Does your ex come to see your children at your house?

[question100]

Difficult divorce coming to an end (after loads of stress, sadness and trauma).

Ex was ordered (by consent) to move out at the end of April. He no longer spends any nights here but does come here to see the kids when I am not around. All his stuff is also still here.

In another couple of months the divorce will be finalised and at that point I will change the locks.

A relative seems to think that ex will still be coming over to see the kids here but I would find that very difficult. Am I wrong?

At the moment the dc do not want to go where ex is living. I am sure he has plans to sort out different accommodation but in the meantime what do I do? What do people do?

I want the dc to see ex often and spend time at his eventual house - they are at secondary school though and so can’t really be scheduled?

The problem is that ex and I are not on speaking terms as there is a lot of hurt. A LOT. Too long to go into.

Also this was ex’s home for many years so it would seem strange not to “allow” him here?

It’s all very traumatic and I am at the stage of wondering if I should have put up with my awful marriage instead.

My exh has never come to see DS at mine and our divorce was completely amicable.

Can your ex take the DC out for the day or to a family member's?

He’ll take them out usually, to the park, for a meal, a walk to the seafront or just to his house

He does ask them but they are bedroom bound teenagers. One of them does go out with him sometimes. Another has been on holiday with him. I am fine with it at the moment, totally fine, but am wondering about what will happen in two months.

I go out one morning of the weekend because I know he will be here. He also comes over and cooks for them while I am still on my way home from work. He comes over to drive them to school. All this without saying a word to each other - it has worked out like that. [Makes me feel like shit, the breakdown of the relationship but that’s for a different thread.]

Change the locks now, he has no reason to be coming around to the house. He was awful to you and therefore forfeits the right to have it made nice and easy... your children are also teenagers so old enough to have a relationship with him if they so wish to. And if not then that's their choice. He also needs to get his stuff out now as well.

Maybe ask DC what they would prefer to happen?

I don't think it's wrong of you to not want your ex to use your house as the place to see the kids.

I don't let my ex into my house anymore for reasons connected to my sanity. We're civil, but the boundary is essential.

Your home should be a place that you feel safe and comfortable.

You are not stopping him from seeing your kids - I can see it's a difficult situation with them being in their teens, but perhaps once you've taken your home as a venue for meeting out of the equation they'll be more up for alternative places to have contact.

He is still paying bills for the moment and I guess this is the interim bit?

What happens if the dc can never be bothered to budge or rarely ?

I am sure that once he is properly settled he will be setting up rooms for them etc..

Your home should be a place that you feel safe and comfortable.

I agree.

It’s difficult because H was/is very attached to the home and leaving it must be horrible .

I also agree that once this is no longer a possible venue then that will spur them on to find other solutions. Apart from one of the dc who I think really won’t move.

He should have set up bedrooms for them as soon as he moved out. They are supposed to view his house as their home as well. He should also have taken all of his stuff with him when he left as there is no reason why you should still be giving it house room.

I would suggest you text or email him and ask him to arrange to come and collect the rest of his belongings and return his keys and also ask him what nights each week he is going to have the DC's for regular contact (they can go for tea even if they don't want to stay yet). You need to set up a routine, they can take iPads/phones etc with them which is all they do at that age anyway.

I think you are handling this amazingly way, especially considering you aren't on good terms. Yes you can change locks, this and that. But I think what you are doing may be a more kind transition for your kids. If they are bedroom bound kids I'm guessing they are probably a bit quiet with their emotions too? Plus, if he hasn't got nice accomodation yet, why would you want your kids seeing their dad at a house that isn't nice or comfortable? To a previous comment that he should've sorted out accomodation straight away, divorce isn't cheap! I'd perhaps start setting some rules and boundaries that slowly transition to him no longer coming to yours in a way that is best for your kids. You sound like a very kind person and a great mum.

He should have set up bedrooms for them as soon as he moved out. They are supposed to view his house as their home as well.

He can’t set up bedrooms because it is more of a studio type set up (not that exactly but would be outing to say). He does have other resources that he could pool so that he has a bigger place, but that will take time, and tbh I don’t know what his plans are - due to things being so difficult.

