Is our financial arrangement completely dysfunctional and am I wrong to be fed up with it?

[Frombathwithlove]

I posted this in another section on MN, but one of the poster's suggested I put it here instead ☺

This will probably be a bit lengthy, so you might want to grab a coffee!
So, the basics are: DP and I have been together 7 years and live together in a rented house. Both married before, my 2 DC live with us and DP's 2 children live with his ex and her partner. DP works full time and I work part-time (at least 30hrs/wk spread over 3 jobs). I receive maintenance from my ExH and DP pays maintenance to his ExW. I also receive child benefit for DC's.
That's the basics! The rub is this; DP and I pay 50% each of rent & joint utilities. We pay our own individual bills independently (i.e car insurance, credit cards, pension, catalogues etc and we run a car each). We have separate personal bank accounts that our wages go in to - mine also has CB and maintenance going in to it - we have a joint 'bills' account that we pay our 50% in to and the direct debits go out of that.
Alongside this, I fully support my dc with EVERYTHING! From clothes to school trips to Christmas & birthday presents. On their birthdays we all go out for a meal and I pay. DP earns approx. £10,000 pa more than me , he pays maintenance for his dc (as mentioned before) and sees them for 1 day every weekend. If DP, my DC and I go for a coffee/lunch when out, I pay. I buy all the necessary things needed for the home (decorating, furniture when needed, soon to be flooring & carpets too). We also pay an amount in to the joint account to cover food, 50/50 again - it never covers the cost of food though, I always have to add to it.
So, the whole 'separate the finances' came about a few years ago when DP was moaning about what I prioritised when it came to money. I got really cross and worked a ratio of what we should pay, along the lines of: he earns x % more so should pay more (I know that sounds arsey, but it was how I felt). DP didn't like the ratio and said that there were 3 of us (me & DC x2) and only 1 of him so why should he pay more? He said it wasn't happy with it and agreed 50/50.
So, here we are. I feel like a single parent within a relationship! But, actually worse off than a single parent; because if I was truly on my own I would get assistance from the DSS!
Would this annoy/upset you?
(In fact, is it so garbled that you lost the plot ages ago?)

From posting in the other section, it became clear I needed to give some more details, so for clarity:
My income, including maintenance and CB is approx. £15,000 pa. His income (after paying maintenance for his dc) is just over £25,000.
We live in a Housing Association house.

I don't expect DP to support me whilst I work part time. I cannot work full time due to the hours of my main employment not fitting in around my DC, and he cannot help me with childcare due to his job. I work three separate jobs that do fit in around the DC.

DP will on occasion buy a takeaway for us, but this is very seldom. He does show an interest in my DC, not as much as I would like, but maybe my expectations are too high there as well? I suppose if I am honest, I feel that he does what he needs to with the children, to have me. This is rather a grim picture emerging, isn't it?!

You need to be a bit less passive here!

You are very quick to say - oh some random people on the internet say he shouldn't pay for me, so I suppose I'll leave it!

You've now given two really important bits of information:

• him moving in reduced your previous income and he agreed to make up for that

• he has happily reduced his own maintenance as a result!

His own kids don't cost any less to care for now. I personally think it's ridiculous that CM is decreased for stepchildren. But that's a separate topic. I do think any honourable man wouldn't decrease maintenance payments anyway, even if they were allowed. So now his XW is picking up more of that cost

I don't think he sounds like a keeper tbh. But the least you should do is tell him outright that this is not a fair situation and discuss how it is resolved. That means him contributing more. He should contribute AT LEAST the amount he's saving in CM. And enough to balance your lost benefits.

I couldn't get past the "There are 3 of you and only one of me" comment tbh. You are either a family or not. I am wondering if this is an underlying issue too. Presumably he knew he was taking a package when he moved in with you. That line alone would be the deal breaker for me.

I think it's hard to expect a stepparent to love their stepchildren.

But I'd be very disappointed if after living with a 3 and 6yo for SEVEN YEARS he didn't show an interest.
My fiancé is always chatting with my 8yo and asking about her (how did her ballet exam go, etc).

You still haven't said if you actually love him and enjoy his company.

I disagree that you have to be a "package" if you have older children. Many children already have a dad, and their mother's relationship status doesn't take any responsibility away from their dad. After 13 years as a single parent, I would not have wanted a partner to feel obligated to contribute towards my children.

( I also think it's unfair that a parent is allowed to reduce child support because they live with someone else's children. Children don't get less expensive because of the choices of their parents.)

OP - if his child maintenance has reduced as a result of living with your children he should be treating them like "dependent children" and financially contributing towards them - at least as much as he's saving by reducing the payments to his biological children.

I'm afraid he's coming across as rather tight and I'd be wanting to have a long chat with him to resolve this sooner rather than later.

There's not just a financial issue going on her op.
When I met my dh my only child at the time was 5.
In the thirteen years we have been together and added two more children we are a family unit.
My dh treats my ds the same as the other two and anything less would be unacceptable in my eyes.
It's so much more than the practical side of parenting step children.
My dh is my sons role model and the last couple of years have been wearing and pushed dh to his limits at times having a hormonal bolshy young male pushing boundaries but he has parented him along side me the whole time.
Your partner has taken on two dc alongside you as you come together.
He's very selfish if he thinks they are an add on

Have you told him how you feel?

Of course no one is "obligated" to fund another parent's child but I would like to think that after so long together any partner male or female should care enough about the partner's kids to want to. OPs partner doesn't and I would be more worried about that than the actual financial issue. I don't know but it seems that this is part of the underlying problem?

Both spectrums of opinion expressed here make sense and I nearly didn't post. Until, that is, I remembered you saying that you'd discussed with him that you would be worse off financially if you moved in together and he said he gave you reassurance of his support - including financial.

