YO HO NO - support for those saying 'No' at Christmas

[pigmcpigface]

Inspired by @JenBarbers thread in Chat, this is a place for anyone who is drawing a boundary this Christmas.

You might be saying 'NO' to Christmas altogether, or to one element of it. You might be refusing to see difficult relatives, or you might just not want to cook one more bloody turkey, ever again. Or you might just want to do it your way, this year or every year in future.

If you love Christmas and every single aspect of it, and you're blessed with a perfect family who all get along and sing carols around a roaring fire, then this is probably not the place for you.

And yes - we know it's only May. But for some people, this is so stressful that Christmas worry is year-round. And, for some, it takes months to build up the courage to say 'No, I'm not doing that'.

I cab suffer terribly with SAD so I’m with those of you that hate the dark. If you throw a Christmas that is a complete washout into the mix, i can struggle with poor MH for months.

I’m another one who is backed into a corner to do and arrange everything and I resent it every single year. I used to love Christmas but I now dread it. The dread of people being offended by being shut out is already descending but this year self preservation has to prevail!

I wish I could go abroad, bit of sun, peace and quiet to escape it all.

In reality it would mean leaving the dog, my adult kids would want to come .. fine, but that's the peace and quiet bit gone. My mother is too frail to leave for nearly two weeks. Dh's work would have a fit month end stuff. He works away in the week so holidays/weekends is his time to see family and us all getting together. Plus there is a lot of rugby on which we'd be loathe to miss

Actually, his family is far easier to get on with than mine, we have bbq's together and been on several holidays and trips, we see my bil and sil most weekends. I enjoy their company.

My parents are divorced, it wasn't an amicable one. So I'm having to juggle them, easy when we don't see my father but he appears in December to "arrange the date to meet up". For years I didn't go, wasn't invited in truth but my Ds who was a teen at the time wanted us all to go one year and I couldn't be the one who stopped a relationship between my son and his grandfather.

I never bad mouthed him to my kids but they knew there was something cos he just wasn't in our lives, only surfacing at Christmas, he never bothered with their birthdays unless I reminded him and then I just stopped reminding him. I stopped sending cards too then. Now my Ds has worked him out he refused to come last year.

Once I get past their family farce day I actually enjoy Christmas. It's not normally but the actual day was bad this year, organising it all, stocking up, cooking, then them cancelling on Christmas morning. I do all my prep on Christmas eve, including cooking two of the meats, so it was far too late to save me work. That's when I had my hissy fit wondering why I even bother!!

Just the four of us was very nice though, we all enjoyed it being just us.

I am not quite a Christmas hater (people in real life think I am Mrs Christmas in lots of ways) but there are lots of things I hate about the season and lots of things I have changed, slowly, over the years to make it more in line with what I want it to be.

DH and I don't travel "down home" every year, and since we were married 2 years (and long before DD arrived), anytime we have gone home for Christmas it has been to stay in a rented cottage somewhere nearby. There's room in both houses for us, but we need to escape the madness to cope at times. We had to stay in DMILs the year that DFIL had died in November and it was awful (it always was going to be but poor DH had a dreadful time, I just shrugged it off as best I could - but when I got tears at us leaving (hours late already) for going to see my DPs, as we ALWAYS did and had been clear that we would be doing, in the late afternoon and when DMIL was surrounded by family with more due to arrive, it just topped off an already shit day).

We both have lots of cr*p to deal with in both our families.

We started putting our foot down last year and stayed in our own house again for the first time in quite a few years. There are still things I need to work on, but we have tried to think about it in terms of what we would like the season to be, and be about, rather than expectations of others.

We do cook turkey, because we like it. But we only eat turkey twice in the year really - Thanksgiving (which is a small joint roast after work) and Christmas. And we cook it as we'd like it, and with the trimmings we like but not groaning after dinner and unable to move we're so stuffed.

Oh, I am thought of as "Mrs Christmas" as I live by the girl guide law "A Guide smiles and sings under all difficulties" so I do put a good face on it. But I am not asking people their plans or how much they have left to do or telling others how much I have left to do - I am just putting on a front and trying to "whistle a happy tune so no-one ever knows", and it kinda works but not completely.

LOVE THIS THREAD!!

Last Christmas, I booked a table at a carvery cheap and cheerful pub for lunch, which was gorgeous.

I only bought cheeses/ nibbles and we all had the best day ever!!
I find the whole thing a bit triggering because my family are not close and I miss my mum who died a couple of years ago.

