Blow up with martyr complex mum

[Mamaka]

Lots of history with my mum from when we were growing up. Dad was physically abusive and mum turned a blind eye. I've grown up to see her unfortunately as weak and a bit of a martyr. She gets her self esteem from looking after everyone else but herself, in fact it seems she likes to run herself down a bit so everyone will tell her how hard she works and how strong a person she is. You get the picture, yes I know how bitter I sound.

She looks after my 2 dc 2 days a week, it will go down to 1 dc 2 days a week as my eldest has just gone to school. I've pulled her up before on her lack of boundaries with them and also for undermining me (talking over me when I arrive and am sorting them out, telling them to get ready etc) she improves for a bit then goes back to how she was. I can't afford to pay for childcare, it wouldn't be worth me working and I also want to facilitate the dc's relationship with her.

Today she was changing my very tired 2 year old's nappy and he was kicking her arms so she couldn't do it. I asked her to let me take over and she said no she was fine. She then continued to struggle and get kicked. I said again, let me do it he's tired, she said in a snippy voice no I'll do it and carried on, holding my son's leg quite roughly, so I got up and grabbed the nappy and sort of barged her out the way. She tripped over a box of books on the floor but didn't fall and didn't hurt herself, she just stumbled and then huffed oh for goodness sake and went to pick up my dd, who really didn't need to be picked up. After I'd put them in the car I asked her if she would have ignored any other parent asking her to let them do their kid's nappy. She didn't answer but sort of blustered about saying things like I was only trying to help and you're overreacting. I got angry and shouted at her that she was always undermining me and disrespecting me as a parent and she shut the door and told me to stop shouting. I think all she was thinking about was if the neighbours could hear. She said she would never have spoken to her mum like that at my age and I said she needed to stop trying to portray herself as "good" and better than everyone just because she never gets angry.

Eventually I left. I didn't feel bad immediately afterwards but now I feel awful, guilty, anxious and ungrateful. But then I think, she's got me right where she wants me hasn't she?! Indebted to her eternally and never able to pull her up on anything because she looks after my dc and is the mother Theresa of her village.

Sorry this got so long.
Did I overreact? If so, how can I deal with it better next time? If not, what do I do to stop it happening again?

[Froginapan]

Why do you not want to feel 'indebted' to her? Is there a particular reason? Would she hold it over you in some way?

If not then I think it was a very nice gesture and her trying to do what she can now.

Have you ever heard of The Laundry List? Give it a google if not.

[TulipStream]

Personally I think it sounds like you were quite nasty! Pushing someone and shouting at them, just because they're struggling a little with changing a diaper - not a normal reaction at all. Unless she'd been really winding you up before hand and you snapped. But all that happened is you said you'd take over twice and she said no / carried on. She was already in the middle of changing him, probably done it plenty of times when he's been in a tired mood - since she has them two days a week.

It sounds like you realllllly resent her and will always view her negatively due to your childhood, no matter how helpful or kind she is now being.

She was probably a victim of your dads abuse herself.

[Pimmmms]

Actually, i think you sound like someone who has never been given a 'voice'. You have never been able to be truly honest wih your mum just how much you were physicaly and emotionaly abused, because she would just walk away, turn away, shut the door on you etc. Combined with the 'martyr' element i think you do extremely well just being civil towards her tbh.

[Lottapianos]

OP, you have had a shocking time on here from some people. She's your mum, she loves you really, she only wants to help etc . No. That is not what you are feeling. You said yourself you don't feel that she is genuine with you, that she tries to take over and undermine you as a mother, that she wants to parade her grandchildren around so that she looks like a wonderful granny.

You are not damaged goods or awful or anything else negative. You are extremely angry, and you are aware of that. I totally understand why you feel that way. People telling you to 'grow up', 'move on', 'let it go' clearly don't have a clue - luckily for them. You are a grown adult but in your relationship with your mother, you are still that frightened child who was let down very badly. You have every right to feel angry with her. She expects you to sweep the past under the carpet because its more convenient for her that way, but with no thought to where that leaves you.

I have similar experiences with my own parents ( anger, boundary issues) and the way forward for me has been distance and detachment. I would seriously consider not using her for childcare any more. I also agree with other posters that you need professional support with coming to terms with your feelings about your past - that's not a criticism, I've been in therapy myself. You are dealing with a huge amount of hurt and anger, all of it entirely understandable, and that's not easy to do alone. As Attila suggested, look at the BACP website to find psychotherapists in your area, some offer sessions at reduced rates based on your income. Attend sessions by yourself, not with your mother.

[HateSummer]

You pushed your mother out of the way when she was trying to change your child's nappy, so you wouldn't have to do it when you got home?

I'm sorry, I don't know the full story here, but you sound like a bully. She looked after your child all day and then you shout at her for "undermining" you?! She was trying to change a fucking nappy .

If you resent her so much then don't leave your kids with her. There's plenty of us out there who have no free childcare and manage to pay for it, even though it's not worth it. You're just using her and bullying her from what I can see. What a horrible daughter you are. Probably just like your dad.

[Mamaka]

Frog - no I've never seen her handle him roughly before. In fact it shocked me as she is normally overly soft so I thought maybe she was at the end of her tether or something. I guess seeing her handle him roughly triggered me into leaping up and forcefully taking over. (Maybe because I feel this is what she should have done when my dad was pushing us around?!)

[HateSummer]

So what exactly am I looking for? And what might my boundaries with her look like?

