Experiences of friendships/relationship with people who have borderline personality disorder?

[JuicyMouth]

I have a formerly very close friend in her 30's who was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder some years ago during her adulthood. She has been in therapy since then, but I can't say it has had any positive effect on her.

I have known her since we were children, and although she can be extremely nice, friendly and generous, she has always had moments of being 'challenging' (for want of a better word), and has sometimes been quite horrible. This year I decided to distance myself from her after she abruptly cut me off for months, for no comprehensible reason.

A few days ago she reached out to me in an attempt to rekindle our friendship. But I am sceptical after dealing with years of her changing moods and behaviours.

I'm now wondering how others have found people with the same disorder. Just how much of the negative behaviour is the 'real' them, and how much of it is the disorder?

Oh god ubiquity, I'm so glad someone else thinks their children are doomed!

I was abused but 2 different men between ages 14-19 and didn't tell a soul. I shoved it all deep down and pretended it had never happened so I was pretty much set for significant mh issues either way. My df has depression and anxiety and there are a few other mh DC knocking around my family (which thankfully are very supportive and wonderful, they're the reason I can feign normal as well as I do!) however, there is obviously a strong genetic mh thing in my family.

Between my bpd (I'm forever feeling guilty that I'm such a shit mum) and dd1 loosing her sister and brother during my pregnancies I have concluded that there is no way she can grow up without being fucked up a bit. I'm desperately trying to do it all 'right' but it's so bloody hard.

Kitty yes my exdw was paranoid about affairs too. Ultimately that became a self destructive cycle. Sounds like you understand it is paranoia, she didn't.

Ubiquity I can promise you that option B is the right option. I have a beautiful happy well adjusted teenage daughter with my exdw despite the problems. And she lives with her 10 days a fortnight.

Sorry was commenting on your earlier comment Kitty.

I always just thought I was flighty and irresponsible with bouts of suicidal depression. The bouts got longer and more frequent and I was diagnosed with bpd a few years ago. I also have a bipolar 2 diagnosis.

I have managed to bag a fantastic husband who gets me and puts up with a lot. I have two good friends who have been constant for the last nine years or so, but they are both wonderful people who don't mind if I go off the grid for weeks at a time, and we pick up where we left off after a while.

I either don't trust people or trust them completely (black and white thinking) and I'm stupidly easily offended. I ruminate on past slights a lot and swing from feeling I am an innocent victim to feeling it's all my fault.

It's a hard road to travel but therapy and meds make it easier to deal with, mood stabilisers take the edge off the huge swings and therapy helps to unpick and step back.

There's a lot of stigma about the disorder but almost all the people I've met in therapy have been deeply caring and kind individuals, who just struggle with their emotions and those of people around them.

Yes alvin, I figured that was a reply to a post before :)

Tbh I know that my paranoia is my bpd rather than a realistic worry about my lovely husband and therefore my paranoia is never, ever voiced. I wouldn't dream of accusing him of something that I recognise comes from my abandonment issues rather than any realism if that makes sense?

I imagine you must have had a tough time being married to your exw

I have a friend like this. Good friends as teenagers but now distant and see her rarely (she moved far away too). I actually am not sure how useful the diagnosis of BPD has been to her... she seems to treat it as a liscence to be horrifically self involved and then blame it on the BPD. My experience with her has actually made me quite sceptical of it as a diagnosis, which I feel terrible for as I have no doubt it's a real thing, but with her it seems to just present as her being a selfish pain in the arse who loves drama and "can't cope" with friendships/family/work.

My experience of a friend with BPD was not good. She showed an array of traits. She could be fun and friendly. But the negative ones absolutely outweighed them. For her limited generosity she expected payback in time, and you could see her anger if she did not get the payback in spades she felt she deserved! The more I got to know her the more selfish and unpleasant I realised her behaviour could be. I felt sorry for her family, and also sorry for anyone she crossed.

After a particularly unpleasant episode she managed, like your friend, to get in touch again, eventually - as if nothing had happened. Unfortunately this is not because she had reconsidered her behaviour and had empathy for what she had put me through, but simply her fear of abandonment. It was still about her!