Also my step-daughter loves coming round because our house is so quiet and round at her mother's there are loads of loud people. She plays with her toys in peace round here!

I would say 'PLEASE your self' is the BEST christmas policy ever.

I love that idea of pleasing yourself. I think it's really important to do Christmas in your own way. That might mean no Christmas at all, as long as it's YOUR version of no Christmas, IYSWIM.

I can probably explain this a bit better with an illustration. My Mum doesn't do Christmas at all. But she doesn't just get on with doing her own thing either. She spends the entire time in a negative state of feeling guilty and resentful and stressed - even though she's not doing anything! So her 'No to Christmas' is actually almost completely governed by negative feelings. It actually just becomes an anti-Christmas sulk!! I don't think that's something to aim for. Saying "No to Christmas' should mean saying "Yes" to something else that you really want, it should be a positive, empowered choice. I'm not suggesting that it's an easy choice, mind - getting rid of guilt, obligation and the fear of upsetting people isn't straightforward. For me, it's always going to be partly an art of compromise and partly a big fat YES to some things that I actually want to do.

I am a Christmas fanatic so you would think this thread is not for me, however I am always interested in other people's views and I also have things I am putting my foot down on this year.

We will try to not invite over a certain relative that always causes drama with his rude behaviour and has ruined many gatherings before.
We won't spend way waaaaay beyond our means on being Santa- and then panic all year about the credit card bills.
I feel relieved already 😊

jellyshoes, you would probably be able to get the rugby abroad

Posters who are dreading it already, stop it NOW! Diddimus be strong for the sake of your own mental health. Try to follow interuptus policy of "PLEASE your self". I'm dropping out altogether but for people who can't, interuptus christmas sounds like the next best thing (although I would have hated the pub if the xmas songs were playing) Great idea though- no xmas dinner shopping, no cooking, no dirty dishes. And how lovely that your dsd came to play in peace. She's learning to drop out already, bless her. I also love your policy, shall we repeat it every now and then to support/ remind people? "PLEASE your self". Yaaay

When we got married, DH and I decided we would spend Christmas itself in our own home. We travel to see family (8 hours each way for some...) around Christmas, but not having 25 December together really lowers the stress, for me at least - I know my mother disapproves of a number of things we do (or, more accurately, don't do) at Christmas, but not being together on the day saves the arguments and sulks.

Both DH and I prefer beef to turkey, so guess what we have. We enjoy not holding onto traditions for the sake of it!

I'm with you! I'm divorced from my dh and so the kids have been alternating christmases. My new dp goes to his family, I have the dc or spend it alone (bliss!) or occasionally go to Dps mum's.

Last christmas, DPs family decided that as I didn't have the dc, they would come to me. Fine, I invited them for Xmas dinner (Xmas day = on the Monday) This turned into 'We'll come down on Sunday, spend the night at Dps, oh, and collect DsisIL's son (so Dps nephew) and his gf, and come to yours for the Turkey dinner (only - 'can we have Beef?')' oh and then stay overnight again Monday night at Dps, and go back Tuesday mid-afternoon.
I objected strongly, as I wouldn't have any time on Xmas day to spend with my own kids, watching them open presents before they went to Exdh. And MIL wanted to come and sit in my house all Xmas day while SIL and Dp went to get her son and gf ...

Never, ever again. I've fallen out with SIL (no-one will say No to her except me) and will never voluntarily be in the same room as her again, so that's sorted.

Thank you for this thread pigmcpigface.

Christmas has been on my mind too much already this year! I've already reduced a lot of the obligation gift stuff...one last thing remains: The expectation that we will host PIL every other year which looks like may turn into every year...

Sound like such a minor thing but I've got to the point with them now where I struggle to be around them - they've done some truly horrible and damaging things over the years.

We would ideally like to be NC with them (huge backstory and a treasure chest of anecdotes but...bottom line is that they tick all the boxes for traits of covert narcissism between them) but as we live so close to them we've decided that we can cope with visits of 30 mins every few weeks.

After 30-40 mins, almost like clockwork, the bad behaviour surfaces (namely PA remarks, shit stirring and badmouthing people - despite continued boundary reinforcement). They CAN actually be fairly good company until this starts.

