Anyone else feel like an outsider?

[Crazymama]

Ever since my Ds started nursery I have tried really hard to speak to the other mums and be friendly, but No-one ever seems to want to take the time to speak to me. i always say hello to other mums when passing them in the playground. There is one mum in particular looks at the ground or away when I pass her just so she does not have to say hello!!

People obviously dont perceive me as someone that they can chat to. I never know what to say, find conversation ackward and quite often say something downright stupid, through lousy attempts to chat to people.

I do see a one or two people out of school, but its always me that has to initiate the plans.

Some days I feel like everyone else knows each other, and they all conspire to ignore me for some reason! My DS rarely gets invited to parties. I know that alot of the mums from school socialise together.

I feel like I want to move away from here because I feel like such an outsider! Its crazy because DS is settled in nursery and will soon start the school which is excellent.

Does anyone else feel like an outsider in their neighbourhood? Does anyone have any tips on how to chat to people, and how I can make real friends rather than just people that I can say hello to!

Reading the above, I feel I have gone mad, and maybe I have. Please tell me someone else feels that same...

Oh Crazymama, that sounds rotten. How long has your DS been in the nursery?

It can be difficult to make conversation - on both sides. Just keep saying "hello" and being friendly, and hopefully someone will respond pleasantly.

If a lot of the mums have older children in the school, they may have known each other for quite a while, so don't feel an outsider.

If DS is happy, he must have little friends at nursery? Why not invite a few of them - and their mums - for tea one afternoon?

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Is your DS in the same nursery as mine?
Rather than say hello to everyone are there some Mums that you find more friendly than others?
Or maybe another Mum on their own?
Concentrate on trying to develop a friendship with them rather than trying to be 'friends' with everyone.
At our ursery everyone already seeemed to know each other, same at DS1's school.
I don't worry about it as I have friends at work/ home so don't need to worry about making friends.
Hope this helps and you are not alone, I think most women don't go anywhere new UNLess they already know someone else there!
And some people are just bloody rude!
There is a woman at nursery who ignores me when I say hello so always make a point of saying hello loudly at her to show her how rude she is!

Thanks guys.

Seeing it all written down, it dosnt seem so bad. Not bad enough to move house anyway.
DS started last Jan, but Im not there every day cause I work.

I think I will invite some of his friends round. What do you think would be a good number?

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I have this problem - especially as we are with the forces so move around at least every 2 years and that's not long enough to find/establish/nurture new friendships.
I'm confident once I know somebody and they abecome a friend but small talk and chit chat is awful if you're shy.
Couldn't you ask the preschool leaders who is your DS good friends with and then pop a note into the pigeon hole of their parents inviting them around to play on a specific day and then they'll have to reply (good if you don't always pick up at same time). Put your number on it and if they'll either say yes or make an excuse.
If not, just casually start chatting to other mums and ask them questions about themselves (people like to talk about themselves) and then hopefully you could make more friends. Or pop along to a mother/toddler group which does something (art/singing etc so you're actually doing something with your child and don't have to make conversation all the time and won't feel awkward).

no more than 2/3. Depends how old your DS is but if he hasn't had friends over before, it can be daunting to have to share all of his toys with others to start with. Are you inviting mums too? If yes - then it's easier to get to know a couple well rather than many not so well.

Maybe 2 or 3, crazymama? A nice small manageable number.

luciemama, I actually find the military thing helps as there is invariably at least one other military mum there, so you have a joint frame of reference ( or something to moan about! )

Crazymama, I am one of those really irritating people who will chat to anyone, and when I started going to toddlers with DS, there was a woman who was really standoffish with me... I thought she didn't like me, but another friend said she is just very shy. Shyness can easily be mistaken for something else, maybe some of these mums are just too shy to come and say hello!

Just keep being your nice self

sorry luciemule

I have just moved adn I am having a really horrible time. I have been to the local toddler groups and tried to chat but I never know what to say - it always seems quite clichy and the last one I went to I sat for a bit after trying to talk to a few people and left in tears so I can't go back there!

I am not good at small talk and I am quite direct so before in London I had lots of friends once they knew what I was like. Now I feel like I can't make friends round here. I am new to mumsnet and told it was helpful and friendly but put my foot in it too.

are there any other sites like this as I need a fresh start where people won't mind if I am rude.

Thanks, yes your right people do like to talk about themselves!

