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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Morally wrong to set up a fake profile ?

40 replies

DoraTheExplorer3 · 06/03/2019 19:17

Totally ready to get flamed for this.

I have a friend who is a single mother, always getting into horribly abusive relationships. 3 abusive relations after the other and that’s aside from dating all those horrible men .. affected her kids and her so badly but she always managed to flee with her kids from pretty bad conditions.

Her problem is that she is very trusting.. she doesn’t read cues very well and she somehow is very easy to manipulate and a people pleaser. She gets pressured to move things very quickly and is scared to put her feet down. She has gone counseling but I still think she needs a lot.

She has ended up with people who lied about being divorced/single. Lied about their age. Lied about their job... so many silly things...

She has been constantly involving me with her online dating to get my opinion on whether someone is a liar or not. I always support her..

There is this guy that contacted her that seems decent on the outlook..

I got fed up and asked her what she thinks if I opened a profile and pretended to be a single woman and asked the guy questions that she asked him and see if he has inconsistencies. It’s still very early on and they haven’t met.

I admit it was a moment of being crazy. I didn’t think it was morally right. But my other, usually very apprehensive friend, egged me on and thinks it’s not morally wrong so long as I don’t lead the guy on with a fake account. And I wouldn’t do that to a random bloke only to someone who has contacted my friend - as a vetting process.

This is out of character for me , so I’m quite prepared to be told that I’m batshit.

OP posts:
Original poster
DoraTheExplorer3 · 06/03/2019 19:20

The phrase two wrongs don’t make a right springs to mind. I’m still in brainstorming stage so not Sure what my position is about this crazy idea tbh

OP posts:
thenightsky · 06/03/2019 19:27

Go for it. Me and some mates have done this in the past and caught out some shocking liars.

SummerHouse · 06/03/2019 19:28

Not morally wrong. You are a kind friend looking out for another (with good reason). HOWEVER I would probably be a bit reluctant to do this as you clearly are. Wish I could come up with a better suggestion though...

lifegoes · 06/03/2019 20:03

My friend did this once, she caught her own BF cheating. Awful, she even managed to keep it going over a few weeks and he begged to meet her. When he turned up she was stood there. He didn't understand and then tried to lie why he was at this place until she showed him the messages.

Only problem was, he then told everyone she was a nut job and had trapped him. Typical. So be careful for when/if it proves true.

crappyday2018 · 06/03/2019 20:18

You're not really doing any harm are you? Just don't take it too far or let it go on too long. Find out what you need to know and then delete. I would do it.

category12 · 06/03/2019 20:27

As long as you're not stringing anyone along, I don't see anything wrong in chatting to the guy.

It doesn't sound like she ought to be dating at all, tho. Has she done the Freedom programme?

OrangeJuiceandArmchairs · 06/03/2019 20:51

I think it's quite a good idea actually.

I catfished an ex once. Pretty bloody easy tbh

Candace19 · 06/03/2019 22:13

Can't she just not date for a while ? Sounds like she could do with a break from it !

SlightlyMisplacedSingleDad · 06/03/2019 23:47

Yeah, it's a bit psycho. Hell, it's a lot psycho. If I met someone and then discovered that she and her friend were doing this, I'd run a mile. To me, it tells me that you / she are suspicious, controlling, and stalkerish. Immediate "hell, no". If she is like that at the start, Christ only knows what a nut job she would prove to be later.

Bbang · 07/03/2019 04:03

Hmmm I don’t know about this one! On one hand it’s really ‘out there’ on the other it makes some sense if not a little stressful!

I’d probably do it to protect her but have some strict rules in place to ensure it doesn’t go too far.

Original poster
DoraTheExplorer3 · 07/03/2019 05:02

Thanks a lot everyone, I wasn’t expecting that many encouraging replies.

You are right she is better not dating for a while and have been convincing her. However she seems adamant as she is insecure about her age and feels determined that she can find love, she is in her 50s.