I also think he has a new partner (this happened almost literally two seconds after it became clear we were not going to stay married, which made me question a lot of things and still does - sitting here at home (we were in the same house for about 9 months while the divorce was going through - and it still hasn’t gone through) having very late and very long intimate sounding phone conversations, and having showers getting ready to go out ), so I don’t know if she is a permanent fixture in his new set up, and how that will play out for the dc.

If they are bedroom bound kids I'm guessing they are probably a bit quiet with their emotions too?

Yes they don’t say a lot about it. The youngest is a bit bewildered I think .

The thing about texting or emailing ex, is that he does not respond at all.

I am a bit nervous about the plans he does have for the future, because he is not the kind of person who will let me know anything - he will tell the kids and that’s it. Eg the recent holiday he went on - he did not tell me anything about dates - I heard about the plans through my dc who went with him. Is it not just courtesy to give the other parent the heads up that you have plans to take one dc or more on holiday?

The whole divorce itself just feels horrible.

You sound like a very kind person and a great mum.

Thank you . I am not perfect (!), but it is so nice to hear things like that, especially after the barrage of horrible things H has said to me and about me over the last few months.

I think you are doing a huge service to your dc by allowing him access to your home, and one day they will fully appreciate that you did something pretty unusual because you had their best interests at heart.

I do think that, for your own sanity, you should transition towards an arrangement whereby he takes them out or to his place; your children are old enough to understand, and can make their own arrangements with him.

The one who won't budge will have to make a choice : see his dad or not. The inconvenience to him, getting off his bum and leaving his room, is preferential to you going quietly mad while your ex has the run of the house.

I'm sure your ex will fully expect things to change once the divorce is finalised. At the moment, I'm guessing, his name is still on the deeds and he may also still be paying something monthly towards the mortgage/bills, so that may constitute a morally grey area on whether to grant access to him. Once the divorce is finalised it's much easier to see the house as yours alone.

But I think that he should reciprocate, since you are showing him such consideration. He should be civil to you in your home, respond to texts about the children, and certainly keep you informed of the days he will visit and holidays. I don't see how he can justify such rudeness, unless you did something truly unforgivable. Perhaps you could raise those points next time he visits?

ExH has always come here to visit our DC and will still come here if they are at home and he is in the area (both are now adults). I still couldn’t tell you whether it was the right thing to do. He never set up bedrooms for them and never had them stay overnight (despite having spare bedrooms), except when he took them away on holiday. They certainly don’t consider his house, their family home.

When they were teenagers, he used to pick them up from school and then come in for a cup of tea (I was usually at work). With hindsight I think I enabled him to have everything on his terms and there have been no consequences for him for his awful, abusive behaviour during our relationship. However, so far, my children are happy, healthy adults which I don’t think they would have been if he had had a more active role in parenting them.

I'd say be very careful. I allowed my exH to carry on seeing the children at my house for four years after our divorce because I though this was easiest for the DC and would help them maintain their relationship. TBH I regretted it.

He is a nasty piece of work who always managed to slip in a dig at me and help himself to food and drink and when I was out used to go through my cupboards and look at my papers (and once my laptop when he got the DC to give him my password).

Even had he not been such a pillock there is a definite point when you just can't bear him in your space any longer. It sounds as if he has moved on. I'd just keep your house for you and your DC. Time will tell if he CBA to organise himself to see the DC.

Thank you for the suggestions and ideas. It’s all frighteningly new and I am trying to take it day by day.

Added to all the other emotions I also feel guilt. That on a beautiful day like today I got to sit in the garden with the dc, and he didn’t. What a nightmare.

Just to offer an alternative scenario...

ExDP lives overseas and no longer has a property in the UK. He comes over once a month /6 weeks for a long weekend with DD, and stays at my house, sleeping in the spare room. He keeps one or two things here to make life easier (cold weather clothes coat, boots, jumper, as his home country is a bit warmer than where we are up north). When I have to work away (2 or 3 times a year) he comes and stays here and looks after DD, (often my mother will come stay too, as exDP has a chronic health condition that can make the physicality of life with a toddler problematic when he’s in a flare cycle.)

