What do you do about miserable/needy friends?

[DirtyDennis]

I'm going to sound like a complete cow here.

Basically, I have a friend who's downright miserable. She has, at every stage of her life, taken very active and brave steps to do what she's set her heart on. But each one of these seemingly positive steps leaves her miserable with the situation (i.e. the situation she's very carefully crafted for herself).

We meet up every month or so for lunch or a drink. We seem to spend the whole couple of hours with her complaining about whatever thing is making her most miserable, and me suggesting solutions that she always has 100 answers as to why the solution wouldn't possibly work.

It's not just draining, it's actually boring and really selfish. She asks about me (most of the time) but I'm a pretty happy person so I just generally say I'm fine and that's it. I'd like us to just chat about what we've been up to, where we've been, what we've watched on TV but our get-togethers seem to end up as quasi therapy sessions for her.

I'm starting to distance myself a little bit but just wondering if others have had similar experiences and how you handle this.

Well you’re very lucky that your life has turned out so well. Isn’t that what real friends do? Support each other? Are you just wanting to be a fair weather friend then? Me and my best friends always have a good old moan/therapy session when we get together. Gets it all off our chests. Glad you aren’t my friend! She asks how you are and all you say is fine? Sounds like you’re the boring one!

That is a very spiteful response, @mybeebop.

Tell her to join Mumsnet.

Sounds like she needs some therapy really, but your conversations about telly etc sound pretty boring and everything is fine dont sound less boring than heart to hearts. Maybe youre just not compatible. You like small talk, she likes to talk about feelings

I would skip the meetups for awhile. It wouldn't be bad if it was once in awhile but every time you're together, it would be draining.

There's having a moan and then there's dominating every interaction with your own troubles!

It reminds me of that Julian Fellowes quote that people in your life are either radiators or drains. I would (and have) phase out people who do this. I am more than happy to support friends in times of need, of course I am, but life is too short to spend it with Debbie Downer.

Are you my friend @DirtyDennis?

I haven't experienced exactly the same situation, but I did have a friend who was always having "crises" and constantly needed helping out.

The annoying thing was that these "crises" were partly through her own choices - she'd married a workaholic and worked part-time herself, but she didn't arrange adequate childcare; she had elderly, parents, but didn't want her siblings to help out (she has several nice siblings), preferring to be a martyr and try to do everything herself...the list goes on.

Like you, I got tired of her constant neediness and distanced myself. I'm happy to help friends out, but I like to have a laugh with them as well. Constant moaning is boring!

If you want to stay in touch, suggest doing a fun activity with her next time so she can't moan constantly (museum, spa trip, etc.). At least you'll be doing something you enjoy, not just listening to her woes!

A couple of my friends would've told you the same about me OP. However what those friends didn't understand was that I suffer with depression. Sometimes very badly. Maybe your friend just needs a leaning post now and again? Not someone to offer a million solutions but just someone to listen. If you don't want to do that then just end the friendship. I'd be gutted if one of my 'friends' felt like that about me and was voicing it like that..

Its an interesting question.

I saw my mother last week. At one point I went on-and-on (and on) about a problem I was having. It was actually quite cathartic. We don't even get on that well. But she cares in her way. And she put in a few positives for me, even if it was how sorry she felt I had to deal with this.

But I couldn't really do this to a friend, at least ALL THE TIME. What friend has two hours for your just to go on-and-on? I think friends can deal with some things, I'd hope a friend could come to me with her problems. But then I'm a great listener with lots of shitty life experience.

Friendships probably generally should be more balanced. So there's time for fun and laughter as well as crap.

I suppose thats why many people see counsellors. I'm one of those people who is fairly self-directive, but a counsellor can give me the space to find my voice, so to speak. And its confidential.

Sounds to me like there's no balance between Fun and being a Counsellor. Good friendship should have a bit of both, no? I understand what mybeebop is saying, but OTOH, you are a friend, not a dumping ground, thats totally unfair too ...

