I can't stand my DSis - how do I stop it from consuming me?

[TruffleHeart]

I strongly dislike my Sister and it's becoming all consuming.

We fell out last year after she behaved in an appalling way. It was then that I realized that she's just a deeply unpleasant person. She's shallow, controlling, manipulative and nasty. I have nothing in common with her. To add to that, she puts me down and belittles me whenever she gets the opportunity, constantly rolling her eyes and making jibes about me under her breath when we're in company.

Trouble is, she has a DD who I adore. I have to stay in touch with her to be able to spend time with DN. She is a lazy parent, and I worry about DNs upbringing, but I daren't say anything to her or she will bite my head off.

My parents are deeply worried about her, but they support and enable her bad behaviour because they love her. They parent DN more than she does. Occasionally they will admit to me that they disapprove of her behaviour, but other times they will refuse to hear a bad word against her.

I find myself constantly comparing myself to her, and seething silently. Occasionally I rant to my DM, but it always ends in an argument. I know that it's the wrong thing to do.

Last week I achieved something big in work, and really made a difference. I posted about it on FB with some pictures, and told my friends about it in the pub because I was so chuffed. Later on, I asked my DN whether her Mum had told her what I'd done (it's to do with something that interests DN), and she said "Oh yeah Mum said Aunty Truffle was going on about it". That was it - she fucking disparaged me to my DN.

DN has recently developed an attitude problem. She answers back to me and calls me names (she's 8). I won't stand for it, but I recognize all of the disparaging things that she says to me as stuff that she has heard her mother say. She knows me and her mother don't like each other, and this is how she is expressing it.

Meanwhile today, I've opened my Facebook to see yet another attention seeking selfie from her, with the obligatory 'You look lovely hun' comments. She's so fucking narcissistic it drives me nuts.

How do I let go, step back, and stop caring about the fucking car crash that is her life. It's eating away at me and I know it's not healthy.

To be fair to them, they feel huge guilt when they bail her out and always offer to give me the equivalent money. I always refuse but my DM usually insists on it anyway. Like with this holiday they're taking her on next week - they have offered to give me the same money that they're spending on her. I don't want it. But them giving it to me will ease their guilt I spose.

I have invested the money they've given me in the past, and it's that money that I use for holidays etc. But then I get told I'm tight, because I still have it and haven't blown it all. I can't win.

I have told my parents that they're enabling her. And it's not just financially. She's actually in a destructive, sordid and mentally abusive relationship with a married man. My parents know about it, and have actually encouraged and condoned it by indulging in gossip and giggling about him, joining in with her slagging off his wife, looking after DN while she meets him and perpetuating her lies for her. I think her addiction to this mentally abusive man is contributing to her mental illness, and have told them that their encouragement of this relationship is enabling her. I equate it to them buying alcohol for an alcoholic, or sitting by while a heroin addict shoots up. That's how I see it.

I'm actually wondering, having seen all this written down, whether writing a letter to them might hit home. Seeing it like this really brings home the stark reality of it all. But I don't know what it would achieve - and it would probably just perpetuate the drama...

There is no stigma attached to counselling; lots of people have it for all sorts of reasons. But you don't have to tell anyone you're having counselling if you don't want one. To get counselling, you could ask your GP if there are any free/low cost counselling services available to you, or you could find a qualified private counsellor using a website such as www.itsgoodtotalk.org.uk.

I suggested the Stately Homes thread firstly because there is a list of useful books and other resources at the beginning, secondly because I thought it would be reassuring for you to see that you are not alone, others have been through similar and come out the other side.

if you don't want to

I think it might be worth a letter, but think twice about sending it. Writing it down in letter form helps clarify a situation in your mind, often.

Sending it to them probably won't achieve much though. They are too invested in supporting her. It's a double whammy; they'd have to acknowledge that the support they've given her so far is excessive, and they'd also have to see their loved daughter go downhill. Withdrawing is what they should do, but they almost certainly won't. Can always try though!

I do think that you need to stand up to them more. If they offer you money - take it. Give it to a charity if you want to. But I think that 1) it's fair to take the money and that matters a lot because right now, your sister gets preferential treatment and that's not good for her or you and 2) if they have to give out double money every time they support her, they might start to think twice.

But I think most of all you need to stand up to them. Make comments about "what dad, you'd like me in deep debt too?" or whatever sits comfortably with you. But don't just take all this sniping.

I do suspect this pattern goes back many years; them favouring her over you. I think that in the long run, you need to face the grief that they have not behaved fairly to you both. (proviso; I could be extrapolating far too far and Im sure they can be lovely too. But the concrete incidents you've written down here are really bad, especially the drink-driving and the shutting DN out. If your sister injures or kills someone then I'm afraid that the people who knew and did nothing also carry a part of the responsibility. I mean this nicely, but that does include you too ).

