Am I mad I’m still hoping I can get him to change?

[NameyMcNameChange1]

This is going to sound really petty but it’s driving me mad to the point that I’m genuinely considering leaving him over it.

Basically I can’t get dh to communicate with me unless I ask him really precise questions. So for example if I’m changing dc’s nappy and I say ‘can you just grab me a nappy bag?’ he won’t answer. He may not have heard, he may be wandering around looking for one or he may be about to pass me one. But if I ask him again, or say ‘dh did you hear me?’ he’ll get really shitty with me or say I’m talking to him like he’s a child. Or I’ll happen to say ‘oh, we’re running low on bread’ and that also won’t get any reaction whatsoever but then I’ll notice 10 minutes later he’s walked out of the house and gone to the shop to get bread.

Dh claims he doesn’t respond to me because I just constantly think out loud (I don’t think I do at all) and if he responded to everything I said there would never be any quiet at all. It genuinely drives me to tears of frustration. I feel I can’t ask anything. He works away four days a week (usually it varies) and if I speak to him and ask him if he’s coming home on Thursday he’ll say ‘probably, no reason why I shouldn’t be’ or something non-commital but if I ask for more specifics it’s controlling. Is it actually controlling to want to know what day my dh will be home?

I asked dc1 to turn his switch off earlier and he didn’t answer. I asked him again and he shouted at me saying ‘for God’s sake, I’m doing it!’ It’s exactly the reaction dh has whenever I ask him anything twice and I just went ballistic at dc and sent him to his room. It’s not his fault, he’s copying his dad, but it’s not an acceptable way to speak to me.

But I don’t know if I’m nagging. I feel like everything I say is just whinging. But no one listens to me and I just feel so fucking invisible.

I’ve told him so many times how much it upsets me but he always just makes out that I’m a chatterbox and nagging. I just need to him to bloody talk to me. He’s not going to change is he?

Nope
He sounds like a knob and he's not going to change

The "oh were running low on bread" I can see why he may think you were just thinking out loud but actively asking him to do something like pass you something can't be mistaken for that so no excuse

Its not meant to be this difficult op.

No, hes not going to change. You basically have to accept him like this, or walk. Or, stay in the marriage and try to change him and go mad in the process.

This all sounds pretty familiar to me. Maybe not, but it may be that you both need to change. I have to say that I'm now divorced (and glad that we split for other reasons), but looking at it in the cold light of day both ex-H and I were failing to communicate successfully well before things got really bad.

It is (very) American, but I'm a big fan of the NVC (non-violent communication) books by Marshall Rosenberg. Unlike some of the other relationship books /communication books I've read they're really helpful even if the other person in an exchange isn't 'playing by the rules' so to speak. But also - hopefully - if your DH sees that you're not putting all the blame on him, and are also trying to be constructive yourself he may be more willing to look at his own behaviour.

He’s a massive cunt it’s not you and I’d stop talking to him and find a grown up to have a relationship with, seriously the man is an arse

hannah sorry I wasn’t clear with the bread comment. With that I wouldn’t really expect a reply but I would expect him to tell me if he’s going out of the house. I’ve often come out of the shower to find my 3yo and 6yo on their own downstairs and dh just gone. Maybe I’m being overprotective but I just don’t think that’s safe. I’m not saying I always feel I need to be in the same room as them but I need to know if I’m responsible for them at a particular moment.

sadik what would you say I need to change about my behaviour in the situations I described above? I’m not saying I’m not doing anything wrong but I just don’t know what it is that I am doing! Being told I’m nagging just doesn’t help because all I’m doing is asking him a question. If he answered I wouldn’t have to ask again in ten different ways because I’d have the information I need.

I’d be interested to read some books on communication. When you say NVC does that mean communication that isn’t aggressive/ arguing? Or does it mean literal violence? I try to be as non-confrontational as I can be with dh but it’s like pulling teeth!

He's ignorant plain and simple! I'd confront him over this behaviour tbh..I couldn't live with someone who doesn't listen to me or respect me, who just dismisses me. He sounds awful

That's not normal and sounds beyond infuriating.

The only thing that I wonder may be clouding the issue is if you are now so frustrated by the whole thing that you are a bit naggy, giving him a carte blanche (in his mind) to be even more dismissive of you.

What's his family background like? When you look at his parents communication is it obvious where he learned to be like this? It's not an excuse BTW, just that if he's ever going to change he needs to understand the root of his problematic behaviour and see that if needs changing.

