Controlling ex husband won't let kids meet new partner

[theDrake]

Dear all, please can you help with some advice - please excuse the long post.

I've been seeing my lovely partner for two years now. She is completely divorced from a lazy, bullying, controlling, narcissistic man, but they have two kids (10, 6). There is a court order for contact in place, approx 60/40 in my partners favour..

The ex (who lives a few streets away from my partner) found out about me being the new love in her life not long after we started seeing each other and for the past two years has made their kids (especially the ten year old) petrified of meeting me, saying such things to them as 'no man is bringing my kids up' andsaying directly to them that he will disown them if they chose to live in a house with me and their mum. He is a big shouty imposing man .
We are desperate to get our own place now but I still haven't met the daughter and son because the daughter is so scared of his ranting reactions, and no doubt being disowned. My partner sees how upset she is which is why she hasn't initiated a meet up between us. The daughter loves her Dad still you see but is at a stage that any mention of meeting me and subsequently all moving in together has her in floods of tears. How any man can make his daughter feel like this is beyond me!

The behaviour my partner has had from him over the years is awful, refusing to leave the marital house and refusing to pay the mortgage, threatening to smash the house up, calling my partner threatening to dump the children outside the house when she is at mine so she has to rush home to find it to be a lie, never paying maintenance, telling his daughter to feel my partners car bonnet to see if she's been over at mine. My partner even called the police on him after a screaming fit from him down the phone, with the kids in tears texting her to come and get them - the police go around and he says that all is fine and the kids are perfectly happy playing nicely! A scumbag basically.

So my question is, can my partner get something in place to stop him from his behaviour to her, and also to stop his threats to the children regarding me meeting them? Can a non-molestation order be gained?

The fly-in-the-ointment is because he is now gone from the old marital house he is living at his parents round the corner where the children can't stay at night because there is no room. So the court order for shared custody hours is up in smoke - he is unemployed and virtually unemployable and will not be able to move out any time soon, so we subsequently now have a very restricted relationship.

Thanks for any advice you can give on any part of it

Drake

How long since they divorced?

Your partner will have to put the children first and that means she might need to step back from your relationship.

Not so he "wins" but just until the children feel happier, they may need counselling so they can express their fears. An outsider person may help to allay their fears.

Until you meet them it's too risky to move in together as there will no doubt be challenges

Thank so for the replying.
2 years divorced due to his behaviour which he admitted in court.
Split nearly five years.
Stepping back until they are happier, with his narcissistic behaviour would mean stepping back for years, he'll happily continue this way - hence me wondering if anything can't be done

If I was her, I'd be looking to move house and get away from him.

Counselling for the kids would be good. His behaviour is damaging to them...but he obviously doesn't care.

Your DP needs to understand that he is actually abusing the DC.

Perhaps she could contact women's aid for advice.

She should not put her life on hold like this.

Do you know if your DP has a good relationship with his parents? Could she talk to them?

If it was me (in her position) I'd probably arrange a fun day out with the kids (and you) like bowling or something and just act like we'd bumped into you and you there. Then ask you to join in the game.

You each go home separately. That's a non pressurised environment.

I just wouldn't let an Ex control my life this way.

He sounds quite similar to my stbxh!
I think the truth of it is that she may be able to get a restraining order regarding his behaviour towards her, has she been keeping a diary of his behaviour? But how you can stop the father bad mouthing her and being negative about you i just dont know.
Has she seen a solicitor?
My experience is that unless the children are subjected to significant harm, no ones that interested.
I went through several years of very very bad behaviour from my stbxh, police involvement, court cases, children being used as pawns, criminal damage, refusing to return them, lots and lots of mind games and manipulation. I did quite a bit of research into this kind of personality type and came to the conclusion that my stbxh probably had bpd, Borderline personality disorder. I then found out about the gray rock technique and implemented it. It has made a world of difference and i finally feel as if im no longer the target of his misplaced total hatred! (look up gray rock)
Im in no way saying shes to blame but the nasty cycle of abuse just continues from these types of people unless we are some how able to break the cycle. Saying that iv not yet been brave enough to have a relationship, im too scared that it will re ignite his behaviour.
Please feel free to pm me

DPS ex was similar. She refused to agree to me meeting the DC as it was too early. We'd been together for three years. He was in court anyway, and it was mentioned. The judge told her to grow up essentially.

Totally agree with the pp about gray rock. It's the way we've found works to deal with these personality types and break the cycle.

Google “parental alienation” and go see a solicitor about enforcing it. It’s illegal to do what he’s doing now.

Thanks very much all for the replies.
I will look up Grey Rock.
SandyY2K - his parents are a no-go. He now lives with them, and they are both a chip off the old block. Spent all their lives defending him, saying 'ooh he's had a difficult time of things' etc. He even threatened to smash his own parents television with a chair if they dare to mention that he spends a little too much time playing computer games for a middle aged man (the kids related this story as they were in the room at the time! - they still did nothing.
I can't explain adequately enough how he is a full blown narcissist.
When he was living free in the marital home his parents would go round every single morning to cook the kids breakfast and take them to school while he lounged in bed. They still do it now. He never takes his son to school. Ever. Does he love his kids? They are definitely behind him in the pecking order of life. his parents have enabled every part of his behaviour.
They have apparently tried to get him to move out of theirs three times in one week just before Christmas but to no avail, which is ironic because my partner had 4.5 years of that! Rant over.
Thanks once again all.

What Doobee said ^^. In the US parental alienation is grounds for losing access and/or custody of one's children. Not sure the status of PA in the UK.