What could I ask them ... without sounding too abtusive? (is that a word)

All the cliche stuff like holidays, weather I have probably tried at some point.

Interesting point about who Ds friends are. I would tend to focus on mums who I know by name and child and avoid the ones I dont!

Just stick it out here FairyEdwards, it'll be fine. Most of us have put our foot in it mroe than once

When my DS started at nursery it was all very, very cliquey. I remember saying hello to a mum, actually calling her by her name as we walked towards each other and she just ignored me. Yes, it takes time, and now I always make an effort to say hello to everyone. In fact I made a really big effort, always smiling and being nice. And they could be bloody hard work.

Some people are away with the fairies, others are too busy, some aren't interested, others have crap social skills, but don't give up. Be nice, say hello, smile a big smile. They might be shy rather than offish. It might all be quite new to them too.

I invite one child at a time to lunch and invite the mum too the first time (mine do mornings only at nursery). At tea time the kids come for a play after school, then tea, but I always say to the mum come a bit earlier for a cuppa.

I think it must make a difference for working parents who have to drop off and run. I'm lucky I can stand around gassing. If you have to head off quickly try getting there 5 mins early so you have time to say Good morning and the kids can run around together. We all have a common bond because we are all there for the same reason, so there's no excuse for them!

It is crap though. And its them, not you

Hi FairyE. Sorry to hear you're having a horrible time. I moved out of London about five years and I can honestly say it took a year or two to make any proper friends. It takes time and it can be lonely in the meantime.

Hi CM
School-gate mums can seem a cliquey bunch and often don't have the good grace to include a relative newcomer. If your son is happy and settled I would say be patient. Look as though you are a happy, confident person, keep smiling and saying hello. Little tricks like asking someone how their child is if they've been ill, or complimenting someone on a new hairdo etc can often open the door. Also, don't just go on how people are first thing in the morning - I know when I've got mine out to school with everything they need all I feel like doing is going back to bed, not making friends! It's definitely a good plan to identify a child your son gets on well with and invite them to play. Then you can have a cuppa and a chat with the mum when he gets picked up and slowly you'll start to feel more part of the group.

Loads of people feel like this, please hang in there!

yes very

opps...

very lonely - people always take me the wrong way anyway - before people just were used to me and it was just me. Can't see it being like that again now. Am quite sad - hate it as usually I am an outgoing no nonsense type - don't recognise myself at the momnet.

I think it is much harder for women to make new friends.
It is always difficult to go from the chatting in the yard/playgroup to becoming real friends, and can take a long time.
Sometimes you have to jump in and make the first move.Ususally the other person is just as lonely as you are.

sorry fairyedwards, crossed posts. Is the organiser of the toddler group nice? Could you ask her to introduce you to some people? Or help with the drinks (if they have them)? If you can get involved in some why that might help.

These posts make me sad. I've been at the same toddler group for years, and these always remind me to talk to everyone. We should all be making the effort to make newcomers feel welcome. Bet there's not one of us who hasn't been through it.

FairyEdwards, it's not as bad as you think, honest. You should have seen the almighty fight that broke out on Weaning yesterday, and that was between seasoned posters! Stay and play with us, we are nice really .

I don't know if you (FE) or CrazyMama have read about the Mile for Maude we are doing in May... it's a massive sponsored walk all over the country, with toddlers and kids included. Lots and lots of MNers are doing it; why don't you come and join in your nearest one? It's in a fantastic cause, you'll have a good time and meet some nice people. Well, sort of nice.Here's the original thread .

Littleeasterlapin I see what you mean but all the wives here (except a couple) are military so we're all coming and going! Yes - it is nice to have people who know about the system though, but it's sad when friendships come to an end (obviously I don't mean very good friends who you'd keep on visiting when posted).

Fairy I don't know where you are and it might be a bit early to suggest this but I can highly recommend Mumsnet meet ups in your area. I have had only positive experiences from them so far.

Right about women finding it harder to make new friends.
It's hard not to be able to chat about stuff you would do with your best friends too. There's only so much you can chat about to strangers at toddler club other than nappies/baby development etc. There always seems to be a long gap before you start to properly chat about life and more interesting stuff.

luciemule - oh I see . We're in Portsmouth, so there are quite a large number of "civvies", it's not just Navy mums .

FE and CM, foxybrown's idea of helping with the drinks etc is a good one. Also help clear up afterwards! God, if you came to our group and helped clear up, I'd practically snog you, let alone want to be nice!