“Yeah, it's a bit psycho. Hell, it's a lot psycho. If I met someone and then discovered that she and her friend were doing this, I'd run a mile. To me, it tells me that you / she are suspicious, controlling, and stalkerish. Immediate "hell, no". If she is like that at the start, Christ only knows what a nut job she would prove to be later.“

Funnily my friend in question thinks the same. Thanks for giving a male perspective. I wonder whether most men would think that.

I just think that, giving the bigger picture and seeing how the world is now and the amount of liars, would’nt it be less of a “stalkerish, controlling , suspicious” and more “precautious”.

Would you not do this for your daughter if she was dating online and you didn’t know which creep she was gonna end up with? Especially if she is the vulnerable kind?

Technically she doesn’t even know the guy and never met him, why on earth shouldn’t she be suspicious?

OP posts:
Milomonster · 07/03/2019 06:31

I think it’s fine but where would it end once she starts dating? OLD is NOT for the vulnerable.

Avallamp · 07/03/2019 06:50

I think she needs to be sceptical rather than suspicious. OLD requires a thick skin. Part of the "fun" of OLD is discovering that other person, not investigating them.

NameChangeNugget · 07/03/2019 07:10

Life really shouldn’t be this complicated.

I think it’s a weird idea. A real head fuck to anyone decent

cushioncuddle · 07/03/2019 07:16

I think it's wrong and deceitful.

If he turned out to be a nice guy I would expect him to stop seeing her if he found out.

I certainly wouldn't carry on seeing someone if that was done to me. I'd just think they were odd and should apply for Jeremy Kyle.

Your friend should fix her problems not elect others to have to be the victim of them. That's what you're making this bloke.

cushioncuddle · 07/03/2019 07:16

Expect others

Original poster
DoraTheExplorer3 · 07/03/2019 07:27

Your friend should fix her problems not elect others to have to be the victim of them. That's what you're making this bloke.

I know what you mean. I think I slightly am still on the fence because I am not sure how unfair it is on the guy.

But to confirm, I don’t intend to be romantic. I don’t intend to have more than like 2 separate conversations just asking general questions. I won’t share too much personal details or try to lure him or anything. Just a generic profile of a standard person, no fake photos or anything.. just to establish some sort of understanding of whether he is worth considering.

So “initial stages”. Questions about his general profile and status, questions about what type of relationship he is after.. but hoping that since I have different criteria on the profile than my friend, that if he was a liar, he would change answers and I could catch his inconsistencies. (I.e catch a manipulator).

I’ll have to be decent enough and brief so that if he does turn out to be honest and things work out, if my very/transparent friend ends up telling him about it, he won’t be tooo creeped out and hopefully understand.

OP posts:
Original poster
DoraTheExplorer3 · 07/03/2019 07:29

So it wouldn’t be long enough for the guy to develop any sort of feelings and unleashed his romanticness (ewww I’m already creeped out).

Also being married myself, I’m obviously going to involve my partner and don’t want to creep him out lol. So it’s gonna be very limited and suttle.

OP posts:
shinyNewPound · 07/03/2019 07:46

This is madness. Don't do it. You asked if we would do this for a daughter and my answer is hell no! That is some massive boundary crossing behaviour. If your friend has poor judgement about potential partners then I think OLD just isn't for her. You can't protect her from arseholes. What if you gave someone the green light and he turned out to be worse than all the others? Lying isn't the only indicator that someone is an unsuitable partner.

SlightlyMisplacedSingleDad · 07/03/2019 09:10

@DoraTheExplorer3 - I do understand the concerns about people in OLD not being who they claim to be (not just men - it's a problem that we face with women as well. Possibly more so, since OLD is riddled with fake profiles for women / bots etc). And I get that safety is a really important consideration for women (more so than men, since the risk is higher). So I guess this is coming from a well-intentioned place. But I still don't believe it's an acceptable way to behave. You asked if I would do this for my daughter(s) - the answer is no. It would be teaching them all the wrong lessons about the world.

