20 years and he thinks it is over. Please help

[LilyLavender]

I'm a first time poster, so please be gentle. Sorry for a longish post. I know others are/have been going through this same issue and many of you have heard all this before but a month ago my DH told me that he hasn't been happy for ages and that he thinks we're over. We're still living in the same house and we've done a lot of talking in the last month but I really don't think it is doing us any good.
The situation is complicated by the fact he's been very sick for a few months, although after lots of tests that have all come back negative it looks as though all of his physical symptoms have been caused by stress. The stress has been caused by several factors (eg, work) but also (mainly perhaps) by keeping quiet about how he really feels about us. His mental health took a nosedive once he came clean to me. A full breakdown. He's been suicidal several times too.
I've gone from thinking he could be seriously ill, to him wanting to leave me, and to him wanting to die.
He says our relationship has been bad for ages. Looking back I can understand what he's saying, although I would have said there have been bad situations and normal life pressures that have got in our way and that I thought that our connection and our love for each other were still really good. He seems to blame me for not noticing how unhappy he was but I can't believe he could see issues between us and not talk to me about them. Anyway, now we're stuck because he won't address any of our relationship issues until he has improved his own mental health. This seems reasonable except in the meantime I have to put up and shut up while the executioner stands behind me all the time. I feel totally trapped because he says there isn't a single thing I can do to put things right at the moment so the only options I have are to either keep swallowing my words and trying to smile and hope he gets better and that we can sort it out or I ask him to leave while he is mentally ill and suicidal.
During our discussions about what has gone wrong some really, really painful things have come to the surface but they can't be dealt with due to his state and I feel like I'm slowly dying inside.
We don't have any DC (this is one of our issues but at least there are no little ones going through this with us right now).
He swears there is no OW but by having read other threads I think lots of you will say there's always an OW...I am pretty sure there isn't anyone at the moment and there has been so much brutal honesty between us I think it would have come out by now. That said, he does spend most evenings chatting on FB and being quite defensive about it, so I guess something's a bit fishy.
I feel like I have already gone through the five stages of grief and that I've reached 'acceptance'. Somehow this thought seems to give me comfort but I know I'm still trapped in a pretty hopeless and toxic situation.
Any advice?

Apart from blaming you, what exactly is he doing to improve his MH?

Right now it's all about him and your needs are invisible, he's using his MH issues to hold you to ransom and essentially put you on hold.

He either seeks help for his MH issues or he goes, you can not sacrifice your MH for anybody.

He's got some CBT starting next week and he has started trying to resume a a normal life and getting back into a routine but he is still unhappy with everything in his life. He doesn't seem to want to fight the negative thoughts he has. I hope the CBT helps him.
I miss who he was and the life we had but I'm seeing now that the good days were a long time ago and that life, the life I miss, is gone.
You all sound so strong and clear-thinking. Thank you :)

It sounds like he wants out but also wants the benefits of staying with you, i.e. The money and somewhere to live.
It doesn't sound like he has another woman yet but I wouldn't be surprised if a miraculous recovery happens when he finds one.
So it sounds like bad enough to leave, just not ready yet, in the mean time ensure that you don't demand anything from him emotionally, when he does find OW then he will feel like it was 'over anyway'.
At this point like you say I think it's gone far enough that you will always feel like it's around the corner, ready to end things. It sounds over except in practical terms.

He sounds very confused and feeling unable to deal with his emotions. Definitely a hint throughout your post of him at least talking to an OW.
You need to insist on a separation for both your sakes.

My ex was off secretly seeing other women, but at the same time he didn't want to break up our relationship. The idea of such a big change after 20+ years, and a change that would be his "fault", was very stressful for him. He even told the last OW that maybe he and I could live together "like brother and sister" while they stayed a couple. (Like an incestuous brother and sister, I guess, though she didn't know that!)

A couple of times I tried giving him an easy way out, asking him nicely if he wanted to break up with me (I didn't know about OWs and felt sorry for him because he was depressed and overworked) and saying that though I didn't want it, I'd accept his decision. You could see him struggling to make a decision, but he still said no, he didn't want to break up with me. But he didn't say that he wanted to stay with me, either, I realise with hindsight. His problem really was that he didn't want to do the breaking up. Plus he hates change and doesn't even like choosing a meal: he's a bad decision-maker. It took me snooping on his emails to resolve the matter!

My ex's mother had died months before, and that was why I had to be extra nice to him in our case. Your husband is using his dodgy mental health as protection. Maybe not in a deliberate, calculated way, but it's just easier for him if you "can't" treat him like a fully functioning, responsible adult.

Maybe it would be easier for you, too, if you could step out of the supposed responsibility for his potential suicide by developing your own mental health problem. Frankly, with the stress he is loading so generously onto you, it wouldn't be surprising if you became unstable yourself!

More likely you are just going to have to take on the role of the baddy, that he is so unwilling to take on himself. But it's not a choice between smiling and pretending, and angrily throwing him out of the house and potentially provoking suicide. There are ways in between. If you have arranged medical help, informed his family and made sure others are supporting him, and express deep regret as you arrange for one of you to leave, for instance, that already makes things a bit different.

If there is an OW then I think it is mostly online at the moment because he isn't out enough to see someone else. But I'm not ruling it out because of the amount of time he spends online and on his phone chatting. He's also more protective of his phone these days. All big red flags, I know.
My previous partner cheated on me and I didn't notice until the end. It turned me into a detective ninja to get to the truth. I hated feeling like that at the time and I'm trying to not be paranoid this time. I was right with the ex but it turned out to be even worse than I'd imagined. I even found out he'd been with two of my good friends (very ex friends now) as well as women he'd met at work or in the pub.