The welfare of the children must come first. If a court will not or cannot force him to stop threatening the children over meeting you, then there's really nothing you or your DP can do and meeting the DC will just have to wait. You cannot chance him damaging the children any more than he already is.

God I would be doing everything I could to get my kids away from that for good. Sorry no advice though, good luck!

Thanks for your responses everyone.
Just one more thought, as the ex is threatening to come and take the children back when they are with me and my partner in the future when I meet them (despite it only going to be during my partners allotted time as per the court order) could my partner obtain a Prohibited Steps Order to prevent him doing this?

Im just trying to think of ways we can go legally because the man won't listen to a single other human being or see any sense whatsoever.
Thanks all x

Honestly?

Walk away. Nobody is worth this level of crap.

If she won’t stand up for her kids, herself and her relationship then you’re always going to be at his mercy.

I echo the advice to go grey rock. There is no other way with this type of person. Further legal action is just engaging more and likely will have little practical result.

This is such an awful situation. After 2 years, I think if is entirely natural that you would want to meet the children. And I would imagine that your DP is finding it hard too that you haven't been able to do that. I think the best thing that can be done is to ignore him and focus on the children. The 10yo in particular needs reassurance that as her parents are no longer together, it's natural that they may meet other partners but that doesn't mean that the love for the children is any less, and meeting that partner doesn't equal any kind of disloyalty to the other parent. That poor child. She's been used as a means to get at their mother, but he doesn't seem to care at all how that is affecting her. They need to be the priority and once they feel secure and understand the situation, then the meeting can happen. But it needs to happen on their terms, not yours, not their mums and not their Dads. It's unfortunate (bloody shit) that he has made it more difficult for the children to be more settled in their lives.

could my partner obtain a Prohibited Steps Order to prevent him doing this?

Only a solicitor is going to be able to answer this. Getting a PSO will depend entirely on the specifics of her situation. She needs to get legal advice.

I was the daughter in this! My dad did a great job of turning me against my mums partner and I got so anxious meeting him and spending time with him. Looking back on this as an adult I really don't know what could've improved it other than my dad not behaving the way he did and behaving like a supportive parent should. 20 years later, I really like my mums partner and very upset about the past wasted years. I assume there's absolutely no sense in your partner having it out with him and making him completely aware of what he's doing to his kids? (Not making it about causing drama in your relationship). As once the child in this situation I feel very sorry for them being in this situation (at the hands of their dad).

Seek legal advice. Yes a non molestation order would suffice, and I'm sure the exH wouldn't be able to help himself but violate the order, which will then in turn warrant a court's summon leading to restraining order. Also, I'd be doing everything in my power to move far far away from the above described psycho, if I were to be you and your DP. Two years are more than enough time to have met with the kids. What a sore loser the ex is. I feel sorry for the psychological impact this has caused on the kids.

I'm sorry OP, it sounds like a horrible situation. I agree with PP: seek legal advice, parental alienation should be cause for review of aceess, move away if you can, call the police if he turns up and has any sort of threatening or antisocial behaviour, get counselling for the children.

My ex was a narcissist. Narcissists are no good for kids as inevitably he will turn one or both into his flying monkeys/golden child/neglect his least favourite. They will do anything to continue to control you through kids or any means they have.

You can read up on this, and yes they grey rock method is useful for your partner to use.

The therapist told me to run, take my daughter and don't look back by the way which I did. There is no contact now.

Your partner should be doing everything she can to get those kids away or down to very limited contact.

There is no reason for you not to meet them. He is controlling the situation.

Contact the family separation centre (google them). They’re good and experts in dealing with parental alienation (which is what your DPs ex is doing). They are very busy and may take time to get back to you but in my experience they are worth the wait.

I'd love some further advice / thoughts please nice people.

Today was the day I finally met the kids very briefly. The 11 yr old daughter instantly rang her father (my partners ex ) to come and be collected after having a major meltdown at the mere sight of me! This is all because my partners ex has ruined her by saying he will disown her if I was introduced. Today was a day stated in the divorce court order that the children should be with my partner but he has ruined the kids that much they were too scared to disobey his order to go with him.
My partner was in bits and I'm now worried for her health big time. Eight hours later and the police still haven't turned up. He then called my partner threatening to kick her door down if she didn't come home and bring some of their clothes round to his.

So please can someone answer the best way forward - will this mean we now have a good chance of getting a non-mol constantly being fobbed off saying we wouldn't get one despite having five journals of his awful behaviour? Can she get a prohibitive steps put in as he just thinks he can turn up and take the kids at random?

Thanks for any help folks, I'm genuinely thinking of complaining to the police about their lack of care towards a vulnerable woman these past five years. They do not care.

You need to split. Or move far away. Those poor children are being abused, and their mother seems unwilling to stand up for them or herself.

You can’t do it for her.

Honestly this has got no better just walk away.

I don’t agree at all that you should just walk away. Why should you? You obviously love each other and why should he get to ruin that? Have you seen a solicitor? Contacted women’s aid? Has this all been put before a judge? You have lots of evidence. He can’t demand the kids on his non contact days. You really need a good solicitor to help you get that order in place. His behaviour would suggest parental alienation. Start googling and reading up. I wonder if you should just not meet the 11 year old until this is all sorted though.

www.familylaw.co.uk/news_and_comment/analysis-parental-alienation-and-the-new-cafcass-assessment-framework

It sounds like you can now get CAFCAS involved. Ring social services.

Is moving away an option ? If your partner gives in every time he's won. She needs to stand up to him - with help if needed.