Husband not noticing our relationship is in decline.

[Arpafeelie]

Over the years, it has seemed as though every time my husband has a big project on at work, he has given up on a bit of our relationship in order to focus on work.

In the last couple of years, for example, he's decided that he is too busy to visit my parents, so now I go on my own to visit them. Which isn't a big problem in itself, but if I am worried about them, I now chat to friends who also have elderly parents, not to DH.

Anyway, he works away from home several times a year. Usually I send him a daily chatty email while he's away and he replies. This time I decided I would wait for him to email first and it hasn't happened. I got a text to say he'd arrived, and I texted back. He's liked a couple of my Facebook photos, and commented on our son's Facebook page. And apart from that, nothing in 5 days.

I'm finding it unnerving that he hasn't bothered to initiate contact in five days. But am I being petty? I know that if I messaged him, he would reply. But it's also making me realise that it's always been up to me to initiate contact when he's away from home.

but several years ago he asked for a six month break from sex so that he could focus on work, and our sex life never really picked up again after that.

I am still trying to process this tbh. If my dh asked for a 6 month break from sex - as if it was some kind of chore he needed a break from- I'm not sure I could recover. I would be so hurt. And my husband has a very stressful job that involves long hours and a lot of responsibility and travel.

I do understand how you don't want to change your life though. And you sound like you are fond of him. Maybe you continue your life accepting that your dh is, for some reason, incapable of managing adult relationships properly. It is a bit sad though. you sound like a nice woman - you deserve someone who thinks you are the most important thing in their life.

I do know people who I suspect had lives like this (mostly older men at work - guys who would be in their 70s now). My observation was that their wives had long since sorted out a meaningful life with friends/job/community/family while their husbands did just their thing at work. These men were all terrified of retirement and didn't handle it well as they had no other resources to help them through it and their wives already had their lives sorted. It was a bit sad tbh.

Can you try counselling? The break from sex thing is WEIRD.

There was an interesting programme on radio 4 at Christmas the last two years from a couple like yourselves - workaholic and increasingly independent wife. The programme came about because he had an affair, which doesn’t sound like it applies here. But it’s a salutary lesson in not allowing yourselves to grow apart. You need to find a way of getting what you both need or you may find your marriage will whither on the vine.

OP - for what it’s worth - I don’t think your H would see his side of the relationship as ‘in defline’.
I think for him it’s a normal evolution of s relationship with advancing age.
He is probably also experiencing a drop in testosterone.
And yes - the job seems to be important to him.

This is the hard one. One one side you say he is an ideal spouse/father and you aren’t looking to leave.
And that you found other sources of support and human interaction - (which is great anyway and should be there even if you had more attention from H)
But you also seem to be lonely and unhappy at the same time.

I think some things can be fixed as they are structural. More scheduled things together, on weekends or at other times.
As to sex - if he isn’t having a huge desire - it’s unfair to force him. Unless he thinks it’s a problem and wants to change that.
(Many a woman come here saying their libido decreased - and get told it’s absolutely fine)

I do believe with age marriaages evolve. And some become more of a partnership/friendship arrangements and less of a romantic type. However, both parties need to be ok with that.
You seem to be wanting/needing more. Some of which he may be able to do.

I'm having a lonely and unhappy spike today because previously when he's been away I've emailed or messaged him, he's emailed or messaged back and it's been quite chatty. This trip away I've realised that if I don't take the iniative, he isn't bothered, and that hurts.

It feels like one more bit of our relationship has crumbled. But perhaps I shouldn't have experimented to see what would happen. If I had messaged as I usually do, this wouldn't have happened.

He sounds exactly like my exH. He gradually checked out of all aspects of family life and marriage, supposedly because of work.

He worked away from home half the the time and when he was living at home he spent all his time in his home office. When he was home he was too busy to leave his desk to eat with us, so I usually ate alone with the kids.

Like your H, he was too busy / tired to have sex, go out without the kids, go on family days out or date nights. I wouldn’t even ask him to do anything around the house.

Every time I talked to him about it ( about every 6 months) he would either blame me and there would be a huge row or he would promise to change and he would do nothing.

So if I asked him to spend some time with the children at the weekend , he would sit on the sofa watching the Grand Prix, drink beer and fall asleep . Then claim that he had given up his valuable time to be with the children and they didn’t what to spend it with him.

If I ever asked him to take the children to an activity, he would be very late or do something else wrong to spoil it for them and ensure that I never asked him again. Eg took son to a football party, dropped him and drove off with sons football boots, kit and birthday present in the car, so son couldn’t join in the party.

