DS2 bullied by the children of good friends

[Cobblersandhogwash]

Ds2 is 8 (year 4).

He's a nice kid. Uncomplicated, friendly, average academically, good at art and rugby.

I've made friends with the parents of some of the boys in his year. We socialise together, support each other through hard times etc.

I thought he was also friends with the boys of these parents. It seems not. It seems he's being bullied by them. Head being shoved into football nets by one of them, actively excluded at break time. He's only just told me.

I have witnessed some nasty behaviour towards him on a play date from two of these boys. I simply said the play date wasn't working for us and left. No drama. Just left politely and told ds2 to avoid those two boys in future.

I've emailed his form tutor about the latest incidents ds2 has reported to me. But ds2 has already warned me that the boys close ranks and deny anything has ever happened. That doesn't matter to me because I will be like a steady, dripping tap if it continues.

However, as I said, I am very friendly with the parents of these boys. I don't think though that they would take kindly to me reporting their sons' behaviour to them so I've gone through the school anyway.

Meanwhile, we've all been invited to a Christmas event at one of the parents' houses. Ds2 is adamant he doesn't want to go. What do I do? Just farm him out to a play date on the day? Make him go? None of us go?

I'm not sure if I should distance myself from the parents now too.

Advice please! I don't want a fuss. I don't want a drama. If necessary, I will just detach from the parents and help ds2 avoid these boys and keep on at the school if the bullying persists. I'll be sad to lose friends but I know they won't really be accepting of the bullying claims if I approach them personally about it.

I'd say none of you go. You going would make your son feel like you condone their actions. He has to feel like you're 100% on his side.

I think you're right to raise it through school and not address it with the parents direct. But do keep on at the school and make sure it's taken seriously straight away.

Don't go to the Christmas event without DS2, and certainly don't make him go - why on earth should he go somewhere to see people who behave like that to him? Just make up a white lie excuse.

You can keep your adult relationship with the adults, but I wouldn't get involved in any stuff getting the kids together outside school.

That's what I'd do, anyway. Hope school sort it out soon!

None of you go. In this situation your son needs to see that you are totally on his side. Plus, if you think the friendship may not withstand the strain of dealing with this issue, you may as well bite the bullet now.

If they are REALLY good friends I would discuss it with them honestly, but truthfully few friendships can withstand criticism of children, however valid.

Tricky situation.

Having had recent experience of this with a slightly older child, definitely do not approach the parents first. I did, out of naivety and an assumption that they wouldn’t condone the behaviour, and it was a huge mistake: total denial of any negative behaviours from their ‘angels’. The other parent was then straight up to the school to ‘get in there first’ and ‘fight their child’s corner’. That just made dealing with the situation with school staff in an adult fashion that bit harder...

Remember too that the school staff can mostly only deal with what they actually witness, and the little shitbags are very clever at keeping it under their radar and outside of school/adult supervision.

Once the school are on board and supportive, I would give the parents the heads up to see if they step up (as these behaviours really need to be nipped in the bud before they take hold - playground bullies can become corporate nightmares...). If they don’t step up or at least be open to finding out the truth and dealing accordingly, I would back off entirely from the friendship, to be honest, who needs people like that in their life? I have opted for fewer, better quality friends, than the fakery of people with questionable integrity.

I had a very similar experience but I was honest with my friend and told her that I was going to discuss it with the school. She did believe it to a point but obviously she felt very protective of her son. It absolutely affected our friendship but that's just how it is. Good luck, hope it gets sorted

Yeah none of you go. I had a similar situation with my daughter as well, unfortunately it ended with me falling out with the girls mother who I had previously been friendly with because alot of parents just don't want to believe that their darling could ever be a bully. I don't get it, I'd be as upset at the thought of my child being a bully as actually being bullied. Unfortunately, if you want to stick up for your child there's probably no way round falling out with the parents (if they're the type who want accept their child being wrong) so you just have to make your peace with that. I learned a lesson of not getting close to parents of kids in school after that, not worth the hassle

None of you should go and I would distance yourself from these people too. My guess too is that if you were to ever raise this with this child's parents it will go down very badly so you have been wise to let school know. Let them deal with this and keep in touch with the school apart from e-mailing them as well. Have a face to face meeting with his form tutor, the pastoral support person if there is one and head of year.