ExDP and I are amicable- some sticky points we studiously disregard- for the sake of DD. Effectively, we’re offering her the explanation (very much grounded in truth) that mummy and daddy used to be married, but we didn’t get along very well when we lived together all the time, so we decided to try being best friends instead and that was much better.

It helps that we love each other dearly, but we simply cannot “work” as a couple- I had PNA/PND, which he was horribly unsupportive through (understandably-he has PTSD from a traumatic childhood of severe abuse), but which sadly killed any romantic inclinations I had left. Also nobody else involved.

Anyway-big ramble- he is very very welcome in my home. It’s not awkward, and our rationale is that this is also DDs home- and DD is our common ground regardless of anything else.

But with that said- we have the most amicable separation of anyone I’ve ever known- I suspect if it wasn’t, we wouldn’t be quite such a happy (separated) family....

My ex lives near me. If I found that he'd been in my property, which used to be the family home, I'd inform the police, even if he used the keys of my dc to get in. (Unlawful entry)
Ex also does not bother to communicate, and doesn't respond most of the time and I once had to threaten him with being charged with child abduction if he could not be bothered to tell me basic details about where he was taking them out of the country on holiday and when.
Unfortunately most information is leaked through the DC's because of his refusal to communicate. This puts them in the middle and is upsetting for them, but there's little I can do, because that's the way he wants it. Sometimes I refuse whatever it is unless he communicates with me, but this only works occasionally.

WhatisaNarwhal can I ask if your ex has a partner? Do you think this would change the dynamic?

I would like to be able to be amicable with H/ex in future but things have been so awful between us, and some of the things he said / accused me of during the divorce were so horrible, that I really don’t know if this will be possible. We have been estranged for a long time.

And the way he found someone else immediately (really immediately, it’s not that easy to meet people) made me feel so hurt and betrayed. He has narcissistic elements to his personality so I guess that he has now moved on to the next person, and just as he told me that his ex wife (he had been divorced a few years when I met him) is a bitch, I am sure he is telling this person that I am a bitch as well. He certainly told me verbally during the divorce that I am a stupid bitch, a fucking lazy bum, and asked if the bitches who had advised me had also sat on their fat arses doing nothing and other horrible stuff. All in front of one of my children.

I don’t think I am a bitch - he is very difficult and has been for a long time. I finally petitioned for divorce, after many years of his intermittent short temper, criticism, regularly stonewalling me for weeks, and complete lack of affection and interest. I wasn’t perfect but I would have been prepared to talk - he never ever was. He also owned everything in his name only and refused to budge on that - so I felt that I was an add on in his life rather than an equal partner.

So the divorce (we went to court for the financial settlement) has been a massive boundary setting exercise for me, and yes I did need solicitors because he is difficult and uses verbal aggression to get his way. He has also hidden assets in the past. I would not have been able to do it without their help. But this made him furious, so now I am a “bitch”. And the lies he told about me in court - that I have up to 100k in a hidden account was one of them - WTAF.

The settlement he would have wanted would have had us connected for the next few years and with his having control over what I owned. I only got the clean break (and freedom) that I wanted because I had the solicitors’ help.

But the outcome is that he hates me and it is less amicable (understatement) than it might have been.

lostin3dspace - I sympathise about the lack of communication. I guess there will come a time when the kids are older / adults when it just won’t matter.

Your last post really sheds a lot of light on his character. He is a controllling bully. He controlled you with terrible behaviour during your relationship (tantrums, stonewalling etc) then behaved terribly during the court proceedings. I believe he is still trying to control you by continuing to gain access to the house and leaving you to second guessing his future plans. He knows you and knows that you will be concerned about his future plans, whether the children will have bedrooms, that he loved the house and doesn’t get to enjoy it anymore. These things are nolonger your concern. It is up to him to be a good parent to your dc on his own terms, you have no influence over what he does and nor should he be able to influence you any longer. He still thinks he can control you.

Don’t let him do this. Take control. You say your solicitor helped you, which is brilliant. Speak to them again. They could write a signed for letter informing him that locks will be changed as of the date of the letter (leaving no time for him to try to get back in again) and contact with the dc must be arranged for out with your home. There is no reason for him to have access to your home. He is continuing to do so purely for his own ends, I don’t believe it is anything to do with your dc.

