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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Feeling stifled by parents 'love' - need to set firm boundaries. LONG!!

79 replies

BusyHomemaker · 24/07/2016 17:31

I don't really know where to start with this as there is a lot of background but I shall give it a go.

I am at a point in my adult life whereby I have finally snapped and realised that I need to establish some strong boundaries for my parents (and possibly whole family) otherwise my emotional well being will suffer. They have always been generous, loving parents who would drop everything to help me if needed. I have always had the unsettling feeling that they live their lives through their offspring (now all in our 30s) and I don't see how this is a healthy dynamic for anyone involved. Despite being the oldest, my parents have always been more relaxed with their rules for my brother and sister. I still feel that I am expected to tow the line. I always consider their feelings in everything I do, which is crazy! I am my own person but I can't seem to gain the independence that I crave.

There is a lot of background to this but briefly, I left my exH over four years ago due to EA, I was at a real low point emotionally and suffered terrible anxiety. I worked hard to rebuild my life and my confidence and following a 2yr course of citalopram (which I've been off for 18m) and two courses of counselling, I better understand myself and have been feeling stronger than ever for well over a year. I'm in a great relationship and have a job which I enjoy. DD is happy and I am so proud of her. On the outside it looks like I have a fabulous relationship with my family but it is just stifling. People always comment on how close we are but the truth is we a much to close. We have a facebook messaging group ffs! I never meant to settle in my home town but we are here and so the only way to create some distance with my family is to set some firm boundaries. I know what needs to be done but I feel so guilty about hurting my parents feelings. I feel like a pathetic child right now!

During my counselling I confided that I found my parents to be controlling and stifling and my counselor told me these are really strong words. I was so confused that I had ended up with an EA man but delving a little deeper I realised that DF (who can be incredibly engaging and lovely most of the time) has at times displayed these characteristics to my DM. At that time he was making her miserable but they've since worked it out. He can be controlling and this past year I have realised that he tries to manipulate me on all of my decisions.... everything from how to maintain my garden to my fertility! And I know he is aware he is doing it, I just don't think that he's realised that I am now aware of it too. My mother is excellent at laying on the guilt to the point where she practically pleads with me to do things her way. They are not constantly like this, they also dish out the praise... a little OTT sometimes. This is lacking a lot of detail but I just want to give an overview without losing anyone!

I am aware of my own faults in all of this. They are very involved with DD and she adores them. I do speak with them too often, mainly updates on DD, and I realise I depend on them emotionally. The thing is I often come away from our conversation feeling guilty or stressed. A bit like a child who hasn't had the opportunity to explain themselves properly! I am a classic people pleaser but it's gone too far for too long.

My sister can be a real b@tch. She has done some really rotten things to me in the past, like sabotage important life events, humiliated me in front of my friends and lectured me on my life choices.... "you are still in rented accommodation because of your poor life choices not because you were in an EA marriage and had to start again" was a classic! My friends and DP don't like her and don't understand why I keep in touch. I do it because my parents have literally pleaded with me "it's so important that sisters are friends, please get on with her it's so important for you and for us that you get along. If you don't get on it will break our hearts. We've invested too much.... I've been losing sleep over this." My counselor explained we are opposite people and I relayed this to my mother but to no avail. She seems to be in cahoots with them at the mo, which is not the status quo as she has really hurt them in the past. It's her talent!

My brother has just returned from a year away... literally turned up with his wife on parents doorstep one afternoon while everyone thought they were still on the other side of the planet!? I've spoken with him a couple of times since, in attempt to arrange to meet up and I was told "I'm busy for the next week pretend I'm not here!" It was a bit abrupt but I respected his wishes. The next night my sister and her family were round my parents with my brother and his wife for a BBQ that my family wasn't invited to. Without going into details (this is already an essay) it was clearly orchestrated by my sister to leave me out. I'm used to her doing this but I've always been close to my brother so this one hurt. God this seems so petty!

I expressed my feelings that my family should have been invited us and clearly that was a mistake because I've gone against the tribe! DB and DS haven't spoken with me and I received an incredibly patronising and manipulative email from parents demanding an apology. So far this seems incredibly petty but I'll now get to the point...

