My wife's friend.

[Robadobdob]

My wife recently had an affair with a female friend of hers.

She says the affair is over but they will remain friends.
I'm worried because they regularly exchange messages such as:

"I love your eyes." "Seeing you makes me smile inside" "I love you so much" "I'm thinking about you constantly" "the thought of you keeps me alive"

These are just the things I've happened to catch sight of since the affair ended.
My wife says this is normal among female friends but that's bullshit, isn't it?

Do any women here regularly talk to their friends like this?

She's not her "friend" anymore. Once they crossed that line she became her lover/ex-lover (as far as she tells it)...

Whether or not they're still involved, which it does sound like they are, she's been unfaithful and is trying to justify keeping her around. Surely the OW has other friends and family that can support her.

If I was in your position I'd have left, but if I'd stayed, I certainly would be telling her to sever ties with this woman.

And no, please don't believe you'll never meet anyone else. Don't ever believe that.

The fact that you do actually makes me suspect your wife is emotionally abusing you, besides the cheating... Does she put you down/make you feel you should be "grateful" to have her?

Her friend doesn't really have other friends here. She's newish to the area and her partner wouldn't allow her to socialise. She only met my wife through my wife's work. Since the friend's partner was removed she's got a little better but has had so many years of abuse she hasn't been comfortable making friends.
This isn't my wife's take. This is my own.

No, my wife hasn't been abusive to me as far as I can tell. History tells me I'm lucky to have her. I was never really dating material.

Well if it isn't your wife making you feel "undateable", I'm still sad to hear you feel that you are.

I mean of course, I'm not commanding to "LTB" like sometimes happens on MN - I know sometimes people can get past these things, but still, it's vital (in my humble opinion) that you are staying because you truly love and trust her, not just because you feel she's your last chance. So she needs to show you that you are her priority and stop this friendship.

Again, just my humble opinion.

Hand hold for you.

Thanks.
Yes, you could count the number of relationships I've had on the left hand of a clumsy butcher.
They talk about kissing a lot of frogs to find a prince(ess). Not even the frogs were interested.

I do deeply love my wife. And our family. I really don't want to put her or the kids through any turmoil that following through on any missed ultimatums might lead to.

I do trust that they'll never have a sexual relationship again, at least not planned. They were away together recently and the prospect of them being stranded was very real and the thought of them drinking too much and hooking up did terrify me.

The emotional relationship and love they share does hurt and I really feel it undermines our relationship. When I mentioned that to her she went very quiet, said she was sorry that's how I felt and cried before saying she was going to bed.

That sounds very difficult.

Ideally, she'd give up this friendship, but have you thought about what you might do if she doesn't?

She’s a lesbian. She’s gay. If you make her finish with this friend there will just be another. It might be in 5,10,15 years but she will do it again. She needs something from a woman that you can’t give her. You are best of getting out now before you are far too old and mentally traumatised to meet anyone else.

^ To be fair she might be bi rather than gay. But either way OP, that's a fair point, she may well stray again, as she doesn't seem fully committed to you.

You DO deserve better, and no matter what you think, you ARE loveable.

BTW, for context - I'm bi, married to a man, and have never cheated (not even in previous relationships), so sexuality doesn't correlate with loyalty.

You should leave her. She's not being kind and she cannot stay friends with this woman. You can do better

To perhaps answer your question as whats nornal for female friends with a sexual past.

As a married woman who has had a sexual relationship with her female friend a few years ago (totally different circumstances as it was part of an open agreement for me to explore my curiosity when I was younger and before we were married too) but I can say that I have occasionally say to my friend "Love you" especially as she is going through a hard time too at the moment (break up with her partner). But it says in a tone of I care about you. Difference is I would say it in front of my husband.

Secondally I want my friend to be happy so have always respected her relationships and her previous partners have told me and her they completely understood our thing is of the past and could see I want my friend to be happy so wouldn't ever jeapodise her relationship - I'm not hearing this from your wife's friend. If your wife friend got a new partner - would your wife genuinely be happy for her and support any boundaries to be put into place. E.g. one of my friends ex boyfriends didn't want us to make jokes about it. We respected that. Her new partner makes jokes himself.

Also we do still makes jokes and references to our past but we do have full control over our actions and my husband/her partner is fully aware of the bond and history we we have.

But really is as hard as it would be. If for whatever reason my husband didn't want me to be friends with her anymore I would have to respect that as him and my future family are my priority.

But what has happened to you - is an affair behind your back and again your wife is priotising her friends feelings over yours. I've been cheated on and I know things are not always black and white.

You say you know they can control themselves sexually but it's probably more the emotions that if be worried about. I love and care about my friend but no more/less than any of my other female friends and want them all to be happy but my priority will always be my husband first and foremost.

Not sure if it helps you.

Just seen you other thread and a few more points.

• me and friend text more compared to my other my female friends but certainly not daily. We also are part of a group so see each other more as a group of friends with 1:1 time in between e.g. dinner/shopping days out etc.

We certainly do not see each other daily - probably once every 3 weeks either 1:1 or as a group.

Those things as you've said talking and seeing each other daily will have a huge impact on your relationship as when is your wife priotising you and spending time with you.

