My partner is Indian and I am White British

[brightonrockk]

I have met someone at University, we're both 19 and have been together for a year. I met him in halls so for the first 9 months we were living together. I am deeply in love with him, and I know he loves me too.

He comes from South India, where he lived for the first 8 years of his life before his family moved to the UK for work and education reasons. They have since moved back due to the ill health of my partner's Grandmother, but his parents were always planning to move back as they really belong in India. That's where they're currently living although they come back and forth at present to sort out the move.

They are very conservative, the mother especially. His father is less so. I am very in the dark about how they really feel about me - it's not something my partner really discusses with them for avoidance of confrontation (which has become especially important to him since his Grandmother's illness) - so I apologise for lack of real detail.

His mother hates him being in a relationship full stop. My partner has a twin, and he also has a girlfriend, but she is Indian. His mother doesn't want to know about her either. His Mum has told him something along the lines of if he doesn't marry an Indian she wants nothing to do with him (I think this is when he first told her he has a girlfriend though so may have been very heated once she found out that on top of that I'm white). His Dad has said that "it must be a good thing if [I] make [my partner] happy". His Dad once said something about having me over for dinner, his Mum doesn't even want to set eyes on me.

My partner recently went back to India to see his family. When he went he refused to skype me apart from on Christmas day where he said he had to go after 15 minutes. He wouldn't skype me in fear of upsetting his Mum.

I don't know what to do, I feel very in the dark about this and completely out of my comfort zone. We make each other so, so happy. I would like to move in with him next year, but being at University means his parents will be paying part of the rent and so the decision is really up to them. I know when my partner asks the answer will be no.

Sometimes I get very worried about what our future holds. I love him, really love him, and I can see a future with him, but I'm unsure as to if and how a relationship can flourish if his parents are going to do everything in their power to stop that.

He is a very loyal son. His parents sacrificed a lot for him to have a good life, and he knows that. The last thing he wants to do is upset them. They are ultimately his priority. I've asked him "if they told you right now to dump me, would you?" and his answer was "Right now? No". But what if when we finish university they tell him, what if they force him into it? I feel scared. I know nothing about how Indian parents see relationships - it's an alien way of thinking to someone who's grown up in a very western world.

His parents were an arranged marriage, my Dad was divorced when he met my Mum and they married after 4 years of courting. His Mum won't look at me, my parents let him sleep in my bed when we visit them. His Mum wants him to marry an Indian girl, my parents would be happy if I married an Indian girl, black man, or non-binary albino as long as there's love. We're from different worlds.

All I know is this:
We love each other.

I guess I'm posting because I don't know if anyone has any experience with this. I want his Mum to meet me, talk to me about my plans in life and maybe try and see me as being good for him. Both myself and my partner have equally high career ambitions and put our studies first, I want him to succeed more equally as much as I want myself to and support him all the time in doing that. I get him food and cook him healthy meals when he's snowed under with work. I clean his flat and get him medicine when he's ill. I hold him when he cries. I don't want some cultural barriers (that, may I add, my partner does not agree with.. it's only his mother) to tarnish a beautiful relationship. How much do I push this? It's stressful for him to be torn, do I cave to his mother's wishes to help him or do I stand up for us? Will this get better? How long? I would LOVE to meet his parents and talk to his Mum about spices, his Dad about recent technology developments. I'd love to help his Mum in the kitchen and play cards with his father. How do I show them as being worthy for their son? Will that ever happen?

I feel so helpless. Am I being silly?

I am afraid to say that however much he says he loves you, (and I am sure he does) you are probably just the 'for now' girlfriend. When it's time for him to go home and be matched up with someone of his mother's choosing it's almost certain he will go along with this. He may be indulging in a bit of rebellion now by dating you, and he might even flirt with the idea of breaking with tradition and going against his mother's plans for him, but at 19 it's pretty easy for him to imagine all sorts of things he might do. Let's ask him again at 29. It will likely be a different story.

