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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Original poster

Is this wrong?

47 replies

ijustdontknowanymore · 18/03/2017 03:07

Looking for objective opinions, and will try to keep this as neutral as possible. I have name changed for obvious reasons.

At the age of 15 a girl goes to a nightclub as part of a group of four, including her best friend, her future brother in law (age 23) and her future brother in law's best friend. The girl's sister is away but aware of where her sister/partner are and their plans.

The night is fun, too much (not much by an adult's standards) is drunk and the girl's best friend (who is 16) decides to go home with the friend of the future brother in law. The girl is left with the future brother in law and they go back to his house because it's close by. She falls asleep in his bed and awakes to find he has taken her jeans and underwear off and is 'going down' on her. She starts to cry he trys to kiss her to make her be quiet, while trying to force his penis into her (she is a virgin). It only half works and she is distressed and almost hysterical at this point. He stops and they fall asleep in the same bed.

In the morning he drives her home, coaching her on what to say to her sister. He says no one will believe her if she tells the truth, and everyone including her sister, will hate her for lying.

Whose fault was this?

OP posts:

thumpingrug · 18/03/2017 03:12

Its wrong in every way. This is rape, and the only person at fault here is the future brother in law. She should tell the sister and the police.

Normandy · 18/03/2017 03:18

Thumpingrug, I think you mean it's the fault of the future BIL's friend. Future BIL did not commit the offence.

It is the perpetrators fault.

RiverdaleJughead · 18/03/2017 03:20

That is rape 100% on his half. Going out or going home with a family member ( BIL is a family member) is not an invite for sexual activity. being too drunk is not an invite for sexual activity ( especially when he can legally drink and she is underage and should not have been sold it at all) . falling asleep is not an invite for sexual activity. This man is a rapist - both statutory and otherwise.

RiverdaleJughead · 18/03/2017 03:21

or going home with the friend of BIL ( sorry, misread) but either way performing oral sex on an unconcious 15/16 year old girl is rape.

Ledkr · 18/03/2017 03:24

Yes it's wrong. He's also very wrong about what will happen.
She should contact her nearest tape crisis line who will help her immediately.
Mumsnetters will find the number of the girl needs it.
Is the girl ok?

highinthesky · 18/03/2017 03:25

Did this happen to you, OP?

Because deep down you know it is rape.

thumpingrug · 18/03/2017 03:33

I have re-read this several times and it seems to me that the perpetrator is the future BIL and the victim is the 15 year old.

Original poster

ijustdontknowanymore · 18/03/2017 03:38

it is the BIL and the 15 year old in the final scenario.

OP posts:

TheGoalIsToStayOutOfTheHole · 18/03/2017 03:54

Rape. BIL is completely at fault and is a disgusting pervert. 15 YO did absolutely nothing wrong in this.

It actually sounds a bit like this may have been planned. BIL takes underage girl our drinking then she ends up at his house and he takes advantage of a tipsy/drunk underage girl who was asleep.

If 15YO feels able to/ready she should report this man to the police.

Normandy · 18/03/2017 03:59

Ah, my misunderstanding OP.

Then then future BIL committed sexual assault and rape.

EmeraldScorn · 18/03/2017 06:30

Why is a 23 year old adult taking a 15 year old child to a nightclub, supplying her with alcohol and then taking her back to his house?

Obviously it was rape but I'm wondering why she was allowed to be in his company in an adult environment in the first place - Where are her parents?

The poor girl, she is not at fault in any way and most definitely has not done anything wrong.

Cricrichan · 18/03/2017 06:40

Rape and sounds premeditated.

SleepingTiger · 18/03/2017 06:46

Future BIL

SallyGinnamon · 18/03/2017 07:05

Yes. It's definitely wrong.

Rape or attempted rape by I hope NOT soon to be BIL. I hope the Dsis won't be marrying him.

I also wonder why an adult is taking a 15 year old to a club. It's different if a 15 year old sneaks in vs being taken by an adult.

Bluntness100 · 18/03/2017 07:12

What do you mean whose fault is it? It's sexual assault and attempted rape, all day long. And it's the arse hole of a brother in laws fault. The girl is absolutely at fault. At fault for what? Getting drunk? Falling asleep? Being alone with him?

Were you the fifteen year old?

Bluntness100 · 18/03/2017 07:13

The girl is absolutely not at fault...sorry,,!

Sansculottes · 18/03/2017 07:15

Having sex with someone who isn't consenting is rape. Please do ring rape crisis if this is you and you need support op.

If any of the surrounding factors are/were making this 15 year old feel in any way bad about what happened they shouldn't.

15 year old girls shouldn't be taken to clubs by adults.

Adults shouldn't be encouraging 15 year old girls to drink too much.

Adult men shouldn't share beds with 15 year old girls.

It is the law that adults shouldn't even have consensual sex with 15 year old girls let alone forcing them.

CircleofWillis · 18/03/2017 07:16

Ijustdon'tknow, this was rape and definitely not the fault of the young women. Her age is also irrelevant in terms of it being rape. If she had bee 12, 15, 23, or 40 it is still rape. Her age just makes the crime even worse as he was in a position of trust and had a duty of care. I how she is OK and not blaming herself. I can understand that she might be feeling like not saying anything as it might affect her relationship with her sister. However does she want her sister to marry someone capable of rape and the rape of a child at that? Can she speak to an adult she trusts? A parent or a neighbour or a teacher from school and go to the police with them? The sooner she is protected from this man the better.

AskBasil · 18/03/2017 07:18

It is the fault of the perpetrator of sexual assault and attempted rape.

Even if the 15 year old was consenting (which she wasn't) he's a scum-bag and I do hope the victim's sister will not marry him.

But she wasn't consenting. This man is a sexual predator, no decent man would ever behave like this.

Get her to ring Rape Crisis.

CircleofWillis · 18/03/2017 07:19

Phoning rape crisis as a pp poster has said is a very good idea.

guinnessgirl · 18/03/2017 07:25

100% the fault of the scummy future BiL. It's rape. Simple as that. I'm so sorry OP

picklemepopcorn · 18/03/2017 07:26

Not the fifteen year old.

Two men took two children to a club, with the knowledge of one girl's sister (what was she thinking?). They gave them alcohol, then raped them, assuming the same scenario happened in the other pairing as well.

Petpank · 18/03/2017 07:39

So sorry OP. Please take care of yourself. Is there someone you could talk to?

Petpank · 18/03/2017 07:41

He says no one will believe her if she tells the truth... well I believe you and clearly I'm not the only one.

InTheMoodForLove · 18/03/2017 07:42

two men raped two teenagers on that night (and more crimes were committed too)
did you sister go on and married this guy?
are the two teenagers considering where to report it?

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