So that's what I think the problem is here. His idea of financial support is to pay what he considers his fair share, not to actually - you know - support.

Both spectrums of opinion expressed here make sense and I nearly didn't post. Until, that is, I remembered you saying that you'd discussed with him that you would be worse off financially if you moved in together and he said he gave you reassurance of his support - including financial.

So that's what I think the problem is here. His idea of financial support is to pay what he considers his fair share, not to actually - you know - support.

Both spectrums of opinion expressed here make sense and I nearly didn't post. Until, that is, I remembered you saying that you'd discussed with him that you would be worse off financially if you moved in together and he said he gave you reassurance of his support - including financial.

So that's what I think the problem is here. His idea of financial support is to pay what he considers his fair share, not to actually - you know - support.

@Ellisandra
Yes, I do love him. That feeling is just under extreme strain at the moment. I am finding it increasingly difficult to love somebody who doesn't prioritise a childs' needs before his own. As has been mentioned, DP has opted to pay less CM to his ex because the CM calculator says he can if he has children living with him, but then he doesn't spend that on my DC - so he is win/win there. This epiphany has been a long time coming for me and the hostilities surrounding it have been manifesting for a long time.
Reading back over posts, it is apparent how confused I have become about it all and that I need to decide what I need, what I want and what I am willing to tolerate, obviously DP needs to do the same.

My ex-DP did the same thing to me. When I said I couldn't afford to take a part-time job which would relieve a massive amount of stress, he insisted I took it and that he'd be happy to help out. It turned out what he actully meant was that if he had a spare tenner in his wallet at the end of the month, I could have it.

The only question I feel you need to ask is whether he is genuinely providing support - not keeping you - just making sure you're not worse off because he lives there. It sounds to me like you are.

Oops - sorry about the multiple posts (I thought I was still typing!)

That is my biggest problem, Joyless. I put it to him years ago about the moving in meaning less income for me, but he assured me he wanted to join my family - to take on the finances and that we would be fine as his income exceeded what I was currently getting. I still have the email where he reiterated all of the above when I got cold feet about living together! (I keep everything btw). So, in effect, I feel jooped by the person I trust most.

Oh now, hang on a minute. He got to reduce his child maintenance because he moved in with you AND you're worse off? That's a very different kettle of fish. So he's saving money while you're losing money... nah, fuck that shit.

I am one of the ones who wouldn't expect a subsequent partner to support my child, but that's taking the piss.

Oh dear, that doesn't sound good frombath. I worked hard at getting my ex to understand that just saying stuff so he sounded good wasn't enough, he had to be prepared to stand by it - and that "forgetting" wasn't an acceptable excuse. He is an ex for a good reason sadly. My greatest concern in reading that someone is financially mean - as opposed to careful due to limited availability of funds - is that it tends to mean they are also mean spirited. Sweeping generalisation there I know, but that's my experience. Take care m'dear, I do hope he responds positively when you show him that email and ask him what he meant by it.

Joint account from Day1. We trusted each other to spend wisely - if we plan a big item we discuss it.

I am constantly amazed that people will live with and have children with someone who does not trust them to combine incomes in a joint account.

I get that a subsequent partner should not be expected to pay for kids that aren't his. But as far as I am concerned that stops when he decides to live with you as a family. And when he decides to live with you and your kids as a family in a family house then finances become joint and family money. You pool your income and outgoings. You are a family. If he doesn't want to do that he really shouldn't live with you.

Ernie - the other side of the coin is that my mortgage was paid off when I met DH, I earned significantly more, and my DCs were teenagers. He was single with no dependants. It just didn't make sense to "pool" resources. DH has life rent of our house, but will share any inheritance equally with my children. I still help my DCs out now - no way should he be expected to do that.

However, that's side tracking. I think women should think very carefully about how their partner treats their ex - because that is very likely how they themselves will be treated if the relationship was to end.

OP - your guy doesn't sound like a keeper. There will be someone better out there for you.

I discussed, at length, with my DP the fact that I would be worse off financially if he moved in with us, and his living with us would mean some degree of support. He basically said that he would be (happily) 'taking us on' as a family and would expect this to be financially as well as everything else

^ This is the piece of the puzzle missing! Now it all makes sense. So, he got to live in a housing association place and little rent. In effect this meant more money for him and his children, and less for you and your children! Great. Why have you let him get away with this? What you can do about it now I don't know - he's on the tenancy!

The bottom line is you want him to (partially) support you and your children financially and he doesn't want to (only he already does, a bit, because he pays half of rent and utility bills). If you'd really be better off without him living with you it's fine to tell him to make up the difference or move out. It's also find to bin him because you want a relationship only with someone who'll support you. I do think it's a bit off to criticise him because he doesn't want to though.

In terms of what having other dependants means to the CM calculation - it's 2/5ths of not very much at all so I think that's a bit of a red herring tbh. He's also, I assume, got to allow for clothes at your place for them, feeding them etc when they're with him?

I guess, in your shoes, I'd want to know what was going on with the "spare" he's left with (is there any?). Is he saving that for a rainy day for you both, or caning it on stuff for himself?

I earn considerably more, on paper, than my DP but between the household bills I pay, maintenance, the petrol needed to do 360 mile round trips (always at least twice a month, some months more) to pick my dc up, feeding them when I have them, buying them clothes for my house, then commuting costs for work etc I'm pretty bloody broke at the end of a month. I've shown DP this, several times, but it still comes up as an issue/argument from time to time.

As pp have said, you need to revisit the whole finance convo. Get him to print his statements and get a spreadsheet going with ALL the costs you're each paying and then tell him if you don't think the outcome is equitable.

Fair points, Barbarian, the nub of the matter.

Oh and I hope he's doing his share of the housework/garden/washing OP. You shouldn't be subsidising him w that.