means a visit to them is cut short that’s what I have to do.

This is more than just being rude OP. It is part of his manipulation and control of you.

He wants to create a wedge/tension between you and your family so that you feel so uncomfortable being around them with him that you will gradually stop seeing them altogether.

If you are isolated, you are easier to control and abuse.

My abusive exH was like this, even though my family had gone above and beyond to help him out he refused to speak to anyone or be civil.

He's an abusive controlling arse, counselling will not help as these men cannot change. Not ever!

The sooner you realise you have to cut your losses, the better.

P.s these men are terrible fathers. They are entitled (what you describe as rude) and lack any sort of conscience so dont feel guilt or remorse when they treat you terribly (they are good at faking remorse if they think the game is up though). They are also highly selfish so basically the complete opposite of what it takes to be a good parent.

They see other people as extensions of themselves, including their children. They cannot see you as individuals with your own thoughts and feelings. If you dont comply with his demands, he will punish however he sees fit (silent treatment, rage etc.) Don't be naive enough to think he wont treat your DC the same way. He is incapable of love in the true sense of the word. The way he sees it is that you only exist to serve him, cater to his needs and make him look good.

I was never able to leave my very young DC with exH because he was too selfish to take care of them properly. I eventually stopped contact all together as he was abusive and controlling to them too as they got older.

The sooner you stop all expectations of this man ever changing, ever being a good father, ever being a good partner, ever being a reasonable, respectful, responsible coparent, the better. I'm 16 years down the line (10 years out of the marraige) and he only ever got worse, not better. These men are bonkers and no matter what you do to try and please them, they keep changing the rules so that you can never win.

He is an emotionally abusive twat of the highest order.

P.P.s I can almost guarantee the sexting was the tip of the iceberg.

He is a narcissist, who are ALL prolific cheaters and very skilled liars.

Read up on narcissism OP and also read Lundy Bancroft 'Why does he do that'

OP, first watch this and see how much you can identify with (I bet most if not all)

Then watch this (coparenting with a narc)

I know this will be so painful to accept and my heart really goes out to you. Trust me, I've been there and I'm so sorry you are stuck with this man as the father of your child. xxx

@Jaffacakesaremyfave, I have thought in the past the he could be a narc especially now we have DD. It just always seems like she has to be giving him attention or behaving in a certain way to please him.. Christ he doesn’t even like her making a mess when eating or dropping food on the floor and she is only 7 months. He also thinks there is an issue with her social skills because she cries at strangers and because of this she should go to nursery soon . Also hates me breastfeeding, especially in public, god he gets really snappy when I do that.

As for the setting, I always suspected he done more than that but couldn’t even prove it, just a feeling in my gut. To be perfectly honest I don’t really give a shit anymore it’s all about making sure DD is safe.

He really does sound like a typical narc. He lives to get his ego fed and wants to project the image of the perfect father without actually putting in the hard work of parenting. He even expects your DD to feed his ego (can't cope with her crying, expects her to behave perfectly at all times, to give him nothing but affection). Meanwhile he is incapable of giving any her any real emotional support or affection. They are really just empty hollow souls who suck emotional energy from anyone who they come across. The more you learn about what motivates narcissists, the better equipped you will become at handling his behaviour when you have to coparent. The best method is grey rock. Do not give him any sort of emotional reaction as this is what he feeds off.

His dislike of you breastfeeding is probably because he is jealous of you giving your attention to anyone but him (and yes that includes your DD). I suspect that's why he wants to send her to nursery, so he can have you to himself or at least know you are not bonding with her when you are together. Please dont listen to what he wants as everything he says is for his own agenda and not your DDs.

It's really difficult for you OP because alot of this is impossible to prove to the court system, so you may struggle to demand supervised contact only. I certainly would try and limit any time he has her on his own as he has already shown you he is incapable of putting her needs first. Also, just her witnessing the emotional abuse towards you will alter how her tiny brain develops (studies have shown this) and she may be very likely to seek out abusive men when she is older if he is able to have unlimited access to her.

In some ways it is easier for me as my exH was also physically abusive to me so it was easier to 'prove' abuse, plus he is also in prison now so I have managed to cut contact completely. My children have all been left with emotional problems though due to the abuse they witnessed to me and also what he inflicted in them. Emotional abuse can be just as damaging and harder to recover from than physical so I am glad you are finally recognising this for what he is.

Does he show any coercive behaviours that would fit under the new coercive control laws? If so, gather as much evidence as you can.

Men like this become particularly nasty over child contact arrangements (it's about control and not about them wanting to see their child). They will tell outright lies about you to anyone who will listen to make you appear as a bad parent or that you are maliciously stopping contact (smear campaign) and trust me, when they know there is no chance you will take them back, there are no limits to how low they will go. Prepare yourself for this because when you kick him out he will be plotting his revenge and you need to stay 2 steps ahead at all times. Unfortunately the courts rarely recognise this type of abuse and will give men like this many many chances. I've seen it happen way too often.

Good grief, OP, why are you with him?!!

@Jaffacakesaremyfave, well not only does he want to give off the imagine of being a perfect father in his mind he really does believe he has he being one. If I say otherwise then it’s either my fault or is untrue.

As for coercive control and things I could prove, there isn’t really to be honest. I mean nothing I could really prove! He can be sexually abusive I.e. touching me sexually when I have asked him not to, we haven’t had any sexual contact for quite sometime. But things I can prove financially I have been very independent, had a lot in savings.. he did try and persuade me not to go back to work and be reliant on his income but I wasn’t comfortable with this. He had tried to tell me how to spend my money a couple of times and that put me off, especially as it was for DD. Or tried to get his Mum to talk to me about where I should work and sending DD to nursery but again it’s things I can’t prove.. nothing in writing! I did buy a recording device just to prove to myself I wasn’t crazy but in a court not sure how that would look, me recording someone without their knowledge.

@AFistfulofDolores1, I have no idea at this point. I was just keeping him onside as I know I’ll have to coparent with this twat

Yes, they are deluded and genuinely believe the shit they spout. They all think they are amazing at everything, should be treated as the most superior intelligent being who can never be wrong and anything you say, they view as a personal attack against them. He will never accept you're right, even if you are.

He sounds like a covert narc and what you just said about wanting to record him to prove you're not crazy is a very common thing said by many covert narc victims.

I used to think courts wouldnt allow private recordings to be submitted as evidence but it turns out they do! Different situation but my ex covert narc harassed me for months after I ended our (very short) relationship. Right before he got arrested, he called me (and recorded the conversation without my knowledge) offering me 10k to drop the case. He then cut out the bit where I told him to fuck off and submitted a transcript in his defence accusing me of extortion and the police accepted it. Apparently you can use any evidence that will help your defence but that's criminal cases.

Maybe visit a solicitor now and see what you can do to help your case if you want supervised contact. Write down every incident where you dont feel he has given your DD proper care and any emotional abuse (name calling etc).

When things turn nasty (and they will when you leave) you may be able to gather more evidence if you refuse to see him or communicate in person and do everything through email or a third party (your family for example) who could also act as a witness if it came to it.

@NC19892 - But you'll never get him on-side, let alone keep him there. I think the hardest part right now is giving up all hope - but it is absolutely essential you do that so that you can start making some healthy decisions. The best way you'll be able to co-parent with him is to approach everything pragmatically. No hope; no emotion; no fear; no need to be 'nice'. You might need therapy to support you to achieve this. In fact, I think therapy would be a really good idea.