The bottom line is if a friend is "horrible" to you and then cuts you off for no reason, I would be very wary of going back to this "friendship". You have managed to keep your distance and I would absolutely maintain this for your own peace of mind and self-preservation. You deserve better.

Unfortunately due to being married to someone with BPD for over 20 years, I have PTSD. Not half an hour ago, after I decided that I couldn't put him, or our family (all adults) through a court appearance, he sent our son a text telling him that I'm a liar, although couched in different terms, rather protesting his innocence. This of course has messed with my head still further, but I am the one telling DS, never mind, he honestly believes that, he has to create his own reality because he can't deal with this. It's hard. I would agree that if it's a friend you can walk away.
Ubiquity Don't hate yourself, not even 0.0001%. You have insight, you are very obviously willing to take all offered, that's really positive, you are strong and brave.
Unfortunately my dh is unable to acknowledge that he has this illness and can't therefore access any help offered. (Not that mental health are good here, and in fact had they done their job properly we wouldn't be separated now).

all help offered apologies.

My mother has BPD, I am that doomed child and I won't sugar coat it to appease anyone else so those of you similarly diagnosed may not want to read what I have to say. The choice is yours but if you do read it please try to remember this is not about you.

My mother's BPD has ravaged my life. I grew up terrified of the never ending drama and outrageous emotional explosions. Do you know what it's like as a child to lie in your bed rigid with fear because you can hear your own mother screaming in your direction? Every minute of my life was a roller-coaster of never knowing which way was the right way to turn. I had to learn how to read her moods and salve her emotional needs, all the time. I'm "lucky", I'm the all bad child so she just despises me. I am worthless and useless and a life time of conditioning has taught me that. I often read threads on mn where people write about their normal families and I remember being told things like "you ruin everything" and "you're disgusting". My sister is the all good child, high flying massively successful woman with what looks like the perfect career and life, my mother is so proud of her (it's ALL about her). My sister sees a psychiatrist regularly to try a deal with that pressure and no amount of achievement will ever be enough, the need will never be fed. We are fucked up.

I cut ties with my mother 8 years ago when she put my children at very real risk, to punish me for some perceived non-compliance. She created a drama which ended up much bigger than she intended and involved my children's school and the social services. I have never been so scared in my life and I now have PTSD and horrible anxiety as a result. I panic if anyone knocks the door and I struggle to go out on my own. I can't leave my children with anyone, I trust nobody. I have no life at all. See, worthless and useless.

You'd never know if you met her. She's an articulate, educated professional woman who sucks people in, sucks them dry and casts them aside when they're of no more use to her. She's a big fan of parasuicide and for those of you wonder how your children would cope I'll happily tell you if you like. My mother's tried to kill herself multiple times, except she hasn't. What she's done is what so many do and she's had a bit of a bash to get some attention. She's an unfillable void and she doesn't give a fuck. I've sat in intensive care waiting to see if she'll survive after a cocktail of booze and pills when she set herself on fire! I've tidied up the mess left by the ambulance crew and cleaned the vomit off the floor. I've babysat her like a fucking child at the expense of my own and I've waited, knowing, for the next time and there's nothing we can do and no help. She's poison. And like so many with BPD she has absolutely no insight. She refuses to acknowledge that she's anything other than normal. She's tried to have herself sectioned fuck knows how many times (gotta love the drama) but she's not psychiatrically unwell. She could be helped but she refuses to engage. She's a fan of the benzos (we've been doing this for decades, I know they're the prescription of choice any more) but she just wants to take pills and moan about how they don't work.

I could go on and on about this but it's awful and really very upsetting. I understand why my mother is the way she is, and I know it's not fun for her, but what I don't understand is why she wants to do the same thing to us. I know her parents were awful (I suspect maybe more awful than I know) but hell will freeze over before I'll do to my kids what she's done to me. Never. I wish her no harm but I cannot have her in my life, I must protect my children from her.

Op my situation is different to yours because it's my mother not a friend but my advice is the same. Run. You are under no obligation to have this relationship and it will never be normal. You will never meet your friend's needs and she will use you and drop you as she sees fit. My mother did exactly the same. Get out while you can.

