Is this cheating

[Audrey1607]

Hi there, looking for a bit of advice. I have been married for 19 years, together for 23. 2 kids and what I thought was an adoring husband. Something just hasn't been right in our life for a while, lack of sex, no usual chat etc. He keeps his phone quite tight to his chest but does plug it in at night. He has a passcode so I don't snoop but have seen a couple of messages come in from a girl at his work. Anyhow, he left his messages open one day and I had a snoop where there were relatively ok messages from this girl, she is 21 years old!! Nothing dirty but these messages seem to get deleted as quickly as they are written. I know the girl in question and don't think she would be interested in my old man but why is he deleting the messages. He has also called out her name a couple of times in his sleep. He is one of these guys that really ogles young girls and makes negative comments about older females. I feel so sad and old right now. Do you think it is cheating if you are hiding messages?

i would call him out on this behaviour and i think the final straw would be hearing him say her name in his sleep. he sounds obsessed and even though nothing has physical has happened, its shitty and disrespectful that he is apparently giving this obsession head space.

Unfortunately, i also agree that it sounds like he would try to take things further if he could get away with it. i'm so sorry to say that as i know its upsetting.

i doubt he is a raging lecherous 50 year old man and if he is professional and successful its not likely that he is going to fuck up his work reputation by being an obvious love struck idiot. In fact i'm sure its very subtle and that he feels undoubtedly there is an attraction, hence initial messages.

Id also bet he still is good looking and appealing but this is about his ego (probably knows he gets a bit of attention from ladies in late 30s/early 40s and wants to see how far he can go with more "desirable" young women) and lack of respect.

His trying to say its nothing is a load of bullshit. i also dont feel comfortable with him saying that you're mental, its such an unintelligent, pointless thing to say.

as for leaving for a women in her early 20s - well he's unlikely to do that.... sorting out the finances of a divorce is tricky unless you have a load of equity and ability to mortgage a bit to make up the shortfall of 2 new houses!

i'd be watching closely and seriously addressing the "mental" shit he is spouting.

How fucking inappropriate.

He is one of these guys that really ogles young girls and makes negative comments about older females.
And you call him an awesome husband & father?
You are deluded, he’s a sleazy sexist pig, what example is this to your DC?

@bookworm4 Not saying that making disparaging comments about older women is at all correct but I reckon talk is cheap, and unless he says this to undeserving women/ he supports this with actions of disrespect, then who among us has not said something mean in jest or when we are in a stroppy mood?

Maybe it needs some clarification from Original Poster as to the range of comments.

I don’t know anybody who is perfect all hours of day. If someone doesn’t have a visible weakness (minor ogling without the person noticing) or say the odd rude thing, then I’d be wondering what lies beneath.

There are far worse personality traits than these, but fair enough, these are absolutely relevant here since the colleague is a younger woman than OP, who is in comparison, older.

@Isthisseesaw
unless he says this to undeserving women/
Are you excusing his behaviour? As long as it’s women who deserve to be insulted?
OP said he ogles women, is insulting, please stop trying to excuse a mans vile behaviour, would you like your DH behaving like this?

Because he can. Would you expect your child to put up with this in a relationship? He sounds like an absolute arse, you deserve better. A lot of ‘charming’ people are wonderful but behind the scenes they are deceitful amongst other things

Funnily enough this bashing of older women op describes I've only ever seen in mysogynistic older men.

I would be completely turned off by a man who viewed women as consumables that come with a best before date.

Definitely not somebody I would want to spend my life with....at all!

Something could still happen between them.
Her being 21 and beautiful doesn't mean she might not have a low esteem issue and may turn to a 50 plus guy.
He's probably hoping for that day.
No advice other than this could get out of hand, be prepared.

I would not see this as a huge problem, lots of middle aged handsome.and amusing men,have a sort of midlife crisis,and are popular with young women.It sounds as though he is popular in his work place too.Lack of sex might well be down to his age,but he still might have dreams of something that he considers exciting. Obviously people see as wrong when married, but it happens to lots of people,men and women.

It sounds like limerence.

The danger is that he is making a fool of himself in the workplace. Also he could be making a pest of himself. He wouldnt be the first and wont be the last senior person in a company who has lost his head over a 'bright young thing' in the work place. If and when accusations either of inappropriate behaviour or favouritism get made he could be in a lot of trouble.

I wouldnt see the secret messaging as cheating but I would see it as a prelude to cheating. He may see it as a harmless fantasy but I wouldnt be sure that if the opportunity to act on it came along that he would turn it down.

He is one of these guys that really ogles young girls and makes negative comments about older females

He sounds utterly vile.

You are not wrong to have boundaries and to enforce them. In fact , you need to do this for your own self respect.

I find it really odd that you don't think the young women notice his ogling behaviour - don't you remember being that young woman?!

Also, I know you are afraid of rocking the boat and don't think he'll act on his attraction.

However, many people do cheat, and don't think about the consequences or, (as I suspect in his case), are complacent that their spouses will stick it out. I get the sense you put up with a fair amount of disrespect and eye-wandering already. It's not that big of a step for him.

You need to fire a warning shot at least and challenge him about what he's doing. Don't count on your situation together being too good for him to risk. The cock speaks convincingly.

If you're really thinking about just letting it go, you need to shore up your self-worth. I don't think it's good for you to put up with his attitude to women day to day and this on top, it's going to drive your self esteem through the floor.

