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Original poster

Money - help me find the words to explain to my husband what is fair

73 replies

Caravan21 · 20/06/2017 10:03

We both used to earn £45k. After two kids I took a lower paid job and earn £27k.
Every time I try to formulate an argument as to why I should pay less into the joint account it ends up in a huge row. I think we should both have the same amount of 'pocket money' (for want of a better word) and so he should pay the higher proportion.
Each time we argue he says 'well we've never done that before, it was your choice to go into a lower paid role'. I can't get him to see that money is family money. We are going around in circles.
Please give me the words. We don't have a good marriage, but that's another story. I just don't seem to be able to reason with him.

OP posts:
Original poster
Caravan21 · 20/06/2017 11:26

We both travelled with work and it was unmanageable with children. I wanted part time but couldn't get a suitable job. So, I went for a flexible full time role.
I see the bigger picture of what's best for our children. If I had my old job they would be in breakfast club at 7am and childcare to 6pm. They are happier and life is less frantic.

OP posts:
CadnoDrwg · 20/06/2017 11:45

We had the opposite problem with my husband. I've earned steadily the same (with some below inflation pay increases) for most of our relationship.

We also split everything 50/50 even when I was on mat leave. No joint accounts, just him paying his share every month to me and I sort out the bills.

When we first got together his earnings were double mine, I didn't care that he had more money than me. However thanks to a redundancy and taking a lesser paid job situation the tables are turned.

I earn substantially more than my husband but he wants to pay half of everything.

I've finally made him understand it's not the financial contribution that makes us equal in the family but the fact that we both pull our weight. We both work, we both do things for the girls, we both do housework.

Your husband needs to come to the same realisation but from a different perspective.

MorrisZapp · 20/06/2017 12:04

I totally get why you chose the new job, but was he on board with all of that? What did he say at the time?

Original poster
Caravan21 · 20/06/2017 12:15

Yes, we discussed it and it was agreed. But as I said, things changed so I'm now full time on less money.
We both work full time, we both are parents and a family, we are equals in this relationship I thought.
Life changes in ways you can't predict after kids. I simply couldn't do that job. I don't think that's the point though.
I said today to him that if I was unable to work through illness would I just have no money????
Or if won £100k on a scratch card should I keep it advice my money?

OP posts:
Original poster
Caravan21 · 20/06/2017 12:16

Sorry last sentace should read 'should I keep it as MY money'

OP posts:
confuugled1 · 20/06/2017 12:17

'But before, we didn't have children. When people have children - TOGETHER - things have to change, they can't both carry on like they did before. It wasn't possible to stay at my old job, earning the same amount, and do all that is needed for the children and the family. It was a joint decision that I should be the one to take a different role that provides flexibility and enables BOTH of us to ensure the best for the dc. The trade off is that I am in a role that doesn't pay as much in order to do the best for the dc and that means the best for you too. If I went back to work at my old job (hypothetically as there's no guarantee it is still available) then although we would have some more money, we would also have much higher childcare costs, there would be a lot more stress for both of us in juggling school/nursery drop offs and pick ups, [insert everything else here].

I thought we were in a partnership. It's not all about the money, it's about time and love and stress and working things out together, for the best of the family. It's not about you being selfish and keeping everything for yourself.

Original poster
Caravan21 · 20/06/2017 12:20

Thank you confuggled. Xx

OP posts:
Spindelina · 20/06/2017 12:25

He's assuming you should contribute the same as him financially.

Which is fine, if you can assume that he will contribute to the household in a the other ways - childcare (including sick days etc), housework, organising stuff - the mental load.

Does he share that equally? If not: that's why you have taken a lower stress job.

Emboo19 · 20/06/2017 12:29

I'd tell him fair enough, you'll pay in the same amount and then give him a timetable of days he has to take and collect the children/do after school activities etc, if he's not already doing 50% of the house work add that on too. Then tell him, if he can't manage his share he can outsource if from his own money, so school club/nanny cleaner/cook.

Shakey15000 · 20/06/2017 12:32

Quite right to consider what the scenario would be if one of you was unable to work due to illness. What's his answer to that one?

My DH developed a chronic illness leaving him unable to work, can happen to anyone, at any time.

FWIW your DH is being a dick. I'd also be putting in a fair share and leave him to stew/do whatever.

Wordsmith · 20/06/2017 12:36

It sounds like you have a few more problems than just money.

I can't understand why parents don't pool all of their money in a joint account - apart from making things a lot easier to manage (no moving money around from one account to another) it reinforces the fact that you are a family and you both contribute financially and in other ways to the success and well-being of your family unit.

I've been married for over 25 years and we had a joint account before then - we always used to have separate accounts plus a joint one for expenses but we were always overdrawing on the joint account so we just thought 'sod it'. It hasn't made any difference to the balance of power in our relationship.

I've been self employed for years and earn more than my DH so I put more into the joint account. Obviously I have separate accounts for my business but a regular sum goes into the joint account each month. I put more in when we need to pay for a holiday or big expense etc.

I'm amazed that dividends aren't taken into account when it comes to maintenance! Most people running a business will take the majority of their income as a dividend as it's the most tax-efficient way to do it. Your actual salary or wages will be just below the income tax threshold. I know dividend tax etc is changing but it will still be the most tax-efficient way to do it. I really thought business owners' total income was assessed for things like maintenance?