To those of you with a BPD diagnosis if you've read this I'm sorry, I know you'll find it upsetting. But please, please, don't make my experience about you. It's not. It's not a criticism of you in any way. Things are different now and there are treatments and help you can engage with. I am 40 and my mother is mid 60s ish, our situation is not the same as yours. Your insight is your light at the end of the tunnel and I really do wish you well.

there are some sad stories here, but I'm responding to the OP, not the close relationship posts. ive had a friend over 20 years who is diagnosed BPD but it's more like extreme PD Id say. and a whole host of other mental and physical ill health diagnoses too.

Its hard being her friend. She is so erratic and recently obnoxious too. this happened when she stopped her meds. She also has deteriorated physically over the last 10 years and is wheelchair bound. It is impossible to know how much is in her mind. I let the professionals get on with it but she is it seems a failed result of heavy mental health input over the years. Shes had years of psychiatric and psychological input. her childhood was probably as abusive as you get, Ive not heard many worse accounts, and Im an experienced child protection professional

anyway, i keep the friendship going because- well i suppose because i don't want to abandon her and she can be a good friend.

Id advise a thick skin OP and do not over invest. give as much as you can without resentment. I dont pussy foot round my friend and don't pander to her ridiculous demands and beliefs. she probably wont last much longer, she's completely stuck and unable to help herself anymore. It is terribly sad but I cannot save her, we can only save ourselves

I'd also say run a mile. I endured a friendship with a woman who had BPD (plus many other labels), and it was exhausting. She could be nice sometimes. She supported me thru a marriage breakdown, but a lot of the time she was poison. She'd turn up at my house at night, totally plastered. She'd eventually pass out, having stripped off half of her clothes and I'd have to let her sleep it off. Then she's wake at 4am and drive home still pissed (and crashed once). She was always threatening suicide, even telling her DD that's what she was away to do. She got arrested multiple times. She stole from me. In the end, she did something awful and I asked her (along with her DH) to stop and she accused me of having an affair with her DH, because I agreed with him. It was the last straw. Looking back, I can now see how much life she sucked out of me, and how much TIME this took up. NEVER AGAIN!

Really sorry to hear all that FlyingElbows. I hope you are still trying to heal, God knows it sounds tough .

I would add one more thing re. a friendship with someone with BPD traits.

Firstly, I did try "strong boundaries" but the problem in the end is that IME they will push against this because of their fear of abandonment and desperate need for (fake) intimacy. So I would get numerous texts, 'haven't heard from you', 'lets go out', etc. When you met up it was mostly telling you all their problems and what they have to put up with from other people and their martyr status; without this litany of complaints I experienced a surprising depressing and apathetic vacuum in their presence. Meanwhile I trusted her with nothing and kept my deepest feelings to myself as a way of trying to maintain boundaries. However, IME they keep pushing at these boundaries. Firstly I concluded because they want "information" on you, and secondly it fills the void of their lives. So, for me, I had to withdraw completely, which is what I eventually did and wished I had followed my intentions to do this earlier.

Im reading with interest as I have suspicions that my daughter is BPD. No diagnosis and very early stages of intervention (as in, impossible to get anywhere but on the list for CBT) and I recognise her in so much of this. I worry about how she will manage as an adult in a world that isn't all about her. With anger and frustration is my concern. And she is the loveliest person. She just turns everything back to herself and is incredibly impulsive and bases her decisions on her own best interests. She comes across as very self absorbed whilst at the same time intent on self sabotaging everything. She loves creating ir being part of drama but I'm desperately trying to invest as much time as I can in these teen years to give her an identity, sense of self and to prefer positive attention rather than negative also empathy and all of those essential social skills. It makes me worry and sad for her that this might be her life

This Thread is very enlightening.
My adult son has this and it is a nightmare dealing with him. he' nearly given myself and my ex (his Dad) a nervous breakdown this year.