I imagine his dad knows this too so is choosing to seem more benevolent and tolerant for now, because what's the point in rocking the boat and laying down the law to a 19 year old who has only been dating this unsuitable girl for a year? Let the boy have his fun, get it out of his system and he'll know what he needs to do when the time comes.

If you are VERY lucky he might buck the trend, but frankly he probably won't. Sticking with him for years in the hope that it might go your way is a huge risk and you could find yourself being dropped suddenly with no warning because the time has come, Mummy has spoken and he's really sorry but you must surely have always known this was inevitable? Did he ever make you any cast iron promises? No.

Frankly, as you are both only 19 there are no guarantees that this relationship will go the full distance anyway regardless of any cultural pressures. It would be better if you stop thinking of him as your partner and making yourself into some tragic heroine with this huge problem to overcome. You don't need a partner at 19. You don't need this sort of worry when you should be having the time of your life at uni. What you need is a good old fashioned boyfriend which comes with much less loaded expectation and no crystal ball. Just enjoy it and see where it goes. Don't waste too much time fretting about what may or may not happen in 5 or 10 years time when you might tire of one another in a year's time anyway.

BUT, do guard yourself against allowing it to drag on for years without any clear message from him that he considers you perfectly suitable to marry and have children with and that he's willing to go against his mother in order for that to happen. I don't think you should be putting him on the spot now about that because at 19 probably doesn't even know what he thinks about marriage to anyone yet.

But assuming you stay together for a while yet, as years tick by, listen very closely for the subtext in what he says. You need to be brave and extract yourself once it becomes clear that you can never 'win' this one.

DH and I have a cross-cultural marriage. We met at 18 and were certain we would be together for life very early on.

His parents were a bit disappointed about me initially, but realised quickly that their son was not properly of their culture - he wasn't taking over the family business, he had mostly white friends and spoke only basic levels of his family's language. Essentially, they realised they had raised an Australian boy and had to accept me as a consequence of their desire for him to fit in here.

It's been 20 years and we now have 2 DC. My PILs are lovely people, but we aren't close. The language barrier continues to grow was they age and we can only exchange pleasantries really.

What's different in your scenario, as far as I can tell, is that your partner and his family still very much identify as 'Indian.' Your partner will need to stand up to his mother and as that hasn't happened yet, I'd be very wary in your shoes.

(Also, my white Aussie bro married an Indian woman. And not wanting to perpetuate stereotypes, but his MIL makes things quite difficult from what I can see. The devotion to the parents would not be something I could handle - my bro is a very easygoing guy and it washes over him. He's very different to me!)

Sorry OP - I agree with most of the posts here. You will likely be very hurt. He will most likely marry an Indian woman, probably someone chosen by his mother.

Well, just to give you a more hopeful example - my friend was in exactly this situation, her DP's Indian parents were very opposed to the relationship, especially his father, although his siblings were supportive. His parents refused to go to the wedding, but when they had children things started to thaw and now 20 years later they get on really well. So it's not hopeless, but in her case her DH always stood up to his parents and told them it was none of their business who he saw - doesn't sound like your boyfriend is quite as assertive.

Just to add to my original post in case others in a similar situation read this, as I said, most Indian families I know are still very traditional however I also know personally people (at least 8) who have married outside the Indian culture and religion and have good relationships with both in laws.

However, in OP's particular situation, it comes down to how willing the partner will be to push against their parent's wishes. It may because of the partner's age and this attitude may change as they get older, or it may be the partner's nature (e.g. they'll always be like this) or even I'm sorry to say, that the partner doesn't feel strongly enough about the OP specifically to put up a fight.

It is extremely hard, I've been there myself (both sets of in laws initially objected) but it can work out sometimes. I'm just concerned that there is too much stacked against it here. That's obviously just my POV though.

You're both very young but never prioritise someone who's willing to prioritise someone else at your expense. The things you admire about him now such as being a 'good' son, will be the very thing that frustrate and anger you when sacrificing your mental wellbeing is the price you pay for his loyalty.

Yes this - the qualities you list as admirable - being a good son/respectful of parents - please view these attributes as they are. The classic Mumsnet line of - he is telling you who he is OP just listen - rings true.