JellyBabiesSaveLives · 20/06/2017 12:45

If I had my old job they would be in breakfast club at 7am and childcare to 6pm. They are happier and life is less frantic.
So, you're nannying in the morning and evening. What are you charging for that? Obviously a high rate because they're getting a very personal service. And he needs to be paying you half.

Who stays off work when they're sick, takes time off for sports days etc, makes themselves available during the school day when the children need you? Is that shared equally? Because if not, you, the nanny, are "on call" during the school day and need to charge for that too. And then there's school holidays.

So, housework and "wifework". Equally shared? If not, charge him. Again, personal service = high rates.

Charging him for all this is not really the solution at all. But writing it out may help him to understand. Also, ask him to decide now, how he wants you to handle it should he ever be sick and unable to work full-time. Do you still get spending money while he accrues a debt to you?

RandomMess · 20/06/2017 12:53

I think your best angle is that you are saving £x in childcare because the DC don't need before and after school care, nor do they need paid for care because you no longer travel for work - would you have had to have a nanny had you stayed in your previous role?

Also you do £x in housework/house chores over and above him.

His attitude stinks quite frankly.

Adora10 · 20/06/2017 12:59

What a truly horrible partner, expecting you to pay in the same as him when he earns nearly 20K a year more; sorry but you say you won't leave, that's probably why he has no problem being a dick.

FledglingFTB · 20/06/2017 13:05

Sounds like a complex situation. But to solely tackle your initial Q, can you work in %?

What % of his wage does he put in every month, and if you were to do the same would that leave you in a fairer position than you are now?

This may not work if he puts in a high % but I find that from a mathematical standpoint it'd be hard for him to argue with.

Mesmerised · 20/06/2017 13:24

Oh my god OP. How can you live with a man with this mentality? Shock

I wouldn't even get into pro-rata discussions based on who earns what.

You are married. You have children. There is no such thing as "his" and "yours".

If he can't grasp that, I'm not sure how you can move forward.

I haven't worked for 10 years. DH earns all our money and it's in the bank for everyone. It's would never occur to him to think otherwise.

Your DH sounds on a different planet to other men with families. How can he not realise this?

AshGirl · 20/06/2017 13:28

I have earned double what my DH earns, and I now earn effectively nothing (on ML). Our wages would get paid into the joint account and we then have equal amounts of personal 'spends' which we are free to spend as we wish. Big payments out of the joint account are discussed and agreed.

The way we think about it is that we are a team and the money is family money. If DH takes shared parental leave and I go back to work then we will both still have the same level of spends as that is what is fair.

Should add that the amount of spends has decreased as we have less money coming in now I am on ML, but we still have equal (though lesser) amounts each.

You have sacrificed your earning power for the benefit of the family as a whole. I think his attitude is disgraceful TBH. Wishing you all the best as it sounds like you are going through a difficult time Flowers

whattodowiththepoo · 20/06/2017 13:36

You have decided "it's family money" so you deserve more of his, he didn't agree to this.
The only way it is really going to be family money is if you get a divorce, he isn't abusive he is carrying on with what worked for you both before.
The only difference is it now doesn't work for you.

Original poster
Caravan21 · 20/06/2017 13:46

He's built his business from scratch since we've been together with my support. I have had weeks of being on my own with the children. We have both made sacrifices in the past. The present is now different, life has changed.
I thought adults made decisions as to what was right at the time, not just what had gone before.
I'll talk to him again tonight. Everything just looks shit from where I'm standing.

OP posts:
Adora10 · 20/06/2017 13:49

You are so right OP, you don't actually have to be a mathematician, just a nice kind human being that can see the difference in the earnings! He's treating you appallingly, I am not married, no kids, we live together and all our money goes into one joint account, I've never once felt unequal regardless of him earning double what I do.

You are a family yet he's treating you like a flat mate, awful.

WipsGlitter · 20/06/2017 13:51

Have you sat down together with a bit of paper and actually showed him the sums? E.g.:

DH earns £600 puts £400 in the joint leaves £200

You earn £500 put £400 in the joint leaves £100

What do you both do with your spare? Does he buy more kids stuff / holiday / outings or us all that from joint?

Having said that DH and I have totally separate finances!

Adora10 · 20/06/2017 13:55

We don't have a good marriage

So why are you so insistent on staying put?

Original poster
Caravan21 · 20/06/2017 13:57

All holidays etc from joint account. We have some joint savings. He has his own savings account.

The joint savings are dwindling as we are dipping in for holidays etc. House needs work but there's no joint money to do it. Yet, he has money to save in his own account.
I'm not asking for more money to buy handbags!!! I'm asking for more money into the house and to benefit the kids.

OP posts:
Original poster
Caravan21 · 20/06/2017 13:58

There are circumstances I don't want to go into but I don't want to leave. Plus, I love him.

OP posts:
AttilaTheMeerkat · 20/06/2017 14:20

I think as well you have made far more sacrifices than he has and he has reaped the rewards of your support and efforts.

The joint savings are dwindling as we are dipping in for holidays etc. House needs work but there's no joint money to do it. Yet, he has money to save in his own account.
I'm not asking for more money to buy handbags!!! I'm asking for more money into the house and to benefit the kids.

The above comment of yours is really financial abuse; he is actively minimising your financial independence. Your children and you are going without whilst he has money sitting in his account. He regards his earnings as his and his alone.

I would also think you are confusing love with co-dependency. You are still putting his needs above yours and in turn your childrens. Is this what you want for them going forward as well, for them to behave as your H is now doing towards their own partners?. You're teaching them that currently at least, this treatment of you is acceptable to you.