Ex refusing to return kids-now wants to take them abroad

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Hi again, following on from my thread about my exH refusing to return the kids (he returned them after police and SS involvement), he now wants their birth certificates so he can obtain passports to go abroad on holiday.
My gut instinct is screaming no but I'm possibly not being rationale after the events of last week. He's had them twice since then and I've been terribly anxious that he'll pull the same trick again so the thought of him having their BC and taking them out of the country is making me horrendously anxious.
WWYD?

He should have no access that isn't supervised.

he cannot be trusted.

Cut access and get courts involved. Show them evidence that the weasel is going to mess about, poor kids, the father sounds extremely unstable and has issues. He is not safe imo.

Surely there is something you can do as this is kidnap surely. No pun intended

unless he knows your passport details he cant apply for passports for them or vice versa, but if he has no connections overseas its probably a holiday no more. I read the thread and its as much the dd's fault so perhaps he hopes a holiday will help her

The problem here is trust. At the moment she's saying she doesn't want to see him at all.

I was on your last thread. There's no way I'd be allowing your Ex to take the DC out of the country. I'm with PPs - get the DC passports and keep them.

Surely he realizes that you're never going to trust him again?

But she didn't want to come home to you, previously! she's very mixed up at the moment, not sure if her going abroad with her father is a good idea, even if his intentions aren't dodgy.

He can order their birth certs online if he wishes. They are public records. I'd move fast to get passports before him.

I'd agree to it, send off for the passports myself ASAP and then if he mentions it again tell him yep they've got them. Then wait for the holiday booking - which I bet will never appear.

@QueenOfTheCroneAge I know 😩 I've told her if she wants things to change then she has to be prepared to tell those who can change things what she wants. She's terrified of upsetting her dad. Won't even talk to the pastoral lead at school in case they tell him.

Just in case you are unaware: You can apply online for passports now. No need to get paper forms from the post office anymore. I believe you can take your own digital photos now too (the system has changed dramatically since our last passports). However, ours were a renewal, not sure if this is different for a 1st passport.

Thanks. I phoned the passport office and I need to send the original court order so have to do a paper copy it seems although the guy wasn't sure. I could apply and see if they ask for more info.

OP, I’ve just been back and ready your previous thread. You are absolutely awesome and of course you are going to question things. In time your DD’s will learn the truth and see how other fathers are with their friends and know it’s not normal

Ok, expired passports found. Relief.

If I obtained new ones and didn't tell him and he applied, what would happen?

I applied for my children’s passports. I didn’t need to send the residency order or anything else.

My ex will never be getting his hands on them!

@Frith2013 did they ask any questions or need more documents? Was it paper or online?

I did the first one on paper (have been a single parent for 14 years so have renewed them a couple of times).

I just left the “father” part of the form blank. I always get the new photos done at our local photography shop (only a few quid) so I know the photos will be ok.

You can get the passports before he does and frustrate him that way but there’s no legal way of stopping him from travelling abroad with them. If he takes the passport issue to court you would probably have to hand them over and it would reflect badly on you for any future court proceedings.

Just to clarify when I say ‘no legal way’ I mean without a court order.

Well that's cheered me up, thanks.

If their passports have simply expired its really easy doing a renewal online. I only had to send the old passports in the post. You can do it all online including uploading a digital photo. Sounds like you would need to send the court order too. Should be straightforward

For a child passport you still have to print it and send it off by post

You also have to send in the original court order

LesLavandes that is not true. I completed my daughters renewal in march and it was an online process. I simply sent over the passport. I did not have to print it off. It may be that you have to print and sign if it is the first passport but certainly not a renewal

I can only repeat that 3 times I haven’t needed to send in the court order.

LesLavandes the only court order I had to send was one confirming that my ex had no parental responsibility and wasnt allowed contact. That was to prevent him trying to leave the country with him. I wouldnt imagine any other order would need to be sent if the father has contact