You sound very 'in each other's pockets' - would moving slightly further away be possible for you?
You could still see DN and your parents on a regular basis.

Hide her on Facebook.
Don't talk about flash-point topics
Be more neutral - don't share too much.

I agree about reporting her anonymously - I would.

Truffle

re your comment:-
"I'm actually wondering, having seen all this written down, whether writing a letter to them might hit home".

No it will not; infact a letter from you could well fan the flames already present. They will take all your words here and turn on you with real ferocity, particularly your dad and your bystander of a mother will back him up for her own reasons. Such disordered of thinking people like your parents always are up for a fight and always want the last word. Write it all down but DO NOT send what you write to them.

Look into BACP as well re therapy; finding someone highly versed in the ways of narcissistic family structures could help you no end. I would also read "Children of the Self Absorbed" written by Nina W Brown.

You mention being 'in the same circles' - is there any change you could make there?

God, no. Completely agree with Attilla. If you put this in writing they will actively look for reasons for misinterpret it and you will have it thrown back at you forever. They cannot be made to see what they do not wish to see.

You really do need to see less of all of your family. What comes across strongly is how desperate you are for their approval. It will never happen - because they are not capable of that.

However .. haven't you posted about this before? There was a poster with a sister who was having an affair with a married man (whilst still married) and the parents were basically egging her on because the MM was perceived to have a higher social standing than the poor sod of a DH. That poster was very deeply enmeshed in all the family dysfunction and regularly told she had to "be there" for her fuckup of a sister come what may, because presenting the façade of family unity was all that mattered.

MaybeDoctor's comment was what made me think of it - that poster was in a group based around a hobby that meant she had to see parents and sister all the time, it was very unhealthy.

Anyway, back to your case - you want to know how to stop it consuming you but you won't start by blocking her on FB. You will have to take some painful steps if you actually want to get away from this situation.

You sound so enmeshed in each other's lives, each so desperate to put the other down, including to your parents, in order to be the favoured child and make the other the black sheep, because you've fallen out.

Your posts sound so conflicted. You say you don't like bragging at all, and that she's a bragger, but then you post about your work achievements on Facebook (which is bragging) and then get annoyed that you didn't get the response from your sister via niece that you wanted.

You're both bringing out the worst in each other. And running to tell tales on each other to your parents. And your parents are egging you on. It's a really toxic setup.

I think you really need to step back.

The website I shared is the BACP one, btw.

And I agree with what everyone has said about needing to disengage and distance yourself (emotionally if not physically as well).

Thanks everyone for your wise words. I have been away on holiday which has really helped give me some perspective on the whole situation.

My sister still pisses me off and I worry about her lots, but my holiday gave me the headspace I needed. I need to remember how good that feels, and give myself time away from her when it all gets too much.

Yesterday I spent the day with my DM, and decided not to say anything about my sister. I had considered laying it all out to DM, but just thought it would spark everything off again both with DM but also in my head, so I decided to let it lie. However, if her behaviour escalates, I might just tell DM what I know about my sister's continued engagement with this mentally destructive MM, so that they know what they're dealing with and are under no illusions.

But for now - I have relative peace. I've realized that what she does and how my DPs react to it are not relevant. What is relevant is how I deal with it.

Well it has escalated as I suspected it might.

Sister's behaviour has deteriorated to nasty rabid sniping at me, and 'telling on me' to DM. And yes, she is in her 40s not a child. This is a pattern of behaviour that I have seen on multiple occasions - it is a symptom of her rapidly deteriorating mental health when she is involved with MM. She becomes secretive, defensive, nasty and appears quite unwell. Of course she insists she knows what she's doing and is totally in control, when it's quite clear to everyone who knows her that she isn't.

She later apologized with a long drawn out text, and I resisted the urge to engage, and simply replied 'OK, hope you're ok'. To which she replied "I will be". She's goading me into asking more about her situation, which I don't want to do.

I am now thoroughly conflicted - I feel terribly worried about her, but at the same time I dislike her even more intensely for her continued awful behaviour. I want to go to DM and tell her everything that I think about my sister's behaviour, including the destructive relationship that I suspect she has resumed. I feel that getting it off my chest and making DM aware and prepared might be the thing to do.

But I know from experience that it always triggers an argument with DM. She is fully aware of what her daughter is like, and I suspect she is thoroughly ashamed and worried about her. But she will never admit that to me, and gets defensive and critical of me when I try to bring it up. It never ends well, it always ends with me crying and feeling even more shut out.

