Advice needed for a worried husband

[jonsoe]

Hi Apologies if this isn’t a suitable place to post something like this, but I’m desperate for advice. My male friends aren’t much help, and I don’t have a big family.

I’m married with two older children 10 and 13, I’ve been married to my wife for 7 years, but we’ve been together for about 15 years and had our kids before we got married. For the last 5 years I feel my wife has completely lost interest in me and doesn’t actually love me anymore. Things were fine, even through the tough early years when the kids were tiny - we both work full time in well paid jobs and are not short or dependant on each other for money. I am from a liberal family and was always brought up that fathers should share parenting and housework duties which we do very much. Two years ago my wife wanted to change careers and I took over a year off work to be the main child carer which I loved, being involved in my children’s lives daily. Outwardly we would seem to have the perfect life.

About 5 years ago my wife started to go out more and more without me, with her group of friends. Initially I didn’t have a problem with this - then most Fridays on my home from work I would get a text that she is going out again, can I put the kids to bed etc etc and I would be left home alone. This has continued, she also rarely shows me any physical affection (and I’m not talking in the bedroom) she never hugs, or kisses me or sits near me on the sofa - apart from a quick kiss before work, unless I initiate it. Outside if asking me how my work day was anytime we spend together she is on her phone on Facebook, watching TV or chatting to her friends, mum or sister. In her conversations with anyone but me she is very lively and animated , but to me she just seems bored - in fact I’m not sure she really knows anything much about me at all anymore.

I do love her and she is a brilliant mum and very successful in her career which I’m proud of and fully support. But I am no longer her priority anymore, she wanted to have kids young - which was fine with me. But now she has a wide group of friends whose husbands and partners are a lot older than me - at least ten years plus and we have nothing in common. When we do go out together I’m usually left on my own and tend to leave early. All my long term friends have much younger kids - either babies or toddlers so meeting up is very hard and we have very little in common now. My wife’s social life had got bigger and bigger and mine has become so small I sometimes wonder who I am?

Three years ago, her in- laws wanted to take us to Florida, Disney land etc - this is my worst idea of fun but agreed as my wife said if we go this time we won’t have to go again. But we couldn’t afford it and my wife refused to tell this to her parents, so the result was when we came

How much of this have you spoken to her about?

oops - didn't post full message, rest below:

so the result was when we came home we had huge debt. My wife refused to engage with sorting it out leaving it to me to go cap in hand to my mum to bail us out as we came a month away from not being able to pay our mortgage. obviously this was difficult as my mum couldn’t understand why we went if we couldn’t afford it - also my wife didn’t once thank my mum. As well as the money my pride took a knock - I’m in my forties having to ask my parents to bail me out.

This behaviour continued, she spends more and more time away from me with friends and family, on fathers day she went her dads (no problem) but we agreed she would go in the morning and then come home at lunch time so shed could spend the day with me and the kids. She came home at 4pm and then after half an hour took my daughter out shopping. When we organise things to do together she invites her mum and dad at the last minute, or they just happen to turn up.

Then last year, after a night out with her family she announced her mum and dad wanted to take us to Florida again - I said what did you say, she said ‘ I said yes of course’! I was livid, I would never take a decision like that before talking to my wife, plus the money stress from last time pushed me to the limit, plus she also said if we go the first time we wouldn’t have to go again. We argued about this - but to cut a long story short shed ended up going on her own with the kids and leaving me on my own. On her last night I booked a meal out so we could spend it together - she then said they were all spending the night in a hotel at Heathrow the night before ! (We live 15 miles from Heathrow airport) - so she couldn’t get away any quicker if she tried. I talked to her about going for a week or 10 days then spending a week together on our own as a family doing things together - but the only option from her was to go for the full time. She also suggested when she got back I go away for two weeks with the kids, basically suggested we spend over a month apart! As soon as she got back she booked a weekend away with a friend and for a long time she said she was right to go as ’she just wanted to go’. I have no idea how she paid for it, probably credit cards - but have left it for her to deal with. Since this event its put an awful strain on our marriage which is getting worse.

In the bedroom we rarely have sex and she rarely if every initiates it, but to be honest I’m not sure if I care anymore if she doesn’t love me. I also found out on a night out with my old mates that people seem to thing she cheated on me with two other friends before we were married. She absolutely denies this - one of the people in question is now dead, and the other married and I have no wish to ask him if he slept with my wife! Despite all this and her denial, all the above has put such a lot of doubt in my mind I often can’t think straight. I mean why do grown adults just wake up one day and start saying someone slept with two people - surely it comes from somewhere??

I have tried to talk to her about it, but it usually ends in a row and she often storms out. The only other person I have talked to about this is my Mum who suggest relationship counselling, but to get my wife to do that currently seems impossible.