Think you've really answered your own question here anyway in your comment:-
"I will just detach from the parents and help ds2 avoid these boys and keep on at the school if the bullying persists. I'll be sad to lose friends but I know they won't really be accepting of the bullying claims if I approach them personally about it"

I've completely cut contact and broken up two fairly good friendships because I couldn't stand the way my friends' kids were treating my children! Once was when my pfb was a toddler and her best friend was a boy who just couldn't stop himself from hurting her all the time ... we had to stop meeting up, so that was the end of that friendship with his mum. I also stopped seeing a woman I'd been friends with for a good 8 years because I simply couldn't bear her teenage dd and the way she treated my teen dd. It was all wrapped up in feelings about how could my friend have raised such an unpleasant child? because of course we had a relationship independent of our kids by then. I lost other mutual friends too, due to stopping seeing this woman. But family comes first in all of this! You have to protect your children from horrible behaviour.

As PPs have said, none of you go. Your DS needs to feel completely supported.
You know the parents won't be accepting of the bullying claims. If that's the type of parents they are, why do you want to be friends with them?
We had a similar issue but I knew my friend would speak to her DS, as well as encouraging my DS to tell if anything happened in school so it could be dealt with at the time. As parents, we were also able to share what the school was saying to each of us.
However, if I felt a friend would deny their DC's behaviour then I wouldn't be friends with them. Their values are too different for it to be a genuine friendship.

I had a similar experience as a child. My mother made a polite excuse to leave with me and then we never went back to their house again. When the child's mother commented 'Oo we've not seen you in ages, you must come round some time' my mother informed her (calmly and politely) exactly why we wouldn't be visiting again. It made me feel like she really had my back and would stick up for me when it was right, even if it was awkward and inconvenient for her.

It made me feel like she really had my back and would stick up for me when it was right, even if it was awkward and inconvenient for her.

Yep, there's no other answer really if you want to be a good parent

This is why I'm not friends with any of the parents at dc school.

Don't go to the party and gradually withdraw from the friendship.

If the parents are willing to condone nasty behaviour they're not really the sort of people you would want in your life anyway.

But if you are good friends with the parents, I don't understand why you wouldn't talk to them first before involving the school? OK, there is a risk that you'll lose the friendship, but that may happen anyway and personally I would find it really odd, if I was your friend, that you didn't say anything to me first, to see if we could sort the problem without involving the school.

The only way you will not lose this friendship is if you speak to them honestly and none judgementally but not leaving anything out and they take it well, apologetically and do everything they can to prevent it. Chances are it won't end that way, but it's your only hope imo. Unless of course the school speak to them and they won't ever know that it was you who spoke to the school first.

We had this with DS2. DS2 came out of school upset & said that 'friends' DS had repeatedly hit him with others watching & laughing. Her DS was stood there so I asked him if he did it & he shrugged his shoulders & said yes. 'Friend' grabbed her DS & ran out of the yard.

I assumed she was embarrassed by her DS behaviour & was taking home to talk to him about it. How wrong was I?!

Bumped into her walking up to school the next day and she was complaining about how her DS was so upset about what had happened that she had had to agree to take him and a friend to a play centre to make him feel better.

I went quiet trying to stop myself from giving her both barrels and she had the cheek to ask what was wrong. I told her that I didn't think rewarding someone for bullying behaviour was right & her response was that her DS wouldn't give her a cuddle until she agreed.

Not once did she ask how my DS was.

I now go directly to the school with any issues with her DS & let them deal with it. This has pissed her off as she doesn't like the idea of her DS not being the golden boy & has asked me not to but tough shit. She had a chance. Not getting another.

Our 'friendship' is strained but DS comes first. Thankfully we are now year 6 & I'm hoping DS can escape her DS altogether in secondary.

