Safeguarding DCs from convicted child sex offender - where do I stand on this legally?

[2step]

DH's uncle was convicted of child sex offences - indecent images and videos, including "extreme". He got a suspended custodial sentence, on the sex offenders register, and a sexual harm prevention order (I don't know the terms of this).

We found out before it went to court because SS and police contacted me for safeguarding purposes. DH and I assured SS that we would safeguard our children by not seeing the uncle. Also turns out his wife had known for months - since the police raid - but covered it up to the family, saying that devices that had been seized had been lost etc - but her covering up is another matter Anyway what I take from that is that I can't trust her judgement either.

Now MIL (sister of the aunt) has unexpectedly received some money and wants to treat the whole family to a Christmas break in a lovely rented house. MIL is waiting until I'm out of the room and asking DH to contact the sex offender "because they're suffering" and to all spend Christmas together because "they've had a bad year so far" DH has given a vague non-committal response.

I think they've all taken leave of their senses. They've not only accepted this "man" who likes to watch babies and children being sexually abused and raped, they're trying to make life better and more enjoyable for him

I don't want to see the uncle - possibly ever, who knows - and I don't want my DCs to see him.

I will do everything in my power to block this - taking the kids away to another location if I have to - but I would like to know where I stand legally.

Are people on the sex offenders register even allowed to stay somewhere overnight with children? How would I even know if the terms of his SHPO prevent it? Would I have to speak to SS or police if I needed support in safeguarding my kids from this man?

And most importantly - am I legally allowed to forbid DH or anyone else from taking my DCs to see this man?

Thanks for any advice or pointers.

legally or not, there is not a chance in hell your kids should be around him and your dh needs to back you on this

Just remind your MIL that they have had "bad year" because he was looking at indecent images of children. Keep on going reminding her, be blunt.

Be blunt with your DH too.

I'm sure other posters will be along with legal advice later but didn't want to read and run.
What an awful situation for you!
As far as I'm aware, he probably wouldn't be allowed to spend overnight with your kids. You could possibly be in trouble yourselves for putting the kids in that situation ( obvs you aren't going to ) I think I remember another thread where the op was told SS could be involved due to contact with sex offender.
Anyway, over my dead body would my kid be in a house with him. Your instincts are right.

If you don’t protect your children in the way that you’ve assured SS you will, ie not seeing this relative, then you are at risk of having them removed.

Your DH’s response should have been a blunt ‘NO’. He needs to realise how serious this is and make it clear to his mum that he will keep his children safe from a convicted paedophile, relative or not.

Maybe repost in Legal?

We have a very similar situation in our family. If he is under a sexual harm prevention order, it may well prevent him from doing that. Our family member was also under a SHPO and one of the terms was that he could not stay overnight or be in the same dwelling with a child for more than 12 hours (without permission of both parents, that is).

It’s a horrible situation to find yourself in and the attitude of many families (to pity the poor victimised abuser) makes it all the more difficult. Our family has reacted much the same, wanting to bury the past, to not bring shame or make him feel bad about things (after all he did his ‘time’ - a prison stint and has been through enough already, poor chap). We’ve been made to feel like the bullies for making a fuss about it.

The approach we’ve taken though is to have no individual contact at all with him (including very minimal, supervised contact with his partner). This has been for the past two years. We are going to attempt to attend a family wedding. It’s a big wedding, outdoors during the afternoon, where he will be there but have no opportunity to interact with our children at all. We’ll leave after dinner anyway as our children are 5 and under. But for an overnight away or even an intimate family dinner, no chance in hell. I wouldn’t be comfortable with it. We spoke to a police safeguarding officer when this all came to light and she basically warned us that as parents, since we know he poses a risk, the responsibility falls on us to prevent contact. If we know he’s a risk and consent for our children to be around him and god forbid they were abused, the social services would see it as an issue of us not safeguarding them and they could even be removed from our care. I would raise that issue with your dh. It’s a really serious thing. And no way I’d put my kids in that situation. Let the rest of the family commune with the paedo. You stay home and stay out of it.

That said, you may be able to request the terms of the SHPO under the disclosure scheme to bolster your case. Though I tried to make a request and it was denied and I was told I didn’t have a right to know and should just avoid our family altogether if I had concerns (helpful!).

There is no way you or DH should permit this man to have contact with your DC. If you do, SS will rightly see it as you not safeguarding your DC and could remove them from your custody (and imo they SHOULD be removed if you're putting them in contact with a convicted paedophile). If your DH or anyone else tries to take the DC where this man is, you should call police and SS immediately. If MIL seems sympathetic to this pervert I'd prevent her from having the DC alone in case she fails to safeguard them and they end up in this man's presence.