All I can think now is

My wife really doesn’t love me, but can’t be bothered to admit it - she’s happy with things as they are and unless I go spare she seems happy to drift along playing happy families.
She doesn’t love me, and is trying to push me away so I make the first move and either leave or do something else.
She really doesn’t think she is doing anything bad, and is trying to juggle her life = but because I’m a man and don’t break down in tears she thinks I’m fine
She did cheat on me and I’ve found out - she doesn’t know what tod o about it - so is trying to stay away from me as much as possible

I would be devastated, but much happier if she just told me she didn’t love me anymore - then we could both move forwards and make plans of sorts whatever that maybe. But its the constant not knowing and just being treated as a spare part that is so upsetting and draining - I’m 43 and feel if she does want to leave me, leave me and I will get on with my life and start again.

Any help or advice would be much appreciated - sorry to ramble on ….

I'm sorry but everything you wrote point to the fact that indeed, she doesn't love you any longer. Reasons why she is still with you could be multiple.

Don't hang on and hope that it will come back. It's time to confront her and get it out in the open. At least then you'll know for sure.

As they say 'lyn'

I think you need to try and talk to her again and ask her if she actually wants the relationship

You're probably never going to know for sure re affairs.

If things don't change, do tippy want Rio still be in this marriage? Who is primary carer?

Stupid autocorrect Ltb

Thanks - hou are right, i think i’ve come come to that conclusion already and i just need to comfront her directly. The only reason i can think for her hanging on is my family are quite wealthy and we are in the process of significantly re- deceloping my parents ( i only have one now) family home for us all to live in. But i could be wrong - until i ask her directly.

thanks

sleepstandingup - we both really are the primary carers as both work full time with similar salaries. But all money earnt is shared and all parenting is equally split as is housework etc. My job is more flexible so i tend to be the one to stay at home when one child is sick or needs picking up from school - but we try to keep things equal.

If the gender roles were reversed here you'd have numerous posters jumping in telling you your partner has obviously 'checked out' of the marriage and to LTB.

It certainly sounds as if she's creating a separate life from you while using you for family & financial security.

Do you have joint finances? I think you need to look at what she is spending and how she's paying for all her socialising and weekends away. I'd be worried about being jointly responsible for her debts if she has any.

I think you need to sit her down and tell her how her behaviour has been making you feel and go from there. You'll know by her reaction whether or not she cares about you and the marriage at all.

Marriage counselling might be a good option if you can get her to go.

Thanks for the reply- that’s exactly how i feel, she has created a whole life for herself to which my role has become smaller and smaller, now almost shared child carer, shared money supplier and house mate.

Yes our finances are shared and always have been since day one. I don’t spend much and because we’ve always have enough coming in due to dual incomes i never really check. But big expenditures on things like the house, or weekends away i tend to cover- simply becuase my dad passed away and i came into my inheritance so had more money from this. Which now thinking about it seems a bit stupid - my mum is also quite generous for example she paid for a skip when we needed building work, we get zilch from her parents. Before the credit crunch i used to get decent bonusses (those days are long gone) in in the past paid off her credit card bills etc.

The thing is she is not a horrible person and is kind and caring, but just seems to have drifted away. She doesnt seem to think of my feelings when she dissapears for a weekend - sometimes i think i have the female personality in our relationship and she has the more male one as i always try to think how something i do would make the other person feel. I think she feels i should just man up or something?

I dunno, its just loads of things over time that have happened and I think she see’s them as seperate individual things - whereas for me its time and time again. I’m just find it hard to pin point when it first happened...

i don’t drink, smoke or take drugs - i don’t follow football or a sports team. i keep myself in shape, i workout 3 times a week and walk the dog daily. If i could see a reason for it, ie turned into a fat lazy bloater - i’d be happier, i just don’t know why its happened - and wish she would explain.

Sigh ... i just dont want to waste my life or hers for that matter.

Wad asking about caring as the problem if you LEAVE is you tend to walk away without the kids. So the problem with the usual LTB is what happens to the kids? Are you happy to have shared custody or less, leave her in the home.

Can you get a babysitter, Go out for dinner somewhere neutral and tell her your concerns

I couldn’t bare to leave my kids - we are very close. My daughter is very sensitive and we are close (im close to my son and daughter the same - but he’s a bit more hardy, or i’m just prejudiced as hes a boy and were socialised to think that). it would reall affect them - i think it would destroy my daughter and i couldnt do that.

I think we need to talk and have relationship counselling no matter what - i need to find out what the problem is. I couldnt leave my children.

And that's possibly why she's staying too.

You really need to try and get her to talk, and tippy really need to hear what she's saying

You only get one life @jonsoe and it sounds as if she's the only one living it.

She's behaving really selfishly but unless you call her out on it she's going to keep doing what she can get away with doing.

Don't be a mug.

I think she's having her cake and eating it. She's not a kind person she's really selfish.

Go for 50:50 custody and find someone who actually cares about you.

Thanks everyone- really appreciate everyone’s advice we need to talk and stay calm, otherwise nothing will change. I have been looking up the ‘Relate’ website, even if she won’t come along they do indicidual sessions - so if all elae fails i can get some professional advice. Glad i posted this - best advice i get from my mates are along the lines of ‘tell her to do one mate’ ‘or go and shag somone else’ ... not exactly the most constructive things i want to hear to sort things out !

tell her to do one mate

Well I think they have a point. One can rely on blokes for blunt truth!