These are not the qualities you should admire. For these are the very things that will make him have his nice time at university and go and have the arranged marriage to the girl selected for him with matched caste profiles and matched horoscopes recommended by the family priest who his mother adulates.

I was in love with an Asian (Pakistani Muslim) guy at university.
I woke up to the fact it would never work after 3 years of him never having any intention of telling his family.
It was such a crying shame because I a 1:1 level we had a great relationship. He was charming, thoughtful, clever, interesting but he would never have chosen me over his mum.
I was heartbroken at the time but I know we could never have had a future. He has an arranged marriage to a 'suitable' girl now and as far as I know they are happy. She also thinks I have always been just a friend.
I do feel I was used as a bit of 'wild oats' and yes for sex which of course could not happen outside marriage with a Muslim girl.
I still like him though and I don't think it was as conscious and calculated as that. I think he did love me and never thought about whether it had a future but the result in the end was that I felt hurt and used and I suspect that is your future too.
His mum would have been genuinely devastated. It would be a shame in her community and seen as a waste as he is a very marriageable prospect. She would certainly have threatened suicide. I have no idea if she'd have come round in the end but he wasn't going to risk it.

Joining the Indians in the list. DH is also Indian but from a different community. His parents are super duper conservative. Mine are ultra liberal (ie if I married a white lesbian they wouldn't care). The main objection was that I was from a different community/caste. We don't even mutually comprehend each other's languages. It didn't last long but the key thing was this: DH always stood by me. Always.

Look, culturally there are things I get instinctively that you might not. That's fine. The ILs come and stay for longer periods than most Western families would find appropriate/comfortable. That's okay BECAUSE DH is equally comfortable with having my parents come and live with us for as long I want them to. The main thing is that DH and I are incredibly open about things that make Indian marriages a bit different/difficult- I can bitch about MIL to him and he can moan about my mother to me. We are, for the most part, a team and we are equals. He is an equal parent, does the housework, stands up and says no to his family when needed and puts on pressure on me to conform (and I am the same).

DH didn't introduce me to his Dad for a long time not because he was ashamed but as we both knew many Indian families don't get the concept of 'dating' and there would be pressure on us to get married. I met his mum and brother not long after we started dating when I was 21. When we were 27 we told his Dad (because we were ready to get married and professionally settled) and got married at the end of that year. I didn't mind being a 'secret' because I knew what the cultural context was and because DH had made it clear, ALWAYS that if his Dad objected we would still get married. FIL and I are now quite close mainly because I am open and honest with him.

Ultimately it comes down to your partner (DH and I have now been together 15 years) and how supportive he is. I wouldn't expect DH to forsake his family because my own family is important to me but I would be very uncomfortable if they were top priority each time. For instance I didn't change my surname which was a BIG deal to my in laws but DH stood by me and it ceased to be relevant. What worries me about your situation is not that his family is conservative but that he hasn't taken a stance and reassured YOU. Maybe you are too young and so he is. Maybe he isn't sure. But that is a big red flag for me.

*NO pressure on me to conform!

The things you admire about him now such as being a 'good' son, will be the very thing that frustrate and anger you when sacrificing your mental wellbeing is the price you pay for his loyalty.

This is true in my white/white, same cultural background marriage, and any longterm relationship too.
He IS telling you who he is, listen to him.

This thread must be very hard for you to read

Yes very hard for you to read :( But i would say very realistic and true contributions. I (non Indian) dated an Indian guy last year and yes you need to understand the culture in India and the way Indian families work. We broke up for other reasons but the status of women in India and the way they are treated is very different to the West - sometimes shockingly so.

Ultimately he has to totally have your back and stand up for you on every occasion and for me he isnt doing that. Please really look out for yourself -and yes stop all that looking after him if he isnt doing that for you!