You like your life and you don't want to upset your sons, but honestly he is cheating - emotionally yes, but to me it's not much different from physical cheating. He's thinking about her, she's obviously responding to his crush, he's got her name right there in his head when he is asleep.

It might not be worth leaving immediately, but I'd certainly speak to him about it. Tell him you're sure he is having an affair and see how he reacts . Good luck.

Thanks for the messages MsDogLady and Needsomebottle, much appreciated. Sorry to hear that you had a similar situation to myself and it saddens me to hear that you have been putting up walls as this is exactly where I am up to right now. We barely spoke last night and I went to bed after him to avoid contact. He was glued to his phone for about an hour, smiling and giggling at which point I asked who he was speaking with and what was so funny and I don't ever do this. It was apparently a work group chat and then reeled off some silly answer which wasn't even funny. He looked shocked when I asked him, confused almost. I asked if there was anything that that he would like to tell me, good or bad and mentioned that I was feeling a bit insecure right now. He is a bloody good liar, said loads of nice things, things that I would have believed before and appreciated him saying but I know now that this is all lies. He didn't even look guilty so is obviously really good at pulling the wool over my eyes. Has he been lying to me forever? Is this his thing? Do I even know this man? It is our sons Birthday today and should be a really happy time, I thanked him this morning for giving him to me (I do this every year on their birthdays) and almost spat the words at him. He also said that I looked nice this morning (not unusual) but my reply was how many girls do you say this to in the day? He knows that I know something, he has to. I messaged him yesterday and called him by the pet name (shortenend version of his actual name) she does in the messages, I never call him this and he even asked why I was saying it which I found a bit amusing. Panic must be setting in. I also mentioned wanting him to perhaps get in touch with me via message a little more during the day, to let me know that he was thinking of me etc. I gave him a couple of pointers, of course these were compliments that he had given to the girl at his work, exact word for word things that he had said to her. He is a clever man, he will know I know something and am getting closer to blowing his life up. I am going to continue bringing her up over the next little while so that he definitely knows I have an idea. I am hoping he comes clean so that I don't have to continue on down this route. Will see how it goes. Right now though I am considering leaving him and want him to feel hurt like I am

Anything hidden is something to worry about.

Just to clear things up, when I say negative comments about women...he doesn't say these things in public or in front of anyone else and wouldn't dare to say it in front of the lads. Just little comments to me or little pokes in the ribs to look at something about older ladies (40+) which of course I am so perhaps I am sensitive to it. Things like, bit too big to be wearing this or did she look in the mirror before leaving the house. It's always aimed at older ladies and they always look really good to me. I then start questioning my own dress sense or checking to see if my butt is too big for these white trousers etc. etc. I mention to him how bloody rude it is when he says these things and have said that when he does it, I feel like he is having an indirect dig at me because I too am in this age bracket but he replies that I am a different kettle of fish and that I am perfect. AGAIN ALL LIES OBVIOUSLY!

He doesn't say them in front of other people because they're for you. It's deliberate, don't want you being too confident, does he?

Yes, I often think that he says things to get a reaction from me. I am 47, size ten and keep myself in shape by running a lot but have the little belly thing going on and am not as pert as I once was but am in no way competition for 21+ and nor would I want to be. Too much like hard work. I have always felt very confident and happy and now I feel old, unattractive and sad. He has really blown it with this silly nonsense. I am so over it already and getting more angry by the second!

OP I am in my 60s and a good size 16 - and I'm told I am (and more importantly feel) attractive! the fact this man has caused you to feel old, unattractive and sad at age 47 is horrible. Don't let him do this to you.

"He is one of these guys that really ogles young girls and makes negative comments about older females."

Or what is more commonly known as an arsehole.

@bookworm4
You’re right, it was my poor choice of words when i really meant to say that there weren’t enough details to determine if what he says is poking fun or simply misogynistic. I sometimes look at handsome younger men in appreciation, and sometimes make comments not entirely fair about older men in overtly flashy outfits and fast cars, without intending to indirectly insult my own husband who is older and not as handsome.

But that aside, it now looks like OP’s husband is rather enjoying the extra attention from the work texting, whereas in earlier posts he might have just been texting / replying as a friendly colleague.

Power imbalances can be trippy. Extra attention and nudge-winks from senior colleagues can also be flattering.

Why not return to the original pattern of turning up at the workplace and pee on your territory OP? I would do that myself, on top of the heavy hints. The using of pet-name somehow pisses me off, it’s intimate in such a casual way and unless it’s used by the other colleagues, I’d find that disproportionately annoying. Good luck with what you’re doing OP.

Hey, no worries at all. I probably didn't make myself clear enough. I was just spewing out everything in my head lol. I did think about popping into his work again and peeing on my territory (love that phrase) but I don't want to appear like I am checking up on him which would be what it looks like. What if his colleagues are aware of the situation and look at me in pity, that would be awful. No-one else calls my hubby by this name, nobody at all calls him by this name apart from the other girl in question and now ME. Today, I started a whatsapp group for just me and him and called it "Our Group Chat for 2" another little indirect dig at the situation last night. He has been replying and sending cheeky messages. Perhaps I just need to dominate his time for once.

Isn't all this giving him extra attention kind of doing the pick me dance? Now he has two females calling him pet names and messaging.

Yup, got the wife on her toes alright.