You could waste more time going to Relate together, but honestly she checked out of this relationship a long time ago. As she has cheated on you how could you trust her again anyway? I think it would be better to go alone and formulate your exit strategy.

Also go and see a lawyer and start to consider what a divorce settlement might look like. If you're doing up your parents' house - could you afford to run it on your salary alone?

Unfortunately she is certainly not behaving as if she loves or even respects you. She sounds very selfish to be honest.

I’m sorry to say this as it means less time with your children but I do think you need to end the marriage. It’s important to model healthy relationships to your children and this certainly isn’t one.

I don’t think it’s even worth trying relationship counselling as it doesn’t sound as if she will even go, let alone engage.

Sorry OP. Hope you can end it and build a happier life without her.

Op, couple of small things but you said all finances are shared but 'big' expenses are covered by your inheritance, so that sounds as though you have separate funds from your wife, not everything is shared.
And you work out /gym 3 times a week aswell as both working full time so those 3 occasions I assume are after work? So I assume those 3 evenings a week your wife is taking care of the house & kids after work, just as you are responsible for that when she goes out. You BOTH have a social life but you seem to begrudge her having one? Hmm, she definately sounds as though she cannot be bothered with you though, maybe suggest counselling or a trial separation so you could be happy because I am sure it isn't much fun for her either having a husband constantly wingeing about her.

To be honest it sounds like you are past relationship counselling to help rebuild the marriage. But it also sounds like she is pretty happy with how things are. She has a great life, and breaking up with change this. So she might be reluctant. She might make the right noises about staying together if you sugges finishing it. But I doubt you'll see her putting the effort in. And you will be the bad guy.

....Maybe relationship counselling would work as a way to make her see he relationship is finished. And make it easier to finish. It sounds like she is informally out of it anyway (could already be cheating, but might not be so I wouldnt assume that). But she might need a poke to, like you suggest, open up, and admit its done. And further counselling might help you split amicably for the kids. It may be rough, as I cant see an obvious solution to who stays in house and who "leaves". Do you think she will agree to continue 50/50 care?
Note: ive never attended relationship counselling so may be being optimstic here with what it can achieve

As an aside, it sounds like you need to work on your support network. This is the one bit which you have a lot of control over and your wife has no responsibility for. Why is it hard to meet up with friends with younger kids? Do you kids not like babies and toddlers? Maybe not the 13 year old, but most of the 10 year olds I know are pretty happy to muck in amusing a toddler. You will feel a lot better through the process if it gets awkward if you have some decent support and down time with friends and family.

Sorry you're going through this, Jonsoe. You sound lovely. Yes, she does sound selfish. I think you're going to have to have a deep and meaningful - or more likely a number of them. She needs to know how you feel and you need to know what she's planning. The money business is a bit concerning too.

She's checked out of the marriage.

She doesn't love you.

She doesn't respect you.

I'd also be willing to bet she's cheated on you for quite a while.

Right now you're convenient to be with and image is what she's concerned about.

Speak up if you want this to end. Be prepared to hear she doesn't love you if pushed ...but you need the truth. Then you can make a decision.

In the meanwhile. Invest time in yourself. Get a social life. Keep fit or get fit and look after yourself. Dont hang around and wait for her.

Knowledge is power.

even if she won’t come along they do individual sessions

Good idea. In case the waiting list is too long...seek individual counselling elsewhere.

She doesn't sound that bad or selfish to me, to be honest. She's not doing anything wrong. Lots of women rarely initiate sex.
She goes out after work some Fridays (so what), she goes for the odd weekend away with a friend (so what). She went away with her parents and the kids to Florida and probably you kicked off and you didn't want to go (but you phrase this as 'leaving you on your own).
Your own words 'I am no longer her priority'. So this is how it seems you would like it:
You want you to be the centre of her life. Her Priority.
You don't want her to be out with friends, nor go anywhere without you. You are jealous of her family and think they control her, and you hate the sight of them turning up because then the attention isn't on you. She's not providing you with suitable friends because they are older than you.
You don't have much of a social life outside your own family, you don't enjoy nights out where you have to talk to people. When she goes off talking to other people across the room, you leave and go home.
You can't go anywhere on a holiday or trip of your own because you don't have friendships or hobbies. If you had social anxiety, for example it would get worse over time because the buffers of siblings, parents and childhood friends tend to ebb away as a person gets older.
My advice would be to seek counselling for yourself and see how to expand your own life a bit, and maybe get some perspective on your relationship.

See a solicitor so you know how things will stand if you split up. Don’t tell her just see Sol, find out what your financial situation would be, could you be the resident parent for the DCs, or is it 50:50, where could you afford to live etc etc. Then you will be debating the future from a position of knowledge not one of fear of the unknown. Also you can give some proper thought as to how you want your future to pan out. You sound young, there’s a new life out there for you - which includes your DCs.