A PP has described how her DM supported her, as a child; clearly she has never forgotten it, and your DS will feel the same.
If you wish to remain friendly with the parents, you can be pleasant to them in other ways, while gently cooling things.
You have already shown him, at the playdate, that his welfare is your highest concern, and if DM begins to wonder why people are declining invitations, just say that the boys don't seem to be hitting it off at the moment. Don't give chapter and verse unless pressed; if this is happening, the bullies will most likely look for an easier target, and truth will out.

Anything to do with school behaviour eg head into football nets...goes through school. Why on earth would you think to discuss it with the parents??!! No. It happened on school property on school time and it’s their duty to protect your kid and sort this out. Your duty is to your kid and not these “friends”. You’ve known them 5 minutes in the grand scheme of things and are only friends due to your kids being the same age. You do not go near them again while your kid is at risk. You show your kid that his well-being is more important to you then these strangers. Be a parent.

I've had friends tell me when one of my children has acted wrongly and I've taken it on board. Kids squabble and fall out and sometimes they mix with the wrong crowd. I'd also speak to the parents prefacing it with you would want to know if it was your child.

Of course none of you go!!!
You can't even consider going!
You have got to be on your son's team.

I've had friends tell me when one of my children has acted wrongly and I've taken it on board

Unfortunately alot of parents aren't like you and get immediately defensive, then it can backfire on you if the parents are "warned" as a PP pointed out with her own experiences

@cawfee, You’ve known them 5 minutes in the grand scheme of things and are only friends due to your kids being the same age.

I've been good friends with these particular parents for five years. We've been a very friendly group of 10 parents since the boys were all in nursery. So it's not five minutes for me at all. Thanks though. We've supported each other through bereavements, infidelity, near bankruptcy. But funnily enough, I think this claim of bullying would create irreversible problems.

One of the boys at the play date has behavioural issues. His mum knows that and she's taking action about it. I don't really see the point of adding to her load by telling her about the incident. She knows her ds is difficult and is greatly troubled by it.

The ringleader bully has been in trouble for bullying before. His parents were mortified and made him write a letter of apology to his last victim. Those two boys are now firm friends.

I also think those others boys closing rank and siding with the bully, saying the incident with the football net, are almost as bad. That's the rest of the group.

I hope the school resolves this and is on side. I am not one to give up if I think something rotten is happening so I'll keep on at them and keep a record.

The friend hosting the Christmas party will have booked caterers. We are six people so I feel like I need to let her know sooner rather than later that we aren't coming before she books it all. Six people gap is rather a lot!

OP if one bully's parents were mortified and made him write an apology letter why don't you think they would be similarly supportive re your DS?

Maybe if you stopped referring to their child as a bully it may help. Talk about the incident with the football nets. Say it upset your child. Find out why they did it but don't call their child names especially before you find out more. I've seen people going in shouting about their child being bullied and it turning out it was their child who kept hitting the so called 'bully' who then didn't want to play with them.

Funnily enough, I had a similar situation arise this week. Only my son is the one in the wrong. He and another boy were tormenting a third boy (usually a friend) repeatedly prodding him and telling him he has headlice (he doesn't, although obviously that isn't really the point). They are all 6 year olds. To be honest, I think it was more done out of immaturity than deliberate bullying but still really nasty behaviour. The victimised child was understandably very upset and told his mother. She and I are friendly, since the boys have been together since nursery so we know each other fairly well. She approached me to talk about it. I was mortified that my son had done something so horrible, and really grateful to her for telling me. Sure, it happened during school time on school property but I'm his mother and it's my job (and his father) to make sure he knows that this isn't OK just as much (in fact, I would say more so) as his teacher's. So I actually respect this mother more, not less, for having the sense (and the guts) to come straight to me.

Obviously I won't refer to their child as a bully in RL. Who ever said I had or would in RL?

Although he's been in trouble for it before as I said earlier in the thread.

The teacher today said she had had a word and that he had agreed to apologise to ds2 and that she would keep an eye out.