Don't know the solution though. You could bring it to her attention. But OTOH people like that can be hard to change. Did you ever have "fun" together? What did you, or do you, get out of this friendship?

dominating every interaction with your own troubles

^ this to me is the key, as Daffodil points out so eloquently.

Just to be clear, I didn't mean I wanted to meet up and just chat about TV or whatever. What I meant was that when we meet up it'd be nice to just talk about mundane things as well rather than every meet-up being like a therapy session wherein she tells me all about her many emotional turmoils and nothing else

@CrispPacket

Yes, but using a friend as a leaning post EVERY single time you see them is a bit much, isn't it? Friendship is a two-way street, not a therapy session. Everyone goes through phases when they need support, but there have to be some good times together as well.

I don't tell friends my problems all the time, we need to have a laugh as well.

she sounds like she has no self-awareness, OP.

maybe some entitlement?

I don't know.

You could meet her next time, and take an "observational role". See if she is even interested (in you). Just chill and live through it. Try and take a back seat and see what is really going on in the dynamics (including yourself) ....

I think that's it, I'd love a more balanced relationship with her where we can have a laugh and talk about nonsense stuff but also talk about her emotional problems.

I'm a good friend when my friends have crises and need someone to talk to. I just can't do it all the time. We end up covering old ground, I keep suggesting the same changes.

As PP has said, part of what frustrates me is that so many of the situations she's down about are completely of her own making. When I suggest that she changes the situation there are always a thousand reasons why that's not possible.

Did you ever have "fun" together? What did you, or do you, get out of this friendship?

These are really good questions. We used to have a good laugh, yes. There were a gang of us and we used to have an absolute scream. The gang broke up as we all moved in separate directions and we were the only two left. We still had a laugh but not as much.

I don't really know what I get from the friendship if I'm completely honest.

If the traffic only ever flows one way, that is not balanced. Have you tried managing thebconverstion inndirections that are less demanding?
Do remember, a therapist or a analyst has someone to talk to to where they unload the emotional burden of talking to people about their problems?
Who listens to u OP?
When someone dumps all their negativity onto u, that hangs around and doesn't just va ish from your head.

Also, therebis nothing wrong with wanting a conversation about books or films or anything else. There is more to life than someone elses dilemmas and problems. Lend an ear by all means but if it's only one way traffic then just take a step back . You're not a cow but neither are you a septic tank for peoples stuff

If she monopolises the conversation with her problems of course you will tire of hearing about it all no matter sympathetic you try to be. Shooting down your helpful suggestions suggests she just wants an ear. That's okay occasionally but if you find it wearisome maybe stop meeting up.
I have a couple of friends with whom I feel able to share anything but it depends on what's going on in their lives at the time.

@lolaflores You've really hit the nail on the head. It's like being an emotional sponge for her with no-one to wring me out. When I get back from lunch or a drink with her, I'm always crabby and moody for a couple of hours (DP avoids me!). I always thought this was just because I'd had a big lunch or a drink and then walked a couple of miles home but actually I hadn't really connected that to our friend dynamic.

I’ve got a few friends who use me as free counselling and how I feel about it completely depends on three main things: how much I care about them, how much I feel they deserve sympathy, and what (to be blunt) “good value” they are in other ways. Does that make sense?

So for example a friend who has MH issues or family bereavement might be more “deserving” - they are having a hard time and need an ear. This is NOT a science or even fair necessarily, it’s just how I feel subconsciously. And then there’s whether they have other wonderful qualities - e.g. if someone needs to have a 2 hour moan but also often makes me laugh or is very interesting as a person, or suggests fun activities for us to do together. I’ve got all the time in the world for people who I love, who really need a listener, and/or who have great things about them that make the friendship worthwhile.

If none of those things are there, perhaps the friendship is just at an end?