I am going to sound harsh, I know, but it is meant to help you. You met your boyfriend whilst in halls, so during your first year at uni. This was not him choosing to live with you. I would imagine the relationship to have be en very intense, both emotionally and physically. But now, does he refer to you as his partner?? How does he see the relationship?? If you don't heed the unanimous advice given here, you will experience such sadness.I really send you my best wishes. You sound like a lovely girl. Find someone who deserves you.

I've asked him "if they told you right now to dump me, would you?" and his answer was "Right now? No"

Talk about being on notice!!

Unfortunately the translation of this is: I'll happily go along with his for now, but when it comes to commitment, marriage or children? Not a hope in hell

I understand it would hurt to split up with him, but wouldn't it be better to do it now before you're in any deeper, and before you waste even more of your young, university years?

arlene wow your story is shocking and I think you must have great mental strength to have coped with that and brought up your three daughters.

I'm a south Asian man but I think jaagojaago has it completely correct. Listen to her. Most conservative Asian families don't care about how nice you are. Simply put if they assume they can't control you(being white British is enough) then his mother is never going to like you. It's a cycle of abuse in south Asian circles. Daughters in law get abused then they abuse their own daughters in law one day. There are exceptions but those kind people are an exception in the culture. By your description if this doesn't work out or if he can't stand upto his parents then don't bother. I always say I'd rather be happy alone and single then suffer a headfuck.

My son met Sikh girl in his very first week at University. They absolutely fell for each other. Lovely girl, she was treated as his partner by us for four years. She never told her parents about my son because they would have pulled her out of Uni.

When they graduated my son asked her to come clean and get a place with him; he absolutely saw their relationship as being forever. He is convinced she loved him too.

But she chose her family and broke up with him. It's pretty awful to watch your 22 year old son get his heart broken.

Thing is, her two older brothers had long term Uni relationships too, then just went back to the family. She swore to my son that they were just cowards and she would be different. She wasn't.

I was in exactly the same situation. No real problem with my parents and his dad was a bit more open minded but his mum was not. I did meet them on a few occasions and we got on well and they liked me but still wanted him to settle down with someone from his own race/background. It came to the crunch when he made it clear that the wouldn't marry until his late 20s but also that he couldn't live with me. Rather than face years of uncertainty whilst he decided whether to go against his mum's wishes I walked away; the cultural differences on his side were just too great. I don't know what has happened to him since but I'd put good money on a loosely arranged marriage. Hope things work out better for you.

It strikes me that we all accept this cultural racism, or at least don't condemn it .. possible exception being milklollies in some respects?

Not in the slightest. It is appalling. I know some incredibly racist/misogynist Indian people and families. Also deeply homophobic. It doesn't make it remotely okay but the OP is not going to take this battle on single handedly, is she? The advice here is mostly practical, as it needs to be.

It is really really unlikely he will go against his parents wishes in this I'm afraid, as others have said. I know it must be heartbreaking, but I really think you should get out now, before you become even more attached.

My DH has a Pakistani father and European mother, so it was easy for him to pick a white woman like me; his dad had already fought that battle for him. I believe it was quite a battle, and from seeing my husband's Asian family I think my father in law is quite an unusual man to have broken with tradition in this way. My husband has a lot of male uncles and cousins, and despite dating white women as students and younger men, they ALL ultimately ended up married to a girl from 'back home'.

If I may something vaguely controversial. I have a lot of friends in India who are liberal/upper middle class and who went abroad to study in the West. Many found non Indian partners and there may have been the odd raised eyebrow but for the most part it has been fine. However here in the U.K. among the diaspora I find that culturally attitudes are far more conservative among the same social class (so no point comparing an Indian farmer with a second generation IT engineer here...if one deals in stereotypes). But the middle class South Asia diaspora is often a LOT more conservative than their counterparts 'back home'. Almost as if they are harking to a South Asia that has moved on.

My south indian husband was well into his 30s with his own place, and we are the same religion so his family were ok with me.

Yes Luchi, i think that is spot on.

Tinkly exactly the same situation happened to my male cousin. Its awful.

Op you know he wont put you first. He will do as his mother wants. Even if he marries you, rather than going back to where his parents live, he wont put you first. Yiu know that. I would walk away now