The bottom-line is that we never want to share a meal again with these people, and that includes Christmas dinner. Up until 2-3 years ago we still had a lot of FOG (then I discovered the stately homes thread, read a lot, had several 'wow' moments...learnt!) so attempts at getting out of it were weak. We carried on for the DC (what a joke that is now looking back - they are not good grandparents) and because DH once put him foot down and did what he wanted to do for Christmas (before I met him) and it created drama for months.

We can't face the drama so...we're thinking of going away for Christmas (UK as we have dogs we will need to take) as an excuse to break the cycle. Which is insane as we don't want to go away...but we've still got some FOG and drama avoidance in us .

I love Christmas now, but a few years ago it was a big ball of Nope for me. I made changes - firstly, both sides of the family limit presents: Adults put names in a hat and buy for one person, with a modest maximum monetary value applied..

We do Christmas at home ourselves - that's Christmas eve and day and it's our house, our rules and our food choices. People are welcome (if I like them, bugger off if I don't!) but don't expect us to go out on icy roads and stay sober to go to your house.

I do the food planning, shopping and prep (because I do love it), DP does the toy's click & collect shop - that includes finding out what each kid might like/want from parents. He likes that job too so it's a win there as well.

Since we got off the merry-go-round madness that was buying 15 presents of unwanted tat for adults and getting 15 bits of tat/clutter back it's become very manageable and very enjoyable - and affordable!!

New rule for 2018 though. One present from Grandma. Not heaps like last Christmas. She's been warned and to be fair has took it on board with good grace.

Stressful Christmas is a very distant memory with ex DP and his horrible extended family. I am not Christian and yet I was the one doing everything, buying presents for them (from my money), everyone expecting it to be hosted at my place each year, wrapping, cooking, cleaning and then bending over backwards entertaining them all. The final Christmas and just before the split, I had 14 people in my home, some I didn’t even know but were brought along without even asking me. One ignorant, elderly relative kept lighting one cigarette after the next and lectured me on my asthma, leaning closer and closer, puffing her smoke in my face while I tried to prepare the food and struggled to breathe. They all came hours earlier than invited by my ex, so it was chaos. I kept having to go outside and sit in my garden, getting wheezier and wheezier. I started feeling a white-hot rage and visualised throwing the plates with food at them. Meanwhile, my ex did nothing but expected to be waiting on too. I did not have a melt-down.

Instead, I quietly grabbed loads of clothes, passport for me and the dogs and took all the cash in the house. My ex owed me loads and once again half-heartedly promised to pay me for the money I laid out but never did and would no doubt stiff me again. He was paid a very generous bonus and his wage given in cash too, probably to diddle the tax man and every year, he tended to buy himself luxuries and not once contributed to food or bills or paid me rent. No one paid any attention to me and I can pack quickly. Put all the bags in the car, they were all so self-absorbed they didn’t even notice, then took food that could be eaten on the road. Finally, I quietly got the dogs and drove off in my car (which my ex used all the time, again without contributing to its upkeep, insurance etc) towards Dover. Luckily, Eurotunnel actually has some crossings on Christmas Day in the afternoon and plenty of tickets available. The funniest thing that I heard nothing from my ex during the hour’s drive to Folkstone. No one appeared to have even noticed my absence. Only once I got out in Calais, there were loads of texts, which I ignored. I spent a wonderful few weeks in the south of France in my family’s holiday home, as I work self-employed, so no pressure to get back for a set date. I did not answer my phone, then blocked the ex and all withheld numbers.

Now, I don’t do Christmas at all. My DH and I don’t bother with any of it. I don’t get cards, even if sent any, no gifts, no invites, no hassle. I firmly believe this is why we have a harmonious relationship with little friction.

Temptress your second paragraph had me gripped - think I smiled throughout it - amazing story - love that you had your lightbulb moment on Christmas day and acted upon it straight away!

Miggeldy - another happy story - thank you for sharing!

Temptress Bloody brilliant!

Thank you for this thread ❤️

I’m single and my family are away this Christmas. I’ve been conflicted about what to do this Christmas. I’ve been invited away to a friends house but I feel like I’d be ‘tagging along’ and they have young children (who I love!) so a lot of it will (rightly) revolve around them. I feel like ideally I’d like to sleep from December 25th to December 29th?

I’ll be working because the rest of my team have young families and because I don’t love Christmas I’d like to fill that gap. I just don’t know what to do Boxing Day / 25th / Christmas Eve.

For children under 18 yes I can understand the present giving thing. Somewhat.

But honestly, truly, deeply, what adult is so childlike that they expect a gift, and then go and buy a gift for Other Adults! I just don't get it one bit. So time consuming and so easily forgotten next day really.