He never ever bought a single birthday or Christmas present for me or the kids, I had to do it all.

Every single time we went on holiday he would leave part way though to work. Once he left me in Greece alone for a fortnight with 3 kids under 6. Another year we went to Turkey and he didn’t actually leave but he billed over 110 hours on the 2 week holiday.

On the days he was actually there on other holidays, he would work or sleep most of the day then join us for dinner, where he was short tempered with everyone. It was clear to the kids that he resented even that hour and a half he spent with them every evening.

So once the children were school aged I just went on holiday without him.

When the children were small and he came home from work, they would run to hug him and he would literally push them away and run to his computer to check his email. Because he has not been able to check it during the 15 mins it took him to drive home from work.

So eventually the kids stopped caring when he came home. Sometimes he would be abroad with work and they wouldn’t notice for a week.

On the odd day he spent with us eg Christmas Day, he would be “ tired “ by lunchtime and go upstairs to “ sleep “ with his lap top.

He got very very stressed if he couldn’t check his phone every few minutes eg when we were at a wedding or a funeral. He didn’t go to my fathers funeral because he was too busy .

In the end there was no marriage left. was just a unpaid housekeeper and nanny. He destroyed all the feelings I had for him. I wasn’t even upset when we split up.

Arpafeelie - after my dad died and he did NOTHING to support me at all, I stopped doing all these things for my ex too. I quickly realised that the entire marriage consisted of my doing stuff for him.

Like you, I made time to FaceTime him when he was away even though I was exhausted with work and 3 kids one with SN. He would show us his lovely 5 star hotel and send photos of his meals and business class flights and I’d sympathise at how hard his life was.

I spend hours listening to his work problems and helping with things. But when my father died he never even asked anything about it. I cried once ever in front of him and he got inpatient and said he would pay for counselling . He meant “STFU and let me got on with my things “.

That was a turning point for me.

Before, I only saw him if I watched his TV programmes with him. I hate sport but I sat politely with him. So I stopped doing that. I didn’t ask him about his work. I didn’t tell him about the children or ask him to do stuff.

I stopped arranging social events with his family . I didn’t make him go shopping for his clothes. I didn’t make his dentist or optician appointments.

And when I stopped, I understood that it was ALL about my doing things for him and ever ever reciprocated. There was nothing there.

DH isn't like that. He buys presents for me and the kids, he's very good at it. We eat together, though I facilitate that because 95% of the time I cook and set the table. He makes the after dinner coffee.

He's rarely short tempered, and is great fun when he's not focussing on a deadline. He'd like me to take more interest in his work, because he enjoys talking about it. I'm interested in the people he works with, but glaze over when it comes to technical stuff.

@Arpafeelie

OP - it does sound like you and him are different in many ways.
And you seek emotional and a little down. Is anything else, possibly going on?

For me - looking at this from the outside of your marriage - the things you mention don’t seem as dire or dark.
He is away for work. Busy. Historically you wrote, he replied.
When things fall to a pattern, they don’t change easily....
He probably doesn’t think to write and be chatty because he is busy.
🤷🏻‍♀️
And this isn’t a sign of marriage crumbling. Just a sign that your communication styles/needs differ...

Just wanted to add my bit.
My husband had a hobby that I used to 'glaze' over when it was mentioned.
But we had some problems a few years back.
Kids leaving home (empty nest)
Dh working 7 days a week 10/ 11 hour days.
It al took its toll and we were drifting apart.
With a lot of work and this is not a quick fix we are better now than we ever have been.
One of the things I did was to get into his hobby.
In the end I actually found it really interesting.
You may have to fake it till you make it but it's a really good starting point.
Now DH has every single week end and doesn't want to change that though he could.
We spend a lot of Sunday morning snuggling and watching TV etc....... :)

DH is still my idea of the ideal man. He's honest, generous and has a great sense of humour.

I wish I could say these things about my DH...sigh

But I'm getting a better return on time I invest with friends, colleagues and family and the fact that I can cold bloodedly assess that tells me that things have gone very wrong

This is truth that your DH needs to hear and heed. There is a good chance you can work through these issues. I really, really think you're ideal candidates for counselling. Please do it!

Whilst relationship counselling sounds like a good option, if DH is that much of a workaholic would he really make time for it? Or would it fall by the wayside after a couple of sessions?

Or would it fall by the wayside after a couple of sessions

That would tell OP all she nerds to know about his commitment to making this relationship work.

