Doesn't want sex ?

[raggycarrot]

My DH and I have been having a rough patch but I was led to believe things were getting better. He’s always been a bit lacking in sex drive but I recently found out that wasn’t true and instead he’s been looking at porn regularly and masturbating. I’ve been hurt as we live a fairly sexless marriage of 3-4 times a year.

Anyway I asked him to give up the porn and masturbation to see if he had more a sex drive or desire for me. He said he did but it’s clear he hasn’t. He’s still doing this several times a week. But It’s been about two months since he touched me.

I’m starting to wonder if he’s having an affair, or if there could be another explanation. He says he isn’t in the mood for sex and that masturbation and sex are not the same thing.

I don’t think I can live like this forever. Is it controlling of me to be asking him to stop the porn/masturbation?

He might peck me on the lips but he doesn’t even kiss me. He holds my hand but that’s about it. He says he has “intimacy” problems but although we never had huge amounts of sex, we did used to at least have some.

I’m fed up of crying about this and I don’t know what to do.

Do you think he just doesn’t fancy me anymore then Zero? That’s what I’m worried about I guess.

The truth is, I don't know. None of the posters on here do.

I recognise a lot of my relationship at one time in what you have posted and can act out the conversations you describe in my head with my DW and I as the protagonists very easily.

I just think that people can lose sight of what they love most about each other and what drew them together when life becomes a drudge about the kids and their needs, routine etc etc

The mutual sexual attraction - or lack of it - comes from how in touch with that I believe.

I needed to appreciate my DW more. More thanks for what she does, more listening to her (including the insane swim/school mum gossip which just drives me absolutely mental with it's inanity).

She needed to remember that I was fun to be with once and I was a good alternative to the practicalities of life at times.

I always fancied her, always will I think. She - less so me.

Your DH is talking to you about these things in a fairly open way I think.

I don't think that means he does not fancy you at all or that his desire will not rise to meet yours if you both feel closer emotionally is all I feel qualified to comment.

My ex used to say he fancied me but due to alcohol abuse could not get an erection. No sex for four years. Find out he watched absolutely loads of porn and masturbating to it. Of course he denied it. I couldn’t then have sex with him even if he wanted it because I think he didn’t actually want me. I went straight off him and told him so. I then left because I didn’t want a celibate life.Obviously there were other issues to leave for. I think hells bells has nailed it. You can eventually find someone who makes you feel amazing and meets your needs I certainly did!

I once read an article on porn/maturation addiction. Could it be that your husband is dealing with addiction to that rather than feeling distant from you?

Councelling is available now specifically for this type of addiction because so many people are dealing with it. I think because porn is so readily available now that even young people can access it if they want.

Perhaps do some research, see if he has the symptoms of someone with an addiction and then find a way to approach the subject with him. You may find that this is what has a grip on his libido and once he deals with it then it will rekindle his drive for you.

Addiction can cause feelings of loss of control, if he gets that back he may feel more in charge of his sex life and want to re-establish a connection with you. I hope he does OP! Everyone deserves to feel desired in their relationship and should have emotional and physical intimacy if it's what you want.

*WTAF!!!

Imagine the scenario - a MNer posts that they do not fancy DP anymore as he nags for sex. However she has enjoyed masturbation as she needed a release. She had some secret toys etc which DP found and she promised not to use anymore but she did despite the controlling bastard. Anyway, one day she came home and DP was sat in the living room wanking, enticing her to join in and saying "if you can do it, so can I ... join in love, this should be turning you on!"*

Ok zero if that was aimed at me that's not remotely what I was suggesting every simpleton and their granny would not think coming home from work with your partners legs akimbo/cock in hand on the sofa rubbing one out as a turn on.

What I was suggesting is she meets her physical needs by herself for awhile so she is not functioning on full on frustrated as that does not make the conversation easier. I also meant by asking him if he ever wants to join in that it is giving him the option and she is being honest that she is doing this. Obviously he might just feel relief and say carry on love. He can't deny he likes to watch though due to his webcam usage.

The live webcam thing would be enough to walk away for me, I think it's cheating.

I don't think he is being fully honest with you op. You are in counselling has this intimacy issue been discussed? It may be as simple as he doesn't fancy you any more but he needs to get a bit of back bone and tell you it's not fair if that's all it is. I don't mean to minimise but he is killing your self esteem whilst he wanks away happily, it's just selfish.

Ok zero if that was aimed at me that's not remotely what I was suggesting every simpleton and their granny would not think coming home from work with your partners legs akimbo/cock in hand on the sofa rubbing one out as a turn on.

Not aimed at you specifically Mustang, I promise; more the general direction of the thread at times which has questioned everything from the DH's sexuality to whether he can get it up.

I was not dismissing your suggestion at all (I had intended to agree with it by my last paragraph in the post you quote), just pointing out there needs to be a long term fix too.