I am involved in a very serious court case at the moment. It's been going on for a year. I stopped contact between DD and ex-H as her behaviour became increasingly challenging and she seemed drained and emotionally exhausted for days following contact. Aware of exH's EA and MH issues I don't take chances. At this time his then Girlf contacted me (we had met once) for help as he was abusing her and she was scared. She needed advice. She contacted the police. It was very serious harassment and manipulation. I took DD to GP to see nurse for check over due to concerns over EA and she had an infection down below. Nurse told me she had been sexually abused. This is a parents worst nightmare. We were referred to SS and DP (my rock) and I stayed strong and did what we had to do. Of course I updated my parents and eventually sis and bro. Parents have been supportive but it's been hard on them. ExH took me to court over contact, we've been battling it out since last summer. I was advised to drop allegations of sexual harm due to lack of evidence (non of the professionals were willing to provide statements), which I did but I haven't dropped allegations of EA. They now have contact supported by family. It's a very complex case and been incredibly testing but I have managed to stay strong (I've had my wobbles) and maintain stability for DD. Throughout the process I have continued to feel undermined by my parents need to take over to the point where they are adding stress. We have the penultimate hearing this week, the other side are asking for unsupervised overnights. I told my parents I am contesting the cafcass report, applying for a full psychological analysis and hiring a barrister for the final hearing. They know money is tight due to legal fees. The email they sent told me they expected an apology for the other day, that I shouldn't take my stress out on those who love me unconditionally and they are going to provide "a little bit of money to secure the best future for DD. We will cover the cost of everything." That's thousands of pounds, not a little bit of money. I was fuming! I didn't ask for money and they know it's my archilies heal.

They sent me another message the following day asking if DD and I wanted to stay over. I replied that I needed some space. They then sent further messages at 1am (they stay up drinking most nights and get themselves worked up about all sorts of issues) demanding information that they could have googled themselves. They then told me they are going to pay for Barrister. "You don't have that kind of money." I thanked them for their offer but told them I couldn't accept. They told me they wanted to help. I told them "Don't worry, I am handling it". "Don't push us away!" It's just too much. Why can't they just give me some space.

This probably doesn't make them seem as bad as I feel that they are. They are stifling me at a point in my life where I very much need to act like a grown up. How do I get them to understand this? I'm at breaking point with our relationship but don't want to hurt them.

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BusyHomemaker · 26/07/2016 20:12

Thank you for the supportive messages and words of wisdom. I agree with PPs and it's a comfort to read. Although it's quite startling to learn this is a common situation.

DM has just sent a rather strange message asking if I want DF to pick DD up from nursery due to court. Absolutely no acknowledgement of my previous message Confused

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Lottapianos · 26/07/2016 20:15

My parents do that too - erase history and move on with some unrelated comment. Stand firm.

BusyHomemaker · 26/07/2016 20:18

It's bizarre, isn't?

It's angered me actually, not just because they have completely ignored what I said previously but because there's the assumption I haven't planned for DD. It's belittling my ability to parent!

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Lottapianos · 26/07/2016 20:21

It's a two pronged offensive! My parents see me as some kind of feeble minded pathetic creature rather than a perfectly functional adult who can think for herself. I think they can't really accept that I'm not a baby anymore and wholly dependent on them. It used to drive me utterly mad but I find it easier now to see it as their issue and their problem. I'm actually doing ok and so are you Smile

K00lcat · 27/07/2016 00:30

Have you considered moving away, several 100 miles away ?

BusyHomemaker · 27/07/2016 16:16

^ Ha ha, before I met DP that was my plan. It is my dream to someday move to Cornwall...

Lottapianos Flowers

Court went well, he had a Barrister but didn't get anywhere. Over nights have not been granted at this stage but we have the final hearing over two days in Autumn and that will be tough. Feeling ready for it though.

