My brother is recreationally using heroin...

[GlitteryPomPoms]

I've NC for this thread.

I found out today that my brother (28 years old) uses heroin recreationally a couple of times a month.

He's single. He has no children. He has a good job and is doing well in his career. His use of heroin doesn't appear to be affecting his life.

I'm obviously worried this is going to spiral into addiction but he says he's been doing it for a few years, that he knows what he's doing to stop it becoming a problem and that anyway it's none of my business.

I don't know what I'm asking really. I guess, is it actually possible to recreationally use heroin? What can I or should I do to help him?

" Not sure about this but doesn't morphine/heroin create brain changes so that it makes you want more and more? "

anything you put into your body on a regular basis will do that . That is why there are so many obese people about - they are literally addicted to food.
Not that I wish to lessen the problem, dont get me wrong.

Not sure about this but doesn't morphine/heroin create brain changes so that it makes you want more and more?

Yes it does - I can't remember details, but the drug takes over from the brain and begins to control every vital function.
All the while demanding more and more H to keep the body working normally. It doesn't take too long for the body to be unable to function at all without the drug which is why withdrawal is so long and painful and so often unsuccessful.

Oyster - great post.

Coco, that is so sad :(

I struggle to see how anyone could justify heroin as OK. I don't know what you can do though, other than make it clear you disapprove and love him too much for him to go down that route.

I think taking opiates suppresses endogenous opiate production

After 2 or 3 times using heroin, you become addicted. Your brain stops making serotonin which controls your moods, as the heroin replaces that. Hence, you need heroin to feel 'normal'. And then the spiral of drug taking takes a grip. Heroin is not a recreational drug, and if your brother can now afford it, he will be able to buy it whenever. He is lying about it being twice a month, and he will need help to come off it.

You're right glass, taking heroin overwhelms the brain's receptors to the body's natural endorphines, so they shut down. That's why withdrawals are so painful.

The endorphine receptors do recover though, after a period of abstinence. But other factors come into play, like the habit itself. I've seen many people go through re-hab, "cured", but as soon as something triggers certain feelings, (can even be a birthday/xmas, or even a "reward" for remaining abstinent for a certain amount of time) the feelings of wanting to use can again kick in. But the more the brain goes through these "anniversaries/stressors, the feelings of wanting to use at these times wane.

After 2 or 3 times using heroin, you become addicted

It's guff like this that helps encourage people to become addicts Rebel. They don't become addicted after using a couple of times, so they think, "Oh, it's just propaganda about it being addictive."

It takes months of daily use.

" After 2 or 3 times using heroin, you become addicted. "

NO you do not.

I suppose there is a line, a point of no return and in theory you could stay on the right side of it but in actuality will you recognise it before it's too late, when you spot that line will your ability to apply the brakes be diminished?

Perhaps if life is going smoothly one could use occasionally but hit a crisis and the temptation to turn to that particular comfort blanket would be very strong I imagine.
All speculation on my part, I have no relevant experience

The number of people who can use heroin recreationally is minute.
Opiates are one of the most addictive things there is - the body has its own opioids which it produces naturally. That means our brains have specific opioid receptors so heroin hits several areas of the brain. It's basically a synthetic way of producing every sort of good feeling.
Tolerance build very quickly and dependence follows. The posters who've said that it's a subtle drug are bang on the money - it's insidious, it's like your brain being hijacked. The brain changes that occur result in both physical and psychological addiction.

I had the anaesthetic fail during my c section and they pumped me full of morphine. I can absolutely see why it's addictive and I found it quite terrifying.

Op, your brother isn't using recreationally. I guarantee it. And you don't have time, he needs professional help, immediately.

That's why it's referred to as "The every man's drug". As I said in an earlier post, it was sold a couple of centuries ago as a "healthful" panacea, like cigarettes were in the 1950s.

Takes all the pain away, (momentarily) then leaves you in a shit-storm.

But sadly Zaurak, OP's DB won't take the help whilst he's in a state of denial. He'll just learn how to lie/minimise more efficiently.

Especially believable when he's perceived as "functioning".

Please do PM me OP, if you wish.

A childhood friend died from an accidental overdose, and another was an addict through her 20s. The latter was from a very wealthy family so could afford her habit but it took her to a very dark place.

It's certainly not true that you need to take it daily for months to get addicted. Anymore than that is true of other class As or alcohol. It's more physically addictive than other drugs I've seen.

Hi everyone

Thanks for all of the comments and the wonderful video of nugget bird. I just wanted to save the lovely bird . Thanks for the personal stories as well; such sadness on here.

After I posted on Friday I didn't see or speak to my brother until Sunday. We don't have any regular arrangement for Sundays but I was worried as hell about him knowing he was using heroin on Saturday night. I kept thinking 'what if this is the dud batch' or 'what if tonight's the night he gets clumsy and ODs'. So I went to see him on Sunday morning at about 10am. He was up and dressed but still clearly high. If I didn't know about the heroin, I might not have guessed but once I knew about it, it was obvious. As you've all described, he was just chilled and happy. I tried to talk to him about it but he just kept avoiding and I didn't really feel like I was getting through anyway so I left (on good terms though).