You and your dh need to be firm that this “person” (once something gets off on images of children being sexually abused I stop seeing them as a human being tbh) is never ever to be in any kind of contact with your family. Otherwise you’ll be failing to safeguard them. He needs to be blocked on all social media platforms, never ever to visit you with kids present or not and never ever to ask you, your dh or any other family about your kids. He’s a vile, twisted thing who doesn’t deserve to have a “happy life”.

I would track down this person's probation officer and ask them if this holiday would be permitted. It seems unlikely that they would be allowed to be around children. Hopefully your DH was just being non-committal to avoid a confrontation and not because he actually thinks you might all go - you need to talk to him.

Contact SS and the police for advice. There is a likelihood that he will have conditions not to be with children etc if they have contacted you to arrange safeguarding.

Do not let your children have contact with this person, regardless of what DH's family say. I honestly cannot believe that your DH didn't tell MIL where to go.

If you contact SS or police for advice please remember that the uncle has not asked you to go it's your MIL trying to sort things out.

He might be against it as well.

I really don't understand why the Uncle isn't in prison.

This is nothing to tiptoe around at all. If your DH doesn't stand up to this, then you should. The attempt to cover this all up and make nice is highly disturbing. Who knows if there are other family members doing this that they are covering up for.

Be prepared to cut the entire lot out and shun them forever.

I can’t believe your DH’s reaction wasn’t “wtf Mum why would I take my kids on holiday with a paedophile?!”
Don’t skirt around the issue, tell them not to be so ridiculous!

I would broken-record every single conversation on this topic, with your DH, MIL, whoever, with "He likes to watch children being sexually abused". Just keep repeating that phrase, in a flat, calm tone.

"He's had a bad year because he likes to watch children being sexually abused."
"We won't be staying because he likes to watch children being sexually abused."

People will try to effectively change the subject by drawing you into a conversation about how hard done by he is and it wasn't that bad and blah. Refuse to be derailed. Keep repeating your phrase in that flat tone.

Do you actually think your do would take your children anywhere where this man is going to be? If you do, you have a huge problem on your hands.

What do you think do would do if he took your kids to see his mum and he was there?

Does your MIL ever have your kids on her own?

I think your MIL is unhinged and untrustworthy and I think you need to get your dh on the same fucking page as you here.

I would contact the police and ask them about the terms of his order and see if you can get a copy.

Do=dh

You need to know the terms of his SHPO.
Sometimes it might be to have no contact at all with under 16s.
I have seen them though with the condition of not staying in a house with under 16s unless the parents are fully aware of his convictions. So if it’s that then as you are aware it will not be a breach of his order or illegal.
Morally though I couldn’t do it, your DH should have told his mother no way. I’d question her judgement on this too, and as to whether I’d trust her not to bring the Uncle around.

You need to know the terms of his SHPO.

No, she doesn't! OP, or her DH, need to say "there is no way we are taking our dc on holiday with a convicted paedophile, his difficult year is entirely of his own making".

Do you think your dh mightn’t back you on this?? I wouldn’t ever trust his judgement again, either (or even be with him, tbh), if that’s the case

I never, ever MIL bash on MN but this would also make me seriously doubt your MIL's judgement and I don't think I would leave my DCs with her unsupervised ever again.

I'm so sorry that you're dealing with this OP.

Queen's advice is exactly what I would do, it leaves no room for logical argument and remaining calm should put a stop to any emotional histrionics from MIL. The facts are your best defence here, although frankly you shouldn't need to defend your position particularly to people who presumably love your DC. Nothing should come before protecting them and certainly not the feelings of someone convicted of child sex offences. Let us know how you get on speaking to DH, I really hope he's in your corner despite his initial response to MIL

What does it matter what the legalities etc are? If social services/his probation officer/whoever else has been mentioned say he can go on this holiday does it mean you’d happily take your children along? That’s a big fat no brainier nope from me.

You need to get in contact with SS to inform them that other family members have made this request which you will not be assenting to. Ask them what the terms of his release are so that you know for next time (there will be a next time). And ask them to speak to your SIL, MIL and DH (if necessary).

It's more than likely the uncle would be breaching the terms of his SHPO if he was spending overnights with young kids.

Contact his local police station and ask to speak to his VISOR officer.

And also tell MIL to get to fuck