On the family side of things it's all gone a bit (more) bizarre! My parents have been messaging offering to collect DD as if nothing has happened, despite me asking for space and then ignoring their messages. Then DM messaged asking how today went. I gave her a brief update and then said that I find it strange that DM and DF have ignored my previous message telling them that I was hurt. She replied with "we're hurting too... I've tried calling... my heart is breaking... I feel so sad... I have never wished more than I have this last week to have my mum back to talk to her about this" Wow. Not quite sure what to say to all of that. I feel terrible that she is so upset but at the same time I've reached breaking point.

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Lottapianos · 27/07/2016 16:46

It's all about her/ them, isn't it? You're not allowed to be hurting, you're not allowed to have feelings, it's all about her and her broken heart. People like this are toddlers emotionally - zero empathy and desperately needy for attention and reassurance. Your mother's message is designed to guilt trip you into dropping everything and running to make her feel better. I would just ignore her message, no response at all.

BusyHomemaker · 27/07/2016 17:02

I literally have no idea what I would say anyway! It seems totally OTT but then typical of my mother.

It's not that I don't feel guilty anymore, I just recognise that this isn't normal and that I need some space to breathe.

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BusyHomemaker · 27/07/2016 17:02

They want to speak on the phone but I can't see that ending well!

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SeaEagleFeather · 27/07/2016 17:17

Then DM messaged asking how today went. I gave her a brief update and then said that I find it strange that DM and DF have ignored my previous message telling them that I was hurt. She replied with "we're hurting too... I've tried calling... my heart is breaking... I feel so sad... I have never wished more than I have this last week to have my mum back to talk to her about this" Wow. Not quite sure what to say to all of that.

I think you're going to either have to stand strong and NOT answer her messages or give her a fair warning: "please give me the space I have asked for very clearly. Otherwise I will have to go unavailable for 2 weeks" or whatever length of time. Then do actualy contact her after those weeks; keep to what you said.

By answering her, you are reinforcing her belief that pressuring you will get results. You need to hold to what you say; to actually put those boundaries up.

She sounds a high pressure drama mother, so you may get the pressure ramped up or flying monkeys. But she will eventually accept it .. and tbh probably have a bit more respect for you because it doesn't sound like she has all that much for you atm, hidden under the guise of blanket-love thrown over your head.

What you are doing, making space and carving out your own boundaries, is healthy. Never forget that.

ChanelNo314 · 27/07/2016 17:28

I'd update her in a factual way about court, but sign off with a 'breezy' way, ''like I said, we'll chat next week"

Emotional abuse is so hard to prove. I think you should move heaven and earth to make sure that the GP found evidence of sexual abuse in your dd. Do not let that go. I'm worried for you. I know that I was pressured to just let the EA go, and I did, because it can't be proved, so it didn't happen.

ChanelNo314 · 27/07/2016 17:29

You're hurting because they excluded you from the bbq
They're hurting because........... you wouldn't hide your upset.

ChanelNo314 · 27/07/2016 17:37

My parents were the same back in January when I tried to establish a boundary. They were so 'hurt'. The script was 'please respect our right to talk down to you''. Argh. I told them that they were confusing gratitude with obedience. they told me I was spoilt and tantruming and a brat. And all of that was SO upsetting to hear! I'm in my 40s. But they were the ones who were upset. I felt sick

BusyHomemaker · 27/07/2016 19:49

SeaEagleFeather that's very sound advice. I shall try not to contact them. It's confusing dealing with people when they are acting irrationally and I'll end up saying the wrong thing or not doing myself justice. The whole point of this is to command some respect from my parents and be able to have a dignified relationship with them.

Chanel Our parents sound incredibly similar! They still see themselves as authority figures in their adult children's lives. To be obeyed at all times!

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SeaEagleFeather · 27/07/2016 20:03

we're hurting too... I've tried calling... my heart is breaking... I feel so sad.

She hasn't answered your first comment at all has she? that you are hurt about the BBQ. Lots of pressure from her, and lots of emphasis on her hurt, but no attention at all to your original reason for asking for distance.

springydaffs · 27/07/2016 22:21

Blimey. Dysfunctional family or what!

