Are secret conversations cheating?

[Spitsandfurts]

My husband and I have been having issues in our relationship. I thought we were on the same page about working towards our future together, but it’s become apparent that I can’t really count on that. My issue now is that I have seen messages he has sent to two different women. In my opinion too familiar / friendly but could be brushed off if he had been open about these conversations. He wasn’t. He deleted the conversations to stop me from seeing them and when I asked him about it he lied to my face, got very defensive and said a lot of nasty things about me.

This feels like it will probably be the end of us but I’m extremely worried about what will happen if we split up. He’s from another country and says he will move back there. I’m so worried about the implications for my young son. I would never stop him seeing our son but he once threatened to take our son away, in anger, during an argument. All I wanted was to make our relationship work and for our family to stay together but he’s not even apologetic about anything. He’s blaming me and calling me abusive, manipulative, etc. I don’t know what to do.

Yes I’d see it as cheating, if you have to hide anything like that from your partner then you know it’s wrong! If he lying about it, for me that would be another nail in the coffin and I’d start looking to leave the relationship

I think secret conversations are worrying and his reaction even more so.
Does your son have a passport? If so I’d really recommend hiding it at someone else’s home and talking to a solicitor to make sure he can’t take your son out of the country; it’s unlikely but based on his threat and his extreme response I wouldn’t be taking any chances

And another point, hide your and your sons passport until you decide what to do

Thanks for the replies. The passports are safely hidden and I am trying to get some legal advice on this aspect. I don’t feel that he is about to abduct our son, but I worry how any contact would work in the future. He had been trying to convince me to move to his home country with him and I believe that is because he doesn’t see his future with us as a family, and us being there would put him in a much stronger position with regards to custody.

Is it possible he has an additional passport for your DC, from his home country?

when I asked him about it he lied to my face, got very defensive and said a lot of nasty things about me.

This is even more worrying.

OP I would be devastated if I found similar conversations on my DH’s phone however ‘friendly’.

I also think your instincts about why he wanted to move to his country sound very plausible.

I don’t think he could have another passport.

I’m so stressed out. He keeps saying I need professional help and that I’m a psycho. I know that this isn’t true but when he keeps attacking me like that it makes it so hard to focus on the real issue.

The biggest mistake you'll ever make is moving to his country with him. Don't do it!
He needs to stop threatening to run away with your son to cover up his lying cheating backside.
Stand your ground, get advice from relevant authorities. And well done for keeping your DS' travel documents in a safe place. But please be extra vigilant.

That's cheating op. I wouldn't stand for it.

Ever mind the secret conversations, he’s emotionally abusing you.

Believe me, there is no chance of me going to his country now.

Does anybody know how we would have to move forward if he goes back to his home country wrt contact etc?

The deleted conversations are one thing, the aggression and blaming you and all the other stuff added to the chats just scream 'get your ducks in a row'. You don't sound like you will but just in case don't move abroad with him!
My sister had DN with a foreign national, she went out in holidays etc . Dad was a git and DN has since lost touch with him but has a good relationship with her GPs and step brothers so it can be done.

I’m so worried now about how it will pan out, and whether he will be reasonable.... for the sake of our son.

I want my son to know his father but I’ll be terrified of ever taking him there now. Just wish he hadn’t said such a horrible thing, I would never even dream of threatening to take our son away.

He’s just tried to have another conversation with me. But it basically consisted of him blaming me for anything and everything. He’s still not acknowledging that what he did was wrong so I don’t wat to hear anything from him. I came upstairs and he’s texted me a load of abuse about what I should or shouldn’t do, everything I do wrong and his rights as a father. My head is a mess :(

Now he’s moved on to how this will all affect our son, he won’t be here for him growing up, first day of school, etc.

Him not being around for his son is HIS fault, not yours! He’s the one who’s being unreasonable with his texting, but thinks if he blames you for all, what he considers, your short comings, will take the spotlight of his behaviour. He’s being an anisive twat op, do you really want your dc growing up thinking this is a normal relationship?

No I don’t want this at all. He’s making nasty comments about things I have confided in him from my past. And telling me that I’m ill. And I’m attackingmy child be causing this situation. It’s horrible, I know he’s being unreasonable but how can I make it stop? I told him he needs to leave but I can’t make him.