The less time you spend in this situation the better, though, as it wears away at your mental health. Mine also made me feel like I was the worst bitch in the world and lucky he had put up with me. I had ten months of that torture before finding out what a shit he had been.

It turned me into a detective ninja to get to the truth
I went through that recently.
Found out so much.
If poor OW knew what I know she wouldn't touch him with a barge-pole!
But I shall leave her to find out all the nasty stuff for herself (mwahahahaha).

There are lots of things you say pointing towards an emotional affair.
Be paranoid. It's not sounding good.

Ravenmum, I see some similarities because I have offered him easy ways out and he's thought about it and said no. I think I've been jolly nice actually even when all I've wanted to do is rip him limb from limb!
He doesn't know what he wants but is scared of separation in case I move on and he then wants me back. That's a risk he is not prepared to take.
Only one of my friends has suggested fighting for him, everyone else says the same as I'm hearing here: it's time to separate.

HellsBells, how did you find the truth?

Things to say...

"It's bad enough one of us being suicidal: if we both have a breakdown who knows how this could end?"
"I know you want to leave, but don't want to hurt me by saying it so bluntly. That's kind of you but perhaps we just need to accept it isn't working."

He doesn't know what he wants but is scared of separation in case I move on and he then wants me back. That's a risk he is not prepared to take.
OH yes, that rings a bell, though my ex didn't say it to me. He just told his OW that he was scared of ending up alone. Apparently it is the one thing he has always been the most terrified of in his life. Poor lamb.

See Lily he sounds like he's holding you back until he decides what he wants?? Not really fair that!

I found out via H's mobile phone records. I knew then and I didn't snoop anymore. That was all I needed to see.

It's not actually a compliment, you know, to say that he wants to keep you as a back-up plan in case he can't find someone better.

It sounds like you need to have a conversation that is much more "I".
"I cant live in this situation", "I am not happy".
He may be going through issues, he may be doing and feeling all kinds of things but YOU are also a person in this relationship and if youre not happy then its almost irrelevant how HE is feeling right now.

That is true, Stormtreader. When someone is making it all about them it is so easy to forget that.

What help is he getting for his MH? If he isn't seeing a GP, on meds or seeing a therapist then it should be non negoiatable that he does that.

If he is severely depressed then he needs to get help - but only he can do that. Remember the mantra "You did not cause it, you can't control it, you cannot cure it". Whatever he is up to the best thing you can do - for both of you, is to look to your own needs and self care - be your own best friend and try to emotionally detach from his problems - they will suck up all your energy and you could then be at risk of depression yourself.

If you want to look into the depression angle more the I found the books by Anne Sheffield useful and the general discussion boards and archives on the depressionfallout website.

I disagree with some others that he is not depressed if he can spend all evening on facebook or maybe have some OW in the pipeline. I have known people on the verge of psychotic breakdowns who were holding down jobs, going out to new meetups and socialising and having affairs. Yes, some people retreat into bed but for others they need distraction from their empty state and the fragmentation of their mind.

He starts CBT next week and is seeing the GP as well. He's trying to be functional rather than just lying in bed and trying to behave normally but he just bursts into tears when he is out of the house.
I'm trying to put myself first and to be strong. I'm also preparing for the worst now and finding out things I need to know. The only thing I'm holding back on is seeing a lawyer. I'm probably being very naïve but I'm hoping we can avoid lawyers and be civilised about it all.
I'm still really struggling to work out how we got here. I just didn't see it coming at all. It is so sad to know it seems to be quite common and that so many of you have gone through similar. How? Why? Surely they're not all the same?

I knew something was up. Stomach churning, couldn't eat.
He of course had 'nothing to hide' so I had full access to phone and ipad.
Checked his ipad and found a startling browsing history.
Checked his facebook messenger and he'd been trying it on with all sorts.
Then one woman bit and I watched it all play out on the ipad.
Saw all the messages - pictures etc.....
Lovely.

He was on his phone more, so on Xmas day I grabbed it from him and checked his texts.
He'd sent one to a woman under 'V' that said we were finishing soon and could they meet up for a drink. News to me!!!
After that I had my radar up.
He had a night out in January and came back steaming drunk.
I knew he had to be up for his kids in the morning and I couldn't wake him and had to leave.
So I accessed his phone to put an alarm on (trying to be nice).
Text message open and some other woman had sent him pictures of her 'pussy' - lovely discovery!!!
It all just escalated from there really.

He is a slimey, purvey, low life, lying, cheating, scumbag.

It's like he was leading a double life I knew nothing about.

hellsbells so sorry you went through that. How utterly awful. I am shocked.
I don't know any of his passwords so that would likely be my only chance...to just grab the phone. He'd probably never forgive me so I'd have to be really sure before I did it. I have my eyes and ears wide open now though, all the time!

Oh god hellsbells! Yuk! X

I remembered he borrowed my old laptop so I just checked the browsing history. He'd been looking at mortgage calculators. Hmmm!

so sorry HellsBells thats truly shit! I honesty think a fair old chunk of blokes just love a bit of secretive excitement even if they still love you and they risk it all!! Guess its why way more men are gamblers than women as well.

It is truly shit.
But I've been through far far worse.
I vowed no man would ever make me feel like my ExH did so it's not been too bad this time.
I had one very down day but I'm over it now tbh.
You do harden yourself once you've been through hell once.

A mortgage calculator.
That's strange.
What is your current living situation?
Be on your guard.
Look at what you can.
Sorry you are going through this.

Surely its irrelevant how or why he wants to leave?

He's said it's over, so you need to start protecting yourself. See a solicitor, get your legal rights in mind, split as amicably as you can (or not, seeing as there are no DC.)