Other than staying away from them - which isn't always possible, and further isolates me from my family - can anyone please help me with some coping strategies. I need stock answers to my sister's passive aggressive behaviour, and stock answers to give my mother when she's defending her. I feel like something like "Sis is engaged in a self-destructive behaviour pattern. She needs counselling and professional help, I can't help her"

I am sick and tired of always being the scapegoat here. I want a normal relationship with my parents that isn't poisoned by her nastiness.

Don't. Get. Involved.

You are "telling on her" too, just like she has done to you.

Don't speak to your parents about her. No good will come of it. They will not see the situation the way you want them to and you'll just get even more frustrated.

OK so my stock answer should be "I'm not getting involved" on repeat.

I know. I just find it so hard to do.

I've spent the day feeling upset and angry. It's not healthy.

Bluntly?

You are a grown up.

You are an individual.

You are no longer a child, relying on mum and dad for everything.

You have a DH who thinks you are a valuable, lovable, fully functioning adult.

STOP TRYING TO LIVE LIKE A CHILD! Life is not fair, Your DPs and DSIS have a co-dependent relationship and you don't like it, feel excluded, pissed off, angry, childish, maybe jealous of some aspects of it. But bloody hell it sounds smothering.

And, you sounds just as bad - make DM aware, get her prepared? Do you really think your DPs are clueless? Do you always seek to be the fixer, the sensible one? Is that your family role?

Reduce contact and concentrate on you and your DH - your future, your health and happiness.

And no, that shouldn't be your stock answer. You don't need one cos you won't be anywhere near them to hear anything they say - so no response required

Good luck applying some TLC to yourself.

I know it's poor form but I was thinking of quoting from a thread I started a long time ago when I was up to my neck in my horrific family.

I've decided not to quote myself but what amazes me is how much further on I am 5 years later. Maybe we have to go through the death throes in gory detail to get it out of our system. That is, it is a process.

You've started that process by moving away. You're still up to your neck in their shenanigans but that will gradually die off as you take more and more steps to protect yourself . Agonisingly slowly, mind. Sorry

You want to talk to your parents, to make them see ' what she's like '. But it's they who directly created her like that ; she is a direct product of what they have done to her. And you. Painful to read the torturous agony of trying to Get Them To See. They will NEVER see. They are too invested in precisely how things are.

Like your mother, my mother has at least some idea of decency and fairness which she unstintingly follows. The fact she plays it out on the top of a veritable MOUNTAIN of dysfunction is a bit of a headfuck... but I suppose it's better than nothing, in its way. Eg there are plenty of parents who indulge the golden child who have no intention of being fair to their other children.

Anyway, I'm glad to report I am entirely out of the loop now. Completely free of their insane, endless goings on. I am NC with vile siblings bit see my parents fairly regularly bcs they're ancient and frail. The (lifetime, agonising) storm has passed - at long last.

That's not to say I don't have to be on my guard with my parents - they will never be safe. I actually winced when I read you spent the day with your mum. Instead of having to go away on holiday to get out of the loop, try practising it at home by seeing them less and for shorter times. Because it is they who have set up this horrible, damaging dynamic between you and your sister - and they are heavily invested in keeping it going ad infinitum. I can't stress enough that they will NEVER see what they have done. The only one who will make adjustments is you re: you accept it (and keep your distance for your sanity) or you step away entirely. What will never work is you trying to Get Them To See. They will never see ; and you will get even more bloodied until you snuff yourself out if you keep trying.

Bloody painful mind

Read the books, do the (essential when victims of families like ours) therapy. Money well spent. Actually, priceless.

God that's exactly what I needed to read, thank you for the plain speaking.

I won't go NC with my parents, I love them and DN and it's too painful to cut them out. I did consider it when things were at their worst and decided it would be too much.

I will cut down contact, and try try try never to discuss my Sister. My DM doesn't actually want to discuss DSis with me, because as soon as I criticize her she gets a cat's bum mouth and shuts down. So it should be possible for me to just never discuss her...

I will try. Try. Try.

No you won't

You will not try!

You will succeed

Well yes. But when you find out what's behind what they do, and have done, you won't have to try at all. It will come naturally.

You have to do done therapy.

Do some ffs

I have no idea how to even approach therapy - can someone give me some pointers?

My parents aren't bad people, they're good hearted. But they've just raised, and encouraged my sister in this behaviour

Association of Counselors and Psychotherapists [[http://www.bacp.co.uk]]

Have a good read of the site to know what to expect in therapy, click 'Find a therapist' to get a list of therapists in your area. Do your research, whittle your list down to those you like the sound of ; contact /call them. Arrange to meet and interview a number (most offer a first session free or at a reduced rate).

You have to click with a therapist. This is vital. They may look good on paper but if you don't click you're wasting your (and their) time. Just like any relationship tbh.

Oops

BACP