By causing*

Sadly yes, I’d say it’s cheating. Any contact which has intimate, emotional intentions, feelings is cheating.

Tried talking to him again earlier and it just ends up in a tirade of abuse against me. Apparently I’m abusive and manipulative and I’m being nasty to our son for doing this. He’s talking about going back to his home country. My head is completely messed up.

Let him bling bling and shine on to his home country... What a bluff!
Your head shouldn't be messed up, you've done nothing wrong other than being the rational one in this case.

Yes I think I need to shift my focus onto moving forward alone and keeping us safe. It’s making me feel totally lost and out of control, I just want a normal life and I really wanted to keep our family together but it seems impossible at this point. It’s just blowing my mind that he has even turned this back into me. I’m looking back and doubting everything now. Most disagreements end up being my fault and I have to apologise, but I’ve been 100% loyal and even this is ending with him angry and sulking with me! Makes no sense!!

Those are the actions of a defensive person. He’s feeling cornered so lashes out.
It was the same for me. He would laugh in my face and say I was nuts, paranoid, crackers. Yet every single time I would have concrete evidence. He would still lie and lie and lie. It’s soul destroying. He’s chosen to think with his tiny little ego, dismissing his family. Whereas you have been fighting to keep it together.
You can’t fuck around outside of marriage and reasonably think you should stay together for the kids!!!
Basically he is saying to you, ‘ let me fuck around repeatedly, emotionally abuse you, cheat on you, and make you feel shitty about yourself, just as long as I don’t have to leave and face the consequences of my actions’ Not forgetting the impact this is having on your family.
He’s just a silly little person who’s a bully. Show your children what you’re made of and what a woman is worthy of.
Get rid of him my lovely. You’ll feel more alone in a marriage like that than you actually will by yourself.

Thank you so much for your reply. It's brought me to tears, really hit home. You got it spot on, just makes me so sad to realise that's the truth and there's nothing I can do to change it. Stupid me, even after seeing the messages I would have still given him a chance to sort this all out if he just showed me he wanted it and that he realise what he did was wrong. He gave a half arse apology in the middle of telling me how awful and avusive I am. Telling me how hard it is for him to have to sleep on the sofa, not welcome in his own home, and now he will start his life over on his own. Logically I know that this is his own fault due to his actions, but why do I still end up feeling guilty??? My heart is breaking for our little boy.

@spitsandfurts
I so didn’t want to make you cry. I’ve been in exactly the same shoes as you. It really is soul destroying. But you are going to be ok.
With regards to your son, try and think about two pathways. One path is the three of you together. You the trouble causer, the abusive one, paranoid, spiteful. Your husband is simply just misunderstood and bullied by you ( his presentation of your family unit, definately not mine!!) Your son, growing up, watching the 2 most important people in his life wilting under the pressure of ‘we must stay yogether’ He of course will learn from you both. What will he be learning? How should a husband treat his wife? How a wife allows herself to be treated this way, losing her confidence, self belief, independence.
Your son relies on you to be strong for him. For he to be your focus, not the turmoil your dh shoves down your throat. Any child thrives their best in a stable, warm, happy, environment.

Your 2nd pathway is without your dh. Tricky to begin with. He can from now on, only hurt you with words. You’re scared of losing him because you don’t feel good enough about yourself to deserve anyone better than your dh.
Your son wil thrive as he watches you find yourself again. No more conflict at home for you or your son. You make the rules, you share the fun with your son. You wouldn’t be a woman who’s lost her dh. You’ll be a woman who has found herself again. Your son will grow up nurtured by a strong woman who feels worthy of being treated with kindness, warmth and love. Show your son how he’s to treat women that cross his path in life.
Your dh meanwhile will most likely flit from one conquest to the other. But I promise you, he will never stop feeling lonely. You on the other hand won’t be lonely, you’ll be available in time for somebody far more worthy of you than your dh.

I don’t know anybody who has walked away from men like this and regretted it. He’s putting his women before his wife simply to boost his ego. Not only that, he’s destroying you in the process. If he continues destroying you, you’ll never be the best version of yourself, or the best mum you can be. Kick his sorry ass out, brush yourself down and claim the life you so rightly deserve.