Rob, the friend isn't suicidal - she is enjoying an affair with your wife. Plenty of people have explained this to you on the other thread. Stay or leave, it's your choice, but believe me when I say that these two ladies are having an affair right this minute, right under your trusting nose. Nobody is suicidal - they are having a sexual affair and appear to be enjoying it .

If a woman came on here and said her husband had an affair with a female friend and was insisting on continuing the friendship there would be a chorus of ltb. Op, you cannot stand for this. Your wife has been unfaithful. If she wants to salvage her marriage the friendship has to end. Please listen to what everyone is telling you.

Ididnothearthat

Thank you so much for your comments. They're very helpful.

My wife is still friends with a couple of her exes but rarely speaks to them and even more rarely sees them. I know the history between them and it's just that, history.
I get on really well with her exes.

This seems to be part of my wife's excuses though, she says she doesn't understand how I can be so happy to see K when she visits but this other friendship I find so hurtful.

My wife is trying to fix things with me. Going out together more, making me feel wanted.
But this friend just shouts and, if I'm not home, my wife goes running, or if I am home, my wife stews and gets upset until she can get an opportunity to go (either very apologetically asking me, or going over on her way to the shop or where ever)
(I should add that she tells me she went round afterwards but not before because she "didn't want me to worry")

Is this something you can live with? If you look deep inside yourself at how you really feel about it, rather than how society says you should feel.

Many marriages work well being 'open' with both parties allowed to sleep with other people. Not popular on Mumsnet but can work really well if both couples are fully on board and there's no coercion.

PsychedelicSheep

I thought a lot about this when I first found out and had the affair been purely sexual I might have been able to deal with it. They can obviously get something from one another I can't deliver.

However, the sexual side of our relationship was always a slight issue as I have a higher sex drive than her (I tried herbal supplements to lower my sex drive for a while).
And the fact they did things such as exchange pictures which I'd suggested to my wife and been shot down. I digress.

If it'd been purely sexual I'd have understood, though I'd want to have a lover as well to help satisfy my needs.
And, selfishly, this isn't going to happen.

Because she says the affair was based on love I'm really not comfortable with it. I'll be constantly on edge.

Part of our problem last year was I developed feelings for another woman. I told my wife before anything happened, only saw this person in group situations, and we rebuilt our relationship.

I thought things were better between us now.

I'm scared to leave is I know I'd never meet someone else
Who told you that?
Seems a very odd thing to say.
Why do you believe this????

Hmm, well based on that it seems you and your wife aren't really sexually compatible and you'd both be happier with other people.

It's hard at first but it does get better.

OP, this thread is really sad to read tbh! Your wife is treating you appallingly. Don’t be a mug! Even if you spend the rest of your life alone (you won’t!!!) it would be better than being treated like this.

Thanks all.

A steady stream of rejection throughout my life has painted a pretty good picture that I'm not really of interest to women (though apparently I'd do very well if I was gay...) and my wife and I sort of just decided we might as well be a couple as that's what people thought already (plus I was besotted with her already)

Is there any way anyone can suggest that we could help to save our relationship?

The only way to even begin to save this is for your wife to want to save it.
And to do that she needs to completely cut contact with this 'friend'
But she won't.
You are fighting a losing battle here.
She doesn't respect you or your relationship enough to end this affair.
There is not coming back from that is there!?
Unless she can cut contact and join you in couples counselling then there really is nothing to save here.

I'm curious as to why so many people don't believe they have ended the physical affair or, if given a her or me ultimatum, my wife would pick her?
Not arguing but just curious.

I agree that that ultimatum might be necessary.

The affair is obviously carrying on - you can tell that by the way they are speaking over text etc....
As we've all said - NONE of us speak with our friends like that.
And believe me, myself and BF have been accused many a time of being gay - but we aren't. And we've never messaged like that and we've been best friends for nearly 20 years.
No-one said she would pick her OW.
I don't believe she would.
But I do believe she will never cut contact with the OW and you will never be able to trust her again.

I experimented with my teenage mate. I did not talk to her like that. Ever. We complimented each other, don't get me wrong, but we didn't say we were thinking of each other all the time or "the thought of you keeps me alive".

I have also had a few dalliances in my adult years with women. I guess I'm bi though I'm with my OH now and he's male.
When I was flirting with a woman this is how I would speak (not the love bits though).

Sounds very clear to me that she is most definitely not out of the affair. She is taking the right royal piss out of you. If she is serious about being in a relationship with you she needs to sever her communication with OW.

Threats of self harm are extremely manipulative and the OW needs to sort her shit out. Wouldn't she rather someone stay with her because they love her, not because they're scared she'll end her life or hurt herself?

If she threatens to kill herself, ring the police and get them to go and check on her.

I appreciate that it's a very difficult situation for your wife to be in (if it's true) but she needs to be harsh here. Otherwise she's just stringing the other woman along and it'll make it worse.

hellsbellsmelons
You say you don't think my wife would pick her friend over me if I gave her a friend or me ultimatum but then say you don't believe my wife would cut her friend out.

PlinkPlink
The "thought of you keeps me alive" comment was from her friend and I assume was intended more literal than poetic due to MH issues but I could be wrong. Regardless, my wife certainly feels she needs to care for this friend and even partly responsible for her MH problems for supporting her in her efforts to break up with her partner and the custody fall out from that.