And yes, if you're the sole minder of your kids whilst in the shower you need to be bloody informed at the very least!

Sounds appalling . I wouldn't live with him.

Both my dc can be like this sometimes and they get pulled up on it!

Walking out of the house without letting your family members know or even saying goodbye is extremely bad manners, rude and inconsiderate.

He sounds like really hard work.

I am partially like your H....
My H is a talker. For me it’s way too much air time. I crave silence.
If he asks for smth - I just go and do it, w/o verbal confirmation. Or say - I can’t.
He has on occasion - like you - asked again. And it is, in fact, annoying. I heard the first time.

Thing is - about communication - people are different. And there is no one right way.
Just the same wa he appears to you as non-responsive, his perception of you as a chatter-box, etc - is valid.
It is how things appear to him.

It won’t work if you only want him to change while thinking you are the gold standard. You both need to figure out how to meet half way.

Stop being non confrontational, that’s why he carries on treating you like a nobody because you are blaming yourself on him being a pig?

He walks out leaving a 6 and 3 year old unattended and you worry about how to communicate with him I mean seriously the next thing you say to him is fuck off and dont come back, I can’t believe the shit you are putting up with 🙁

I don’t think I am the gold standard mmmomdd . I’m sure I do loads of things wrong. But I refuse to think it’s acceptable to not answer someone that’s asking you a direct question. He will either do it, not do it or not have heard me but I’m not allowed to repeat myself. Or walk out of the house or not tell me if he’s coming home from work that day so I end up doing everything and constantly responsible for our dc.

"sadik what would you say I need to change about my behaviour in the situations I described above?"

It's very hard to say from outside, but I suspect it's not about the individual situations, but about the whole climate of where you've got to. The 'non-violent' bit of NVC is a bit of a mis-nomer really, it's more about trying to come to conversations from a positive angle if that makes sense?

Of course it's possible that your DH is just a miserable bastard who doesn't care about your wellbeing. But it's also possible (given you got together with him & had a child together) that both of you are good people who care about the other & want them to be happy.

BUT having all the stresses of having a young baby & being tired, probably broke, etc etc bring out underlying failures of communication that didn't cause problems when life was easier.

Completely understandably his communication style is not working for you - but when you try to get him to understand this he hears criticism of himself as a person, becomes defensive and fights back. Getting past this place is the difficult bit!

From my own perspective, ex-H & I had three years of counselling and still split up But, we are on good terms, communicate well these days (we still run a business together as well as co-parenting) and I think both of us can recognise that we mean and meant well towards each other.

On a rather more cynical note - I find the absolute best bit of advice I've ever had on dealing with teenagers is the "11:2" rule. You have to say 11 positive things (no matter how hard it is to find them) to every 2 negative or critical things. That way they're much, much more likely to take the negative things on board. It works a dream with co-workers, ex-husbands and everyone else IME...

I'm going to go against the grain here. I don't think he's doing anything wrong. You've just got very different communication styles.

It sounds as if you need a vocal acknowledgement of everything single thing you say, which would drive me a bit nuts to be honest.

You can't force people to change.

I have to wonder how you ever ended up together if he is this bad at communicating?

Does he have a hearing issue?

It does sound like you are asking him specific questions and yes, I would expect an answer. It's pretty easy to discern what is just thinking out-loud and asking someone something.

"Does he have a hearing issue?"

This is genuinely worth considering. My DF went deaf in his 40s. There was a period of probably going on 2-3 years when DM and teenage me absolutely thought he was pointedly ignoring us, while DF thought we were being utterly unreasonable by expecting him to have heard mutterings / under the breath comments etc. Once he was diagnosed it was a revelation - he had been unconciously lipreading a lot of the time but of course couldn't do that if we weren't in his field of vision or he didn't realise we were speaking to him.

I agree with GreenFingersWouldBeHandy that you can't force people to change. But if you can be really clear with yourself what your needs are that aren't being met, and express those without making the other person defensive / close in on themself, sometimes you can improve matters a great deal.

For example - in the nappy comment, if your DP is hearing "You're away too much, you're not doing your bit, I'm resenting you" when all you are trying to communicate is "I'd rather not get up from changing DC to fetch a bag, if it isn't inconvenient to you could you pass me one" then you're both set up to fail.

@Sadik

Absolutely agree about the 11:2 rule (athough I've also heard it expressed as 80/20%)

If someone only hears (or feels they hear) criticism or complaints, it's far too easy for them to write you off in their head as "a nag", "never satisfied", "a moaner" etc.