Think about the premise that this gets a relationship off on. It is one of mistrust, and of setting traps / tests to catch a (potential) partner out. That is not a healthy foundation for any relationship, however new. In fact, it's the kind of behaviour that is a hallmark of abusive relationships (trust me - I've been there).

So, if I won't teach my daughters to deceive somebody they meet, what will I teach them? I will teach them that it is right to be cautious when you meet someone new. It is right to take things carefully and slowly, and to get to know them properly before rushing into things. It is right to set and maintain boundaries, and to call time on it if those boundaries are crossed. It is essential to be on guard for red flags. It is right to take safety precautions, such as meeting in a public place.

It is not right to set traps. It is not right to lie to people. It is not right to catfish. It is not right to approach a relationship from the attitude that "this person is a liar and a cheat, and must be guilty of something until they can prove to me that they aren't".

I will teach them that no relationship will bring them joy and happiness until they have found that within themselves. I will teach them that the most important thing in their lives is an ability for them to look in the mirror, and to love & respect the person looking back at them. And I will teach them that our actions matter - the choices we make every day about how we treat people, define us. There are some bad people in the world. But you don't protect yourself from that by becoming one of them. And, unless you are ready and willing to meet the world with an open mind, honesty, and decency, then you aren't ready to date. Because treating people badly isn't an acceptable way of preventing yourself from being treated badly.

It sounds like you're going to do it anyway. But you and your friend might want to think about who you want to be, before you set out to do this. It's those boundaries again. I know myself to be a decent and honourable man. Any woman I met who starts from an assumption that men are bad, has an attitude that I don't need in my life. And one who set out to entrap me and prove that I was 'bad', through deceit, is not a woman I want in my life.

Bookworm4 · 07/03/2019 09:15

Here's a thought, why doesn't your friend give dating a miss for awhile and concentrate on her kids who she has been dragging through one drama after another in her pursuit of men. She sounds very selfish and needy, I pity her poor kids.

Musti · 07/03/2019 09:19

God no. What will it prove anyway? What if he's abusive but spins the same tale to everyone? I mean why would he give two women online different tales? If he lied to one he would lie to the other one. So the only way to catch him out would be to continue chatting and see if he's lying to your friend whilst talking or seeing you. And what if he's not a cheat but he's controlling? How will you suss that out with two conversations?

No, aside from how wrong and weird and creepy it is, it won't get you anywhere unless you are prepared to go a lot further into it. But two normal conversations is unlikely to tell you anything.

Original poster
DoraTheExplorer3 · 07/03/2019 09:20

Bookworm...

Now that’s a big assumption on your part. She did give dating a kiss for a long time , until her eldest reached university and her youngest was a teenager..

“SingleDad” no I haven’t made up my mind, I honestly am giving everything you say great consideration. I do want to hear from a mans point of view.

I wasn’t just hoping that knowing her circumstances, the decent/honest man that will manage to make it with us to the end would forgive her for just an innocent precautionary measure.. which she will probably end up telling him.

Had things been reversed, and a man did that to me in the way I am thinking (only one or two conversations about basic questions), I feel like yes it will make me an uneasy but if he explains that this is not something he would do in a relationship but that because I’m a total stranger he wanted to make sure I’m not a liar, I think I would be uncomfortable at the lack of privacy but can overlook it as a necessity.

OP posts:
LetsSplashMummy · 07/03/2019 09:28

I can't see what you can achieve if it's only introductory chat. He's not going to admit to be married, just out of prison, the recipient of multiple restraining orders... is he?

Time better spent might be encouraging her towards the freedom programme or going with her to a hobby where she might meet someone IRL.

Bookworm4 · 07/03/2019 09:32

Not an assumption; you stated all the disasters and awful situations she's been in. If she's unable to make a decision herself maybe OLD isn't for her.