Was dealing with a friend like this up until a few years back.
Conversations would go like this
Her: Talks about how much she hates her job
Me: Listens, makes joke, provides sympathy
Her: 'Hates people at her job*

Me: Sympathy then 'did I tell you I was thinking of getting a rabbit?'

Her: 'and Cassandra is a pain too because she never works'

Me: 'I'll have to think on it further though
Her: 'Yeah. Ok. And jim is really annoyng'
Me: *Guess she doesn't care 'Oh that's not so good'.

Like the convo always came right back to her (miseries) and sometimes she would do what she did above and ignore me completely. She also never bought the tea/coffees and I was always treating and she would constantly bring me down if I had good news ect…

Anyway, one day we had a convo like the above and it struck me how laughable it all was. Like, this person isn't my friend, she just feeds off my energy to make herself better by bringing me down. And I just stopped contacting her. Luckily we'd been distancing for a while and i'd just come off facebook so it was easy enough to drop the friendship.

I'd stayed so long because she'd been a friend at work (well we'd been put together on day one and just kinda stayed hanging out) and i'd known her a while and I knew she 'had struggles' ect ect (excuses excuses). But I finaly just realised - she doesn't have struggles at all, she IS the struggle. She creates these shitty situations for herself so she can moan and bring other people down because she is a miserable and selfish person.

Stop making any excuses for her, if she is a selfish 'friend', get shot. And don't feel bad doing so! x

When I get back from lunch or a drink with her, I'm always crabby and moody for a couple of hours (DP avoids me!). I always thought this was just because I'd had a big lunch or a drink and then walked a couple of miles home but actually I hadn't really connected that to our friend dynamic

She's dumping a load of energy into you that your then have to get rid of as it doesn't belong to you. Positive energy is good as you can burn that up quite easily and happily. Negative takes a little while to dissipate and if you're really unlucky you have to purposely remove it.

If I have someone to offloads regularly, I prefer to let them do it on the phone. Then you can potter about doing housework and not absorb the misery in the first place. I personally would bin off the meet ups unless it's in a group.

You might not like hearing this, but in this dynamic it absolutely takes two to tango and you are essentially enabling her long moans/rants by offering suggestions and leaping into 'lets fix all your problems' mode. I'm not suggesting you want this or are conscious, but I think you are doing it. So you have both fallen into the routine of she moans, you listen and offer suggestions which she shoots down. It's a well worn groove and you've just stepped into it.

Ending the friendship would be a shame when what you actually needs are some boundaries and to step back from a care-taking role. She is an adult and has to take responsibility for herself.
You are also perpetuating the dynamic by just saying you are 'fine' if she asks how you are, so she's probably oblivious to how you feel. I bet you could steer things back to a more equal footing by being more vulnerable and fallible with her and opening up about your own emotions, while also not taking responsibility for fixing her life problems. Otherwise you risk ending up as a bit of a friend martyr yourself, silently seething rather than saying how you feel and then suddenly disappearing when you can't take it any more. If you communicate better and follow the steps outline above I bet you'll have some success, although she might be rather shocked at you growing some boundaries and also leaning on her with your own stuff. Worth a try though, right?

Im always crabby and moody for a couple of hours

haha yes I remember this! well, for me it was more of a sad, low mood where I didn't want to be around anyone. Yeh, definitely get shot of these sorts, they are emotional vampires.

@RhubarbTea You're completely right!! I find it quite hard to be vulnerable though because, to be honest, I am completely fine. I am happy with life and I actually don't have reason to complain. In the past when I have had stuff that's not 100% brilliant, this friend kind of catastrophises it and makes it seem much worse than it is.

For example, she came around when I was in the middle of having some major work done in my house. I turned her round at the front door and we went to the pub instead. I was covered in dust and soot. It was fine, I was happy the work was being done but obviously I was bit like "Ugh, it's a bloody nightmare" and started off-loading about all the very minor setbacks etc. All very lighthearted. But then she turned that around to how this was the reason she'd never buy a house, it's too stressful, it's too expensive etc. Just like bringing it right down.