My family is also a broiling mass of dysfunction - completely boundariless? tick. Astonishingly charming to everyone else? tick. Tick also for ending up in a very toxic marriage to a horrifying abuser. That's when I went into therapy and the whole sorry mess was gradually uncovered. Such a relief.

DO gen up on boundaries. There is an excellent book called, unsurprisingly, Boundaries by Dr Henry Cloud. Be warned it is very christian but an excellent book, well-respected in the recovery community.

Talking of which, welcome to recovery! It's not just addicts who are in recovery; also those of us mashed up in our chaotic, toxic families.

Toxic sister? Tick. Two, actually. Lucky me not . I can't even be bothered to tell the stories - there are so many! On and on and on, never ending. I have cut contact with my siblings - big sigh of relief as I type that, utter joy to knock them on the head for good - but not my parents. It takes a long time, a lot of work (therapy), support groups, endless reading, but you get there. I'm there and my parents are afraid of me now, in a way. They know I'll hold to my boundaries if they muck about.

Glad someone brought up the drinking - imo that's at the core of this. Alcoholics are complete chaos to be around. Endless chaos (feel like I have to open a window to breathe at the thought!)

springydaffs · 27/07/2016 22:24

Didn't mean to type DO in caps! Just slow on the touch typing (or fast?)

ChanelNo314 · 28/07/2016 00:50

Yes, my xh, with him for 7 years, he was verbally emotionally and financially abusive. I only got together with him because that feeling of him being slightly disapproving the whole time and me feeling 'not enough' around him was familiar. He got worse though. My parents would obviously never have told me I was a bitch! But it just started out with a dynamic of me trying to be good enough for him. Yikes, I cringe now. I was only 29 then. Left him 9 years ago. Seems like lots on this thread ended up in abusive relationships.

BusyHomemaker · 28/07/2016 11:15

Chanel your ex sounds like a monster Angry

I'm starting to feel really guilty about my parents as they do a lot for me. The other week I had bad food poisoning and they looked after DD. I'm starting to wonder if I am in the wrong...

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RandomMess · 28/07/2016 12:28

No you are just suffering from FOG

Their help comes with strings attached...

Lottapianos · 28/07/2016 13:04

None of us are strangers to the FOG (fear, obligation, guilt). Its part and parcel of having parents like this. Remember - looking after your DD while you were ill was a nice thing to do, but that doesn't mean that you have to put up with endless amounts of their crap. They are your parents - they don't get a gold medal or any kind of free pass for behaving decently. You need to keep reminding yourself of that.

I honestly do know how it feels. Its only July and I have been worrying about where to spend Christmas for the past 2 weeks Confused Its almost Grin The impulse to put your parents' needs first, and the feeling that you 'owe' them, runs very very deep indeed. You can overcome it though. You are not in the wrong at all.

ChanelNo314 · 28/07/2016 18:28

He was!!

And like you, it's complicated because i know my parents arent perfect but they think they know whst's best for me. They genuinely do. They're not in to labelling emotions. They're not self-aware. They never had their parents around to help them as adults so they have experienced having their privacy / boundaries ignored.
It"s true they get upset when i reject their advice or try to withdraw or want a boundary but with them, it's not a tactic. They are genuinely upset because they dont see me for who i am.
A middle ground book for this stuff would be so helpful. Or an acknowledgement that your parents can be martyrs but not toxic.

ChanelNo314 · 28/07/2016 18:29

I mean they have not experienced

BusyHomemaker · 28/07/2016 19:41

I've been reading up on FOG. In some ways it resonates but it refers to dealing with people who have personality disorders so I'm not sure how relevant it is.

My parents also haven't experienced having their parents close by in their adulthood. They moved hundreds of miles away in their early twenties. DF has told me that his father was too controlling and that's one of the reasons they moved. Oh, the irony!

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BusyHomemaker · 28/07/2016 19:51

Just re-read that and I'm sorry it came across as quite abrupt! I do find the whole concept FOG interesting and am really appreciative of POts input. It actually great being able to talk about this her as only one friend in RL knows what's been going on (as in, really knows) but she's suffering with depression at the moment so I don't want to offload on her.

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