Apologies if I took it too far in painting a ridiculous scenario to help make a point

I did laugh at how genuinely creepy that scenario would be.

For what it's worth iv nodded in agreement to most of your points. It's not nice to be more invested in a relationship than your partner but I also think it's normal that they go in waves and lulls.

Yep and both parties have to want it.

Do you think your partner wants to fix it op because if he doesn't no amount of any of your effort is going to change it.

I'm sorry iv been in similar position it sucks.

It seems silly to consider leaving a marriage because of this.

What - being in relationship with absolutely no sex or intimacy, where you feel like a maid/au pair? Not silly at all.

I also disagree that sex is not important - it is very important for me and crucial to a relationship. That said, if I was with a man I genuinely loved who could not have sex for some reason but was still loving and affectionate towards me, I think I'd manage. But you haven't even got that, have you?

I am sorry OP, but unless your DH wants to openly and honestly address this issue with you (and it really doesn't sound like he wants to) there is nothing you can do about it. Do you discuss this in your counselling? Sounds like the place where you should be able to talk this through?

Okay, was thinking about whether to comment on the webcam thing as it is a bit of a red flag for me too - and it attracts negative attention if I give away too much knowledge

However, as we are here to help the OP and it is her we are talking to, I will break cover.

There are two different types of webcam porn that I know of (hark at me the expert).

1. The sort where there is two way interaction and the 'performance' is private with interactions only between the performer and the single, paying viewer. This has to be paid for and is even offered as a sideline/introductory service by some escorts.

1. The sort where you can just go to a website where performers put on a free show that anyone can watch. There is no personal interaction (other than some allow you to message the performer) although the idea is that they encourage people to pay for a private show.

I would put the second as closer to 'remote strip club' than some may think as there is rarely any hardcore penetration/masturbation/toy use to be seen - although there will be nudity/titillation.

The first is likely to be of the personal interaction type most people refer to.

For me, which the DH uses is important in how 'bad' it is - depending on your view of porn/strippers of course.

It is not acceptable on MN to admit to any kind of porn use or deny that porn use leads to death grip in all cases but the reality is people do use it with no negative effect on their sex life.

Some of those same people are just using it as a visual cue to get off and a means to an end in the same way a r rabbit is when used in private or as a couple.

It does not always mean the user does not find their partner attractive or that they prefer it to sex with their partner.

I go back to my original point again. Only the OP and her DH know whether they want to work on the emotional side of their relationship, or whether they need to spice up their sex life using toys, porn etc.

Ultimately, only they will know whether his porn use is a sign he has checked out of the marriage and betrayed their relationship.

OP, I hope you and your DH do have those open conversations and look to move forward in a way which is best for you both.

I think you have to fave the possibility that he doesn't fancy you anymore. Men will stay with their wives for the kids just as women will stay with their partners for the same reason. Desire is lacking if someone does not want sex with you. He has admitted he doesn't so you need to decide it that is acceptable. If it's not then you need to find a solution however painful that may be or just accept it and do your own thing.

It does not always mean the user does not find their partner attractive or that they prefer it to sex with their partner.

The OP's DH has made it perfectly clear that he prefers porn/masturbation to sex as it does not involve intimacy; and that he does not want to have sex with the OP.

SleepFree - I don’t look very different no. In fact I was more overweight when we met than I am now... Lost some while together and yo-yo’d throughout our relationship really. I always have. I guess I am 7 years older though so who knows.

I’ve asked if he doesn’t fancy me and he denies it and says he does and that I’m “gorgeous”. Just not feeling very much like he really thinks that at the mo.

ZeroFeedback whilst I agree in some respects regards building emotional bonds, I have a question.

There has always been this old adage, or myth about the difference between the sexes. Women require an emotional bond to have sex, men have sex to build emotional bonds. Plus there is this other contradictory myth that women attach and bond with men they have sex with, whilst men don't.

There's an obvious problem with those two contradictory ideas sitting side by side.

Plus, many women now seek out NS, FwB and have ONS. Just as their male counterparts have been thought to do so since time began.

Most people when starting a relationship are inclined because of desire to have sex. Building an emotional bond takes much longer.

So, I'm not certain that seeking to build an emotional bond will necessarily lead to attraction. I was with ex for 16 years, I was as emotionally close and bonded as anyone could hope to be. But I didn't fancy him past two years. And that is something else often overlooked, women often grow bored and stop fancying men. Lack of sex drive in women is often attributed to problems in the relationship, age, menopause, children or resentment, when research has shown that it's women who like novelty as much as men.

I know it might be slightly off topic but I just want to point out that contrary to a previous post Viagra won't give a man an erection if he doesn't fancy you.

