Stbxh wants full custody to live abroad with dcs!

[WishfulWanderer]

Stbxh won't communicate with me about divorce and dcs. Still living in same house, 3 dcs all under 11. He does not want the divorce and keeps telling me he feels sorry for me because I'm divorcing him because my past has affected my mental health and I don't know what I'm doing, I don't have any mental health issues though. He has said he wants full custody and wants to move to Europe with all 3 dcs, I said let's talk about this and it's appropriateness for the children, he says I can't talk to you about anything without a lawyer present. I don't think he'll get it? He says this about everything. I want an amicable divorce so asked him if he wants to cite 2 yr separation (live in separate rooms) vs unreasonable behaviour, again he says I can't talk to you about that without a lawyer present. Any advice ladies? Should I just ignore him not ask to discuss? Don't think I can get him to come to any arrangement with me. Thanks

According to the website I’d linked to he’d be eligible to file for divorce in Sweden regardless of where you got married.

I hope you’re right and he isn’t planning to do this. But then again he keeps bringing up lawyers himself?

The website mentions a six month consideration period (I think thats the time you have to be separated before you can get divorced in Sweden).. I hope he’s just not just waiting for those six months to pass before making his move..?

I hope you’re right and I’m barking up the wrong tree!!

Either way, time to get proper legal advice - if nothing else to put your mind at rest about his ridiculous demands re the children. What a horrible situation to be in - wishing you all the Best

I'm one of those divorced women. Sooooo happy now. Remarried and life is good.

Don't listen to him. You now have a business relationship that you need to end like a professional.

You need to start disengaging. Stop trying to talk to him and when he starts his blah blah blah refer him to your lawyer. He wants to maintain the status quo and is prepared to manipulate you in order to achieve this.

You need to take action. Don't assume "he won't" because if he does it's too late to take some measures.
So: get passports etc. Out of the house somewhere safe
Read the leaflet up thread - it tells you who to inform to prevent him taking DC overseas without you.
Get legal advice and from someone who is both a Rottweiler and knows about international "custody" issues.
Become a "grey rock"
And start Divorce proceedings- to keep it in the UK.
And Women's Aid is there if you need it.

Saying you have MH issues when you don't is gaslighting and is abusive. Please don't rely on him not filing for divorce because he doesn't want one - he is all about doing whatever it takes to control you right now. You need to get in there first - nail down the legal stuff to prevent him taking your kids and get those passports out of the house today!

You can’t have a civil sensible conversation with someone who is neither civil or sensible so stop trying to talk to him.

You have had some good advice here. Definitely take it and get us sorted/started ASAP.

Passports secure, residency order obtained...that way if he is mucking around with lawyers in Sweden you are covered. Please please don’t assume he won’t file in Sweden. Speak to your lawyer on Monday and make sure that he can’t! Protect yourself. Men can be nasty, ruthless bastards when it comes to divorce.

Different point of view, for the sake of discussion - you are the one who initiated the separation, correct? So you can have a new start? You knew this would affect your relationship/bond/time with your kids. Does he not deserve a chance to a new start? Why does he have to have his life blocked or his bond with the kids broken? He did not want this.

itsadventuretime - the OP can't remove the children from the country unilaterally either. Lots of Mothers get trapped in countries because their husband divorces them.
Neither party can unilaterally move overseas and take the children with them. Legally

The central consideration is "what is best for the children" which is usually: remaining mainly with their Primary carer, seeing the other parent as much as possible, keeping things as similar as possible. Law in most jurisdictions works on this basis. So even if the children were taken to Germany by their father they would most probably eventually be returned to the UK. But at a lot of cost financially and emotionally!
The father isn't threatening to take them to Germany for their benefit, he hasn't bothered about working away from them before. It's about him and his control.

it’sadventuretime - it’s not best for the children to have to leave their home country just to satisfy the whim of a disgruntled parent though is it? The needs of kids come 1st. Period. That’s why there are laws stopping a parent taking kids abroad. Nobody cares about his feelings. He’s a big boy and sort himself out as can the OP. The kids have rights to not expect their entire lives to be upturned and to be ripped away to an unknown country away from their friends and everything they’ve ever known. It’s why kids staying in the family home is the main priority for a court. He won’t get permission to do this and for very good reason. The entire British legal system (that has been operating for centuries) knows better.

But OP is at the moment all about her benefit. She wants to pursue another life in spite of the consequences to her kids. Why is the burden of what’s best for the kids on the husband? She gets to do what’s best for her, but he has to do what’s best for the kids? I don’t follow. I’m not advocating for kidnaping or anything illegal. If she leaves, she should have less to say on the lives of those left behind. Will her husband have a say in where she lives?

The needs of kids come 1st. Period

Tell that to OP

People are allowed to leave miserable relationships. OP is leaving her husband - she shouldn't have to lose her children because her relationship has broken down.
Her h doesn't have to lose them either - he can stay in Britain and work, as he has been doing.
A parent who wants to take their kids to a foreign country, away from their other parent, just to spite their ex, is an unfit parent.

Staying in a relationship with a controlling man who is attempting to gaslight the OP, is not in the best interests of the children!

Her actions have consequences. We don’t know why she chose to leave her husband in the first place or if he is being an ass now because he is hurting. A happy father who is clearly more committed to what a family means can be better for the kids than a selfish mother and a destroyed father who struggles to get over the hurt of his wife leaving him because she’s landlocking him. As before, will he have any input on where she lives?

itsadventuretime you are obviously new here or you won't have seen the stories of dozens and dozens of mothers who are trapped in a town/city where they have no support and have a lower quality of life because their ex husband has forced them to stay there via a prohibited steps order. The OP's ex has that option. He can force the OP to stay in the same location because continuity is important for the children. He can't force her to move.

Take all of your own and the DC's important paperwork like birth certificates, passports etc. and take them out of the house and leave them with a good friend for safe keeping. If he asks you where they are, say the usual place and then feign ignorance as to their location. I'd start about securing your financial stuff too like bank accounts and assets and changing passwords and pin numbers for everything. As stated previously, he's not your friend. He's also not someone to be reasoned with as he's only acting in his best interests now. The less you discuss with him the better. If I was you, I'd play my cards close to my chest and not disclose my hand. Any information he gets about you, he will use.

Itsadventure
The OP Is and always has been the children's resident parent main carer- sacrificing her income, her pension and hobnailing her future earning and pension because SOMEONE needs to look after young children and she put THEIR needs first by being their pt working main carer.
Everyone has a right to leave an unhappy / dysfunctional relationship - and in the long run this is a better role model for children (so that they do not internalize destructive ideals for future relationships.)
The OP is acting in hers and her children's best interests - apparently you'd rather she was a miserable beholden drudge to her husband "for the sake of her children " ??
The children's father is clearly upset that his home childcare arrangements that worked for him and his carers benefit I.e. he can have the lovely seeing kids at home whenever he chooses but it doesn't disrupt his working life with their illnesses or their time away from childcare/school. So he has decided to hurt the OP (and the children )by removing them from their lifelong default parent and main carer, their home, their extended family and their country /language/culture and way of life - he does not have to do this for work or health reasons - he could stay in this country to work as he is doing without issue currently, his motivation is purely spite and done because he comes from a place of entitlement.

Is he able to apply for Swedish passports for them? If he can then hiding their passports won't help.

sistersofmercy you seem to know OPs whole history, and clearly not from this thread. Why did OP leave this horrible, horrible man?

Er, because he's horrible?

OP, file for divorce as soon as you can on unreasonable behaviour. As a PP said, it's gonna be a rough ride but you'll be so much happier at the end of it.

Do you have somewhere you can stash the passports safely? At work in a locked drawer? He could get Swedish PPs and hiding the birth certs won't work either as he can just order new ones. Destroy any PP photos of DC. Would they tell you if he took them to get new ones done?

He is trying to scare you.

You do not need his permission to get a divorce. Instigate proceedings ASAP on the basis of unreasonable behaviour. He will probably say he will defend it but his solicitor will tell him not to be so stupid.

There is no way out of this without getting the ball rolling legally so that needs to be your priority. Make sure you tell your lawyer he is threatening to leave country with DC. Maybe she can help with an injunction or something?

If she leaves, she should have less to say on the lives of those left behind.

Lol.

@itsadventuretime you don't know how divorces and residency work. At all.

There is no punishment for leaving. You don't get "less say" if you initiate the divorce.

In terms of child residency, courts will rule in the best interests of the child - which at the most basic level will include, where have they lived all their lives and how can that continuity and consistency be maintained.

Op works PT and does most childcare. She will not have "less say" on what happens to the kids ffs. She's their primary carer.

Who ended the marriage is neither here nor there. If it mattered, what would happen to women who left their marriages due to violence?

Sounds like coercive control. Log everything he says and does. Does he behave like a bully to you infront of the children?

Who’s talking about legal here? I’m talking about having the decency as a human being to allow her husband to rebuild his life - just like she wants to do. She is the one breaking up the family unit. Don’t bring abuse in here - violence, adultery etc of course those are a different matter.