I have text him today asking to have a chat. He text back with 'I know what you want to chat about. I'm fine. Don't worry about me. I know what I'm doing. Speak soon.'

I replied with 'What I found out on Friday really shocked me and I'm worried about you. I feel like I could help but you're not letting me. I'm here if you need me.'

He hasn't replied. I'm backing off now as he knows I'm there for him but doesn't want the help. I'm trying to put it out of my mind but it's tough.

I'll update soon.

I'm fine. Don't worry about me. I know what I'm doing

Oh dear. He won't listen to you, not at all :/ He doesn't -want- to.

glittery, time to hope that everything will be okay, but to plan for just in case it isn't. It might be an idea to read up on heroin addiction and the best ways that family can help, and to contact NA to ask their advice. I'm sorry :/ Hopefully he will be one of the very few who is ok.

SeaEagleFeather I've been reading up today. It's so scary, so many sad stories from addicts and their families.

Before I say too much and make you think I'm some kind of pro-opioid weirdo, I lost my father to heroin addiction.

I don't think it's quite as clear-cut as 'if you use heroin you'll become an addict and die'.

In the 1970's there was a series of tests called the Rat Park experiment. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_Park

They gave two separate sets of rats access to liquid morphine alongside access to water. The purpose of the experiment was to find out whether all the rats became addicted to the opioid, or whether there were additional factors that defined whether a rat would become addicted.

The general findings were that if a rat was in a small cage, lonely and without rat company it'd often become addicted. If a rat was in a bigger cage, with rat friends they were less likely to become addicted.

Of course it's not conclusive - but you can easily apply the logic to alcoholics; most of us drink from time to time, only a few of us are alcoholics. I have observed that often the difference between a social drinker and an alcoholic is trying the fill a void or sadness in themselves.

The day-to-day risk with heroin isn't addiction per se (which tends to lead to a slow death from self-neglect), it's accidental overdose. If I had a family member who used heroin from 'time to time', that's where I'd focus my conversation. The risk is enormous and unmitigable.

My father didn't die from heroin, he died from addiction - the same addiction that ravaged his liver and caused pancreatitis, diabetes and cancer.

Thanks ThinkPink That's incredibly moving, so sorry for your loss. That's what I'm worried about is accidental overdose.

That's where I would focus - people who take hard drugs are often very defensive about whether they are addicted, which shuts them down and causes them to reject any input/discussion into their use of the drug.

However no one can deny that accidental overdose is a real and valid risk - and if he's not addicted (which he may well not be) then he needs to understand that there is risk in continuing, and no risk in stopping.

The ONS has some useful stats: www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsrelatedtodrugpoisoninginenglandandwales/2015-09-03#heroin-and-morphine

Click item 7 in the index for Heroin stats. xx

I'm not minimising anything here at all but...

I've known a long term recreational heroin user, a government employee, a published poet and volunteer worker, he was absolutely fine. Still is, although he's given it up now. Ever heard of Will Self? He's a knob, but has well known heroin useage. Pink, Lou Reed, Angelina Jolie, Russell Brand, stacks of people have used and carried on. I've tried it myself, didn't like it. Ever had surgery? You had it's NHS cousin - did your brain get rewired and you got got instantly addicted? Of course not.

Heroin is not a death sentence.

Addiction, of whatever substance, is a process which is commonly associated with a lack of something in the users life. 'Chasing the Scream' explains this very well and is VERY worth reading.

I sincerely hope that those struggling with addiction can find a way out, replacing the substance with love and happiness.

This link is also worth reading, about a famous clinic near Liverpool, where they gave away heroin, crime dropped, deaths dropped, users got bored of floating around in fluffy clouds all the time and went and got jobs.

www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/misc/60minliv.htm

Then the free heroin policy was stopped, deaths went up, crime went up, peoples lives were destroyed.

Ever had surgery? You had it's NHS cousin - did your brain get rewired and you got got instantly addicted?

Yes (well actually the last weeks of preg, got an injection every 3rd day due to circumstances); and Yes. I was close and still remember just how bloody lovely it was. Fortunately I got a tough lecture from a close friend.

I sincerely hope that those struggling with addiction can find a way out, replacing the substance with love and happiness.

Oh god, you want addicts to find a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow? Your hopes here are pointless and so unrealistic it's cruel. It's not going to happen to the vast majority of people. Apart from anything else, some wounds run too deep.

Yes, providing free heroin can help some people's life expectancy. But you know ... driving on heroin is a bad idea. Looking after children when you're high is a bad idea. Operating machinery on heroin is a bad idea. Or do you think every addict will be courteous enough to consider the impact of their actions on others?

Get a grip.

Eekaman, all those people that you mentioned had/have MONEY