Well you can start with finding alternative childcare that you pay for .

[Froginapan]

'Probably just like your dad'

That was completely uncalled for.

[Lottapianos]

No you don't know the full story Hate. Read the full thread. It wasn't just about the nappy

[HateSummer]

Anyone who has changed a toddlers nappy knows how hard it can be to keep their legs still sometimes. You have to grip both legs with one hand and hold tight. That's not being rough...instead of pushing her out the way she could have waited.

[HateSummer]

Sorry, I'll leave the thread now, but it's absolutely disgusting you push your mum and shout at her and claim free childcare. If you hate her so much, then go nc. Don't use her and don't leave your kids with someOne you obviously dislike.

[DailyMailPenisPieces]

I think you are feeling appropriately angry with her and I agree with PP who said that you should consider counselling or therapy. I don't think your mum will 'get' it - but you need to work this anger out. Maybe your Dr could refer you if money is tight?

[nicknameinvalid123]

This is a complicated situation and some replies are over-simplifying it in different ways. I think lavender's post was very good.
Yes-you do have a right to be angry. Your mother let you down. She also was probably doing the best she could at the time and was the victim of abuse herself.

It is unfair to tell you to grow up and be grateful. It is also unfair to say that she is a deplorably bad parent and would also be a bad grandparent. It sounds as if she does love you and wants to support you.

Are you sure that she is being a martyr or does she enjoy spending time with the grandchildren and you?

How do people know that she wouldn't be open to seeing a therapist with you?Have you asked her? Have you tried to talk to her about the past when you are feeling calm? Is she in denial or is she open to talking about it?

Also-I wonder how you feel about your father.

I think that you would both benefit from professional help to work on the relationship-but its very important to find the right person. I would take Lavender's advice.

[quicklydecides]

Op I think you need to take your children out of this toxic soup.
What you do after that is between you and your mother but all least the harm won't continue to the next generation.
Stop using her for childcare.

[Cisoff]

It's really complex Mamaka, I don't know what to advise. I've been in your shoes, though mum didn't end up with a martyr complex and I was fortunate enough to be able to afford paid care, but yes, it's hard to forgive.

I rationalise it by acknowledging she was a product of her time, with much less power than I'd have should I find myself in the same situation. She did the best she could, with the resources she had. I just made a decision to let it all go.

She's dead now and I'm at peace with it, but it took a while. We never discussed it, but I know she had regrets. I think without acknowledging it, we both took the 'what's done is done' approach.

[Lottapianos]

Dear god Hate, it was not about the nappy! And the response you got from the OP was entirely justified. Read the full thread and engage your brain before replying next time

[Mamaka]

Frog - I am the laundry list describes my mum and the other laundry list describes me!

[A11TheSmallTh1ngs]

Mamaka

Repost on AIBU or chat. I'm serious. You sound trapped in guilt, obligation and fear and you have a lot of anger to work out towards your mother, which is completely fair. She has a parental responsibility to you and failed. When a child is abused BOTH PARENTS have to take some responsibility.

The Relationships board is full of women who left abusive relationships so they are always going to defend the "mother" in this situation. They can't accept the truth that they failed their own children which is why they are calling you an abuser and a bully. In their mind, the only true victim was them and their children are "just like their father" if they dare complain.

This is helpful to see because it's basically the same martyr syndrome your mum has!

Find alternative care ASAP and go read up on dealing with neglectful passive parents. Stay away from the relationships board! If you follow the advice on this thread, you'll never have a healthy equal relationship with your mother. You'll always feel angry and unhappy but obligated to give access to your grandchildren.that is what they want. The women here are your enemy, not your friend.

[Mamaka]

Lotta - thanks for your understanding.
Nickname - I used to hate my father with the same kind of rage I currently have for my mum. Fortunately he took the decision to go NC a few years ago which has made me arrive at a peaceful feeling of detachment. He is nothing to me. I can see though that I've transferred that rage over to my mum who is less deserving of it.

[Froginapan]

A11 - as a survivor of DV I can wholeheartedly disagree with you there.

[Lottapianos]

Another DV survivor here - I completely relate to the OP's situation and have told her that she is completely justified to feel the way she does.

[Mamaka]

A11 - thank you! I hadn't thought of it like that!
I absolutely support any woman who is taking steps to remove herself and dc from an abusive relationship. I know how much courage it takes and how many attempts end before they've even begun.
But to do nothing and continue blindly.....is unforgivable in my eyes.

[gonetoseeamanaboutadog]

I think there is too much crap here for a child care arrangement to work. Probably too much crap for the two of you to be close as well.

She did a terrible thing in not protecting you. You don't need to feel OK about it. You will naturally feel the disconnect between her public image and your own experience of her. You will naturally feel deep down that she is an unfit care giver because you experienced her as unfit.

You see her being treated like a victim and a saint and it puts salt in the wound because the truth is that you were the most vulnerable party and, far from being a saint, she was complicit in your abuse. I'm not sure that damage is ever going to go and I would lower my expectations.

You should explain your feelings calmly in a way that won't leave you guilty. She should have an opportunity to be heard.

What is toxic is that so much damage has occurred and you're all trying to have a relationship as if it hasn't. As if your dad was the only perpetrator here and now he's gone you can all be friends. But it's not that simple.

[Mamaka]

And not all women are defending my mother. I have had some wonderful advice on support on here but may consider reposting if I feel brave enough.