It's a common misconception that can stop couples benefitting from Viagra - woman feels like he doesn't really fancy her because he needs Viagra to get it up. Viagra needs arousal to work with. No arousal, no erection even with Viagra.

I guess I am 7 years older though so who knows.

So is he and, unless he is a complete prick, he knows this is immaterial.

I’ve asked if he doesn’t fancy me and he denies it and says he does and that I’m “gorgeous”. Just not feeling very much like he really thinks that at the mo.

I would hope you could give him the benefit of the doubt on that - at least for now.

Give him the opportunity to prove that he cares, one way or the other. It really sounds to me like you both need to reconnect emotionally and the rest should follow.

Cannot overstate how big a fan of 'date night' I am, but don't make it all about the effort you make - he has to want it too.

There has always been this old adage, or myth about the difference between the sexes. Women require an emotional bond to have sex, men have sex to build emotional bonds. Plus there is this other contradictory myth that women attach and bond with men they have sex with, whilst men don't.

Spot on Mini - they are contradictory and generalise.

Plus, many women now seek out NS, FwB and have ONS. Just as their male counterparts have been thought to do so since time began.

Agree 100% ...

Most people when starting a relationship are inclined because of desire to have sex.

Two of my female housemates at Uni put me to shame on a regular basis with how much better at the 'laddish' attitude to sex they were than me.

Building an emotional bond takes much longer.

Yes

So, I'm not certain that seeking to build an emotional bond will necessarily lead to attraction.

As the 'funny one' one the friend zone who was often a best mate and shoulder to cry on I know this only too well.

I was with ex for 16 years, I was as emotionally close and bonded as anyone could hope to be. But I didn't fancy him past two years.

And that is something else often overlooked, women often grow bored and stop fancying men. Lack of sex drive in women is often attributed to problems in the relationship, age, menopause, children or resentment, when research has shown that it's women who like novelty as much as men.

Absolutely and it may be that the DH just does not fancy her any more (don't get me started about what I fear a certain period in our relationship meant for my DW's need for novelty)

Just want to avoid the generalisation that the only reason men go off sex is because they are looking or getting it elsewhere. It can be for emotional reasons too.

That's why it may be he needs to be reminded of his fun, sexy, exciting girlfriend from x years ago and not associate the OP with the housework, conflict and drudge.

That is why I am encouraging her to see if having time together as boyfriend/girlfriend reminds him of that.

If it does, to me that is worth investing in.

If not, they may be better apart. Not knowing will be shit for both of them.

Honestly, I have been here in my first marriage. I tried everything. Counselling, changing myself, I stopped asking for sex and tried to restore the intimacy. It just destroyed my self esteem in the end. I ended my marriage because, for me, sex is hugely important and a way of connecting to my partner. I could live without it for someone I loved as long as I didn’t feel that sexual energy was directed elsewhere. My ex was addicted to porn and had no desire to change.

I am now happily remarried to someone with a compatible sex drive, which I think is one of the key issues in what ended my last relationship. For some people sex is fun and nice but they could do without it. Other people see it as essential to their relationship and this difference can cause so much sadness on both sides because to some extent, the other just doesn’t get how one can want it all the time and their partner can take or leave it etc

From what I've read about relationships and sex, because you two aren't close, it feel easier and better if he pleasures himself. You haven't got enough intimacy between you to want to make each other pleasured.

@raggycarrot

Read what Dr Gottmans says about porn:

www.gottman.com/blog/x-is-for-x-rated/

@raggycarrot This is good from Gottman. Go google him.

www.gottman.com/blog/askgottman-sex-answers/

To some men it's just a biological function.
I suspect that he looks at it like going to the toilet but instead of emptying his rectum or bladder, he's emptying his balls. 'Going for a number 3' they call it.
I think this is why men can go off sex but still masturbate to porn.

It is very unlikely, that this level of dismissive selfishness is confined to just this area of your relationship. He knows how you feel, he’s always got an excuse and is unwilling to change.

The balls in your court, either accept that he doesn’t want to sleep with you or communicate it’s a dealbreaker for you and if he makes no attempt in engaging to restore your sex life, your marriage is over. Waiting for the person who benefits most from the status quo to change it, is futile.

What does "intimacy issues" even mean? It's just a soundbite phrase that means nothing. Personally sex is important to me and I wouldn't stay in a relationship that became sexless while the other person treated it as unimportant.

Seriously kimmy? you’d thought you’d join mumsnet and bump up a fairly oldish thread just to tell us you like 50 shades of crap film and think that’s the answer to not getting any from your husband?

He says he has “intimacy” problems

IMO this is the problem.

He’s aware he has intimacy problems and he’s aware that his intimacy problems are making you miserable.

Either he is happy for this situation to continue or he is scared to unpick it.

Either way, you don’t have to be held captive by his problems. If he chooses not to sort out his problems then you should choose to leave him IMO.