We've had numerous suicide attempts through overdoses, (substance abuse, both prescribed and illicit)
stealing a van to crash it into a wall (risky behavior)
Complete emotional breakdowns when something has gone wrong.
Lies about so many things that are so unnecessary, like he will say he doesn't drink caffeine anymore so he can sleep better (he does) but is then very honest about his drug use.
He steals money and lies about why he needs it on an almost daily basis.
Has no empathy when it comes to other peoples feelings, its all about him.
Will forget all the nasty things he has done or when he says very hurtful things but will always hold a grudge for something that happened 5 years ago.

he cut me out of his life and my grandchildren's life for 4 years, then got back in contact as if nothing had happened,
since he is back in my life there is not a day that has passed that there isn't a drama involving the police, social services, the crisis team, psychosis team, i could go on and on.

I am exhausted.

Elbow I just wanted to give you.

What a horrific childhood.

That had helped slightly in that none of what you describe in your mother is anything like my outward behaviour

Orphid - The need to have 'information' rings a bell with me. In the past she was my closest confidant, until I began to realise that she only seems to use this to control me, or one up me. For this reason I am starting to see that even keeping her at arms length probably wouldn't work.

Like the running theme on this thread my friend also had a childhood that was a recipe for this sort of disorder. Abuse, neglect, an alcoholic parent. Unfortunately she has also gone on to hurt virtually everyone around her, including her eldest son, who she cut off aged 14, as he was never good enough in her eyes. But her youngest son can do no wrong. Now she has gone on to have a daughter - I really do fear how she will treat her growing up.

Yep, Juicy, she will want to "one up you" secretly on just about everything. IMO your friend's hazy and fragile sense of self will make her jealous of the strongest at their most vulnerable, if that makes sense. She will be very canny and capable of using information and mis-information against you if she imagines herself wronged in any way - which she almost inevitably will at some point. As I said I tried boundaries and was very confident about it. But it didn't work for the reasons I mentioned; pwBPD will not respect boundaries. Instead they will try to intensify the relationship relentlessly because of their own void, insecurities, endless boredom and fears of abandonment.

Sincere sympathies to those parents who may have children who are struggling with this disorder.

checking name change

I had a very close friend with BPD. It was hard, but I loved her lots.

She would put herself above all people, even her DP. I remember my sister and I being silently shocked when she ordered food to my address, didn't offer anybody else any, then handed her DP the remains, after he waited patiently.

My DH died recently, and she made it all about her. She wanted a lock of his hair, when I went to see him at the funeral parlour. She was going to get a tattoo in honour of my husband.

She turned up at the crematorium, dyed black hair, complete with daisies stuck into a weird Geisha hairdo and matching black fingernails.

My DSis remarked it was odd that my supposed friend had only come to see me once, in the 3 weeks between ddDH's funeral.

She would slag off what I was studying and pinch my arms hard enough to leave bruises, if we went out for a drink together and a bloke came over to talk to us. Of course I pulled her up on the pinching, her response was that she only did that to people she liked.

She once told me (whilst v. pissed) that she had attempted to seduce ddDH when we were first dating, and I had just joined his circle of friends (which she was one of) and he turned her down flat. ddDH was too much of a gentleman to tell me.

When ddDH bought a house together, she was very drunk bouncing around on our new bed and landed on my head. Her partner asked her to be careful, as she could have broken my neck. She later tried to strangle him and told him she wished he was dead.

One birthday, ddDH had made reservations for dinner. She rang me in a state, and said her and DP had been arguing, and she was self-harming. I cancelled my birthday dinner, and I asked ddDH if he would pick her up, and bring her to ours. She rang her DP, and the row carried on at our home, then into the street, with her kicking all my neighbours' cars.

We're no longer friends.

My STBXH has rapid-cycling bipolar and BPD. It has been exhausting. He was a good and loving person when we met and married but he later betrayed me and gaslighted me and, worst of all, accused me of emotionally abusing him and sexually assaulting him. He truly believed I had - to the point where he was getting counselling from a male abuse survivors' charity. He left my life and my heart in shreds. In his eyes I became the cause of his unhappiness and insecurities. And yet I was still the person he turned to when he was suicidal, begging me to help him even after he had left me for someone else (and of course I helped him - I loved him and he's the father of my child).

We co-parent. We no longer spend time together as a family because we tried that and he lied to me again and again. Not that he actually believed he was doing anything wrong. I care about his wellbeing and I hate that he has to suffer these illnesses. But I'm also relieved that I no longer live with it day to day.