If you feel you can't find 8 positive things to say to people before 2 negatives, then try harder! It really doesn't take much, and it can be stuff that they SHOULD be doing. EG it's my son's job to make sure the bin goes out every Monday night, and that all the washing up is done when I get home from work on a Tuesday. When I get home and say "Did the bin men take the blue bin?" and he says yes, then I say Oh brilliant, thanks love, now we won't have to go to the Recycling centre,, which means we've got time to watch a film/go for a walk/play a game on my day off." When he's done the washing up, "Oh thanks for the washing up love, it's so nice to come home to a nice clean kitchen."

I don't have a partner right now, but compliments always work well. "You smell nice today." "I love that shirt, it really suits you and it goes well with that tie." "Would you please do DS's reading with him? You're much more patient with him than me and I know he values your attention."

It is sadly so easy to get into the habit of looking for the problems rather than the positives. It can be tempting to be passive aggressive and refuse to praise anything as long as there are any negatives. But one of you has to break the deadlock and model adult, respectful ways to speak to each other.

I remember an old manager at a place I worked. She would never, ever give praise unless she was trying to manipulate. Her team meetings were basically her reading a litany of complains about her direct reports failings. My first meeting with her, she raised a point about my team and I said "Well with respect, I have to disagree with that..." The three other managers in the room went all wide-eyed and I could see them mentally shouting "GOD NO WOMAN FOR THE LOVE OF GOD NO" Cue a ten minute tirade about how my team were crap and it didn't matter that they'd fulfilled all of their duties and met all their targets, when she went into their office she expected to be offered a coffee and a desk.

When she left the company people were literally singing "Ding dong the witch is dead."

Sorry, long ramble off the subject. OP if he is to change, you must too. (Which is not to say he's not being a dick, and things like leaving the DC alone is not a negotiable point.) Would he consider counselling to help you learn better ways to communicate with each other?

This would drive me nuts too. If your asking a direct question to someone you expect an answer not to be ignored otherwise how will you know if they have heard you.

And the bread thing, I wouldnt leave the house without telling my DH its just rude.
He sounds horrible tbh.

I cant see why he would suddenley change, you cant change people.

DH can be guilty of some of this but he's not such a fucking arse about it when I ask for confirmation that he's heard me - which he sometimes hasn't.

He would never have gone out without telling me, leaving the kids unsupervised, though and times when I have caught him about to go and do something time consuming in the garage on a weekend morning, when I haven't had chance to have a shower, yet, and I've asked him to wait 10 minutes, he's been fine with it.

I think your DH seems to sometimes step over the line from "different communication styles" to not giving a shit, though.

I’m willing to change but I don’t know what it is I need to do differently. I can’t just not ask him what day he’s going to be home from work as it means I can’t plan anything. The only way I can see that would stop me asking him anything that annoys him is to basically assume I’m a single parent and do absolutely everything myself. Which I already do and is why I need him to change if we stay together.

I am struggling to understand what it is you are meant to be changing OP, it's him with the issue about not communicating, he's rude, irresponsible, his general apathy in your direction is awful. I'd stop running about after a person that can't even have the decency to let you know what time he's home after being away four days a week working, it's actually bonkers some of the responses on here suggesting you change....

PS: the more you bow down to his awful behaviour, the more it will continue, stop trying to work him out and turn yourself inside out trying different approaches, it's him with the problem OP.

Sounds like he has checked out, could he be having another life whilst working away?

I have wondered about him having a secret life actually adora! My dm jokes that he’s a spy and that’s why he won’t give anyone any information about anything, ever. He’d be a good spy actually - I could be tortured by baddies and I wouldn’t even be able to tell them what country he is in half the time!

I just struggle with the fact that he’s always said all he wanted in life was a family and kids. He’s got that and now he has absolutely no interest in us. He has always been like this though. I never really noticed it before we had dc though as I never really needed to rely on him. He just doesn’t seem to appreciate how him not coming home from work, walking out of the house with no explanation etc. means that I then can’t do things.

I once got up early and fucked off out for the day. By 10am dh had taken dc’s to my dm’s looking for me, found I wasn’t there and then about half an hour later dm realises dh had just fucked off out!

pissedon I hadn’t really considered that he might have a hearing issue. It’s a possibility. He seems to understand when he’s on the phone to work though. I’m only hearing one side of the conversation though so they may be yelling at him before he actually responds.