You don't have to be looking for you to meet someone you want to be with. In fact, from what you are saying it's almost inevitable. Life will become a lot harder then.

Present giving: as its down side can be more about control and standing in for intimacy than about thinking of someone else. Giving what they want to rather than doing what you need.
Are you in the position where you have had more intimate conversations with almost everyone, recently, other than him?
Are you basing your feelings/estimation of him more on how he used to be, perhaps quite a while ago, compared to how he is in the present?
The 2 questions above were ones I couldn't brush off even when I was trying to keep a white knuckled iron grip on optimism.

He's a workaholic and only he can deal with that...

You could book a couples therapy session to have this discussion and see if he has any desire to change his lifestyle?

Ormally, yes, I've had more intimate ( in the honest and open sense)conversations with several female friends recently than I have with him.

I would also be concerned about the future when he retires - you will have spent years building up your own independent life, support network, hobbies and friends. He’ll finish work and expect you to be there. Will he expect you to give up all that so “your” time together can finally start? You may find that’s the last thing you want by then.

I don't know what will happen when he retires because he doesn't really have any social life beyond work (though regular lunches, dinners etc in the course of work.) Most of his friends are also work colleagues. I don't think he'll retire fully, ever, though. It's still a long way in the future, so Im not going to worry about it.

It sounds as though his work is his priority and then you and your family are second.
I understand that you have a comfortable life but it's up to you to decide whether or not you can have a life without romantic love and physical passion.
As you've said, any times things change, it's only for a short period before things return to normal.
This is who he is and I doubt he'll change if he's been this way for so long now.
If you're happy being housemates, enjoy that but you both need to be on the same page about what relationship you intend to have with each other.

Ormally, yes, I've had more intimate ( in the honest and open sense)conversations with several female friends recently than I have with him.

My theory is that in a good marriage there is a great deal of intimacy and kindness involved. It sounds like you have the kindness but no intimacy. You don't get it through sex and you don't get it through conversation/consideration/thinking about each other. And you are discovering that this is quite a big loss.

Your dh actually reminds me of my lovely teenage children. I am lucky enough that they are funny, kind, generous, sweet but I suspect they don't think about me when not in my presence - they leave that to me. They know I will think about them but I suspect they think I am a bit like a computer that will happily go to sleep until they shake me awake again. This is normal in teenage/young adult children. They should be moving away from intimacy with their parents into intimacy with others.

But you should expect and get intimacy with your husband. You sound young (based on retirement is so far off - trust me if you were in your 50s you'd be really scared at how your dh would deal with retirement and all this "he'll never retire stuff" well in my experience some people can do this, most can't - their powers wane, the room in the firm isn't there for them, they have to move on and for men like that there is no place to move on - their wives have already got their lives sorted)

Would it be worth asking him to set aside one day where you could talk about this. You may well decide, well this is life and he is a good man so I'll take it, but if you are young why couldn't he change a bit?

Mind you, I am still trying to deal with the "can we take a break from sex for 6 months so I can concentrate on work". Dh and I (we are in our 50s) have been through our ups and downs and hard times etc but I think if he had said this to me it would have been a death knell. If he said "so sorry but I don't feel like having sex because I am depressed/ill/worried" it would be different. It was the way you worded it that bothers me.

Do you not go to work?

Do you not go to work?

Great question. Because people who go to work never have relationship problems. Have you thought about sharing this fantastic insight with the rest of the world. If we all just went to work there would be no more divorce. You are a fucking genius.

Honestly the first thing that popped in to my head when you said your H asked for a 6months break from sex was some sort of STI

And men who say they are workaholics because they are "doing it for the family", rarely are. They may have even convinced themselves subconsciously, but the reality is they are those type of men that define themselves by their work. They love and crave this "top dog" type of life. Nothing wrong with being this type of person, but I really wish men would stop trying to disguise their preference as "doing it for the family".

We are in our 50s! I am assuming that we'll both be working at least part time up to the age of 70.

And yes, I work, but not full time, and I also do some voluntary work. And I do 95% of the domestic stuff and all of the gardening. Any time that I have a week in which I am working full time our quality of life crashes; either I'm cooking at 6am to have something in the slow cooker for when we get home, or we are living off fish and chips. DH doesn't eat microwave ready meals, and he likes to eat as soon as he gets home. That's a whole other story. If I'm working, he'll often end up having an expensive meal out rather than heat something up himself. I've had days when, once I've subtracted commuting costs and the cost of DHs restaurant meal, my net income is below the national minimum wage, which is dispiriting.