Anyway we put a stop to all that years ago. Only buy (or voucher/cash) for the children under 18 and no one else at all. Well just Mum and that's allowed I hope!

Honestly, everyone is so chilled and happy with this. But as usual it took the ogre in the family (me) to suggest it. And it was a big YES! Whew...

Result.....

I have more to report on a mutually happy Christmas but will leave it at that for now.

Thinking about driving off that day made me smile. But I had put up with a lot of emotional abuse and utter piss-taking for quite a long while before. Apparently, he and his family whined to everyone how evil I was to ruin Christmas and stealing his cash. Well, Ms Grinch here left a lot of the food (I took the nice deli stuff in a cool bag though and grabbed the decent wine etc lol). I just did not cook it. And I am really pleased that I had not got around to handing people their presents. I managed to return quite a few items and sold stuff on eBay when I got back. The previous Christmases, they all turned up, contributed nothing to the vast food and alcohol bill, bought no drinks but expected me to nip to the overpriced off-licence to get more, did not raise a finger to help and I often I did not get any presents in return or thoughtless crap. I had a very childish joy at not being taken for granted that year. My EA ex never got me any Christmas or birthday presents. I felt that the cash was a small repayment of his debts. He also made a big song and dance about me taking my own car and ‘leaving him stranded’. In central London with a tube station and loads of bus stops in spitting distance. But this egomaniac refused to use public transport like other mere mortals. For me Christmas or the absence of the whole freakshow is very symbolic.

Temptress - oh well done you!!

chesty - I know it sounds like suck a hackneyed suggestion, but I've been in your shoes and I went to volunteer at one of those soup kitchens for the homeless. It was actually really fun. Cinemas are sometimes open in big cities too. I would also pop in to see your friends for a bit - I am sure the invitation is genuine. When DH and I have had Christmas Day to ourselves, we have sometimes gone for a walk with a pair of close friends, and it's a great thing to do (the guy of the couple has a birthday on Christmas Eve, so we often see them the night before too!!)

Ophelia - I wish my in laws took that attitude. They demand £100 per person for a gift. There are no kids in the family.

Shortbook - I was reading your post, recognising so much stuff! I think the primary thing is to keep yourselves safe. If there is a 40 minute cut off for behaviour, then visit for 40 minutes but NOT on Christmas Day and definitely DON'T do the meal either. I know it's a really short time, but some assertive body language and a refusal of any drink but water should get you in and out of there. I wish that we could do the same thing with my in laws, but unfortunately they are a 5 hour drive away.

Diddimus - spring from another SAD sufferer!

Thank you whiskyowl for the reply. My friends live miles away so I’d have to go at least two nights which puts me off. I had no idea some cinemas are open I love the cinema and always go on my own!!

Make the most of it guys. Someone just reminded me it's only 10 weeks to school hols, then 6 weeks summer, then the bombardment begins! We need a plan to relieve us from the xmas countdown!

I don't even know where to begin this year. I like (liked?) bits of Christmas, and our home has been the centre of the extended family Christmas since the dcs came along (15years). I've shopped and cooked and drove and wrapped and paid. I've juggled both my family and ILs, including 2 sets of divorced parents.

Last year I thought 'sod it' and went for Christmas Eve and Day with only my DH and dcs. My DM was alone as my dB has the handy excuse of living 'away'. My ddad was expecting to come to us, and refused an invite to an extended family member's Christmas Day plans.

Tragically my ddad died alone over Christmas, and now I just feel so shit and guilty. Like if I hadn't been so selfish maybe that wouldn't have happened? I've since lost another close relative who would usually be part of our Christmas.

I'm dreading the whole thing. I feel so bereaved still, and it's only going to feel worse in dark depressing winter.

I just want to get on a plane ( or in to the passenger seat of Temptress' car with all the wine and cheese). Unfortunately DH is likely to be on call for work. Db is making noises about us all going there to be together at this difficult time (as if it will be less difficult with all of his DPs nightmare relatives round the table getting drunk and arsey!).

I just want it all to go away. Does anyone have any helpful tips for the 'christmas bereaved'?

So sorry tober please don't blame yourself, you did nothing wrong. It's not selfish to give you a break with your own family. And sadly, guilt is part of the grieving process, whatever the circumstances.

tober, I'm sure there'll be others going through similar. Hopefully you'll get some support with going through a bereaved Christmas, especially nearer the time. x