Wow Question 100! Are you in fact me?
When we split up I also was hoping for an amicable outcome. I envisioned living near each other so the kids could just come and go between houses and we would be at least civil and be able to have a cup of tea on occasion, be able to share birthdays, manage to do parents evening. And I told him so, and he let me believe this was possible and as a result I continued to trust him and play ball, when all the while he was trousering cash and lying and trying to cut a very poor settlement for me whilst presenting it as more than fair. And during the divorce I found out just how insidiously abusive he had been in the marriage.
I will never forgive him, and I have serious trust issues now, and that is why I can't give him an inch, and will only communicate in writing. And that is why he does his best not to communicate at all, and tries to make sure arrangements are through the kids and passively arranged 'in the ether' and I do my best to ensure that we are out or have plans if I get wind he has tried to do this again.
I'm sorry you went through similar.
OP, my experience is that people who don't communicate do it deliberately so that they can do what they like, because 'you haven't said no'. If you make them put everything in writing, they find a way around it because they can't gaslight you about it if you have it in writing. Hence making arrangements directly with the children without including you.
I would phase out access to your home. Eventually stuff you've bought for the kids will dissapear - that posh winter coat, or that mountain bike. He will simply see your home, your possessions and your time as an extension of his.

Hi OP

My situation sounds very similar to yours, but I’m earlier in the process ( my ex also found someone else immediately, I’m pretty certain now he was actually having an affair). He sees the D.C. here too ( although also one night at his). I worry about what to do when we eventually divorce re him coming here. He still views it as completely his house. I also understand the irrational ‘guilt’ and the feeling you can’t say no because he pays towards the bills etc. I find drawing boundaries with him very difficult - if I’m honest I’m a little frightened of it.

I wonder - if you can afford it it - whether you have had any counselling at all? I think if you can find the right person it can maybe help. I’m seeing someone and he is starting to get me to see that it’s OK to put my needs into the mix as well - even first at times. To not repeat patterns in the marriage of always putting the children and your ex before what you need, if that makes sense? And that you being happy and feeling safe is good for the kids too. Plus that it is now for your ex to maintain his relationship with the kids, not you.

Anyway I just wanted to say how it seems like you are doing such a great job of putting your kids first, but don’t forget yourself in all this. You need to be able to move on and be happy. But I know that is easier said than done

Crossed with Lost - seems very good advice from experience!

OP. I was in a very similar situation. I found counselling very helpful to set my boundaries and give me support sticking to them.

Your XH is an adult and it is his job to maintain his relationship with his children, not yours to facilitate it.

Teenagers will make their own minds up. They have better things to do than hang out with us. My XH only engages on his terms, which depends on what’s in it for him. So does little in the way of parenting, but thinks he is Dad Of The Year turning up to a cup final if there’s some glory to be had. Sadly the DCs see it for what it is and he isn’t very high up on their priorities.

Set your boundaries OP, and stick to them. It’s tough.

Oh yes I forgot - he also told my solicitor that I had never been able to look after the children’s best interests, and he couldn’t see that changing in the future .

Once the two months are up, I think things will be clearer, because legally things are not sorted yet. I suppose that this is the transition period and it gives everyone time to get their bearings. And I did, for example, text him when my dd was ill and he was with her while I had to be out. So things like that are helpful - especially for the dc.

Teenagers will make their own minds up. They have better things to do than hang out with us. Yes .

I was seeing a counsellor but am taking a break, because I want to find someone who is better able to dissect relationship dynamics.

I must stress that there were definitely things I could have done differently in the relationship, but the manipulative behaviour was H’s and it was very damaging. I also think he hadn’t cared about me for a long time, but would have carried on in our non relationship forever. Whereas I found it soul destroying.

For now he is here if I am not here so at least I am finally getting space to maybe start to heal a little. It has been very painful because I suppose I still “love” him, it is just that the dynamic between us was toxic and I couldn’t continue like that.

When things are finalised I will know better if I have to set more boundaries or not. Am a bit scared of what further pain is coming my way in terms of what he does in the future - including when my dc meet his partner, if she is still in the mix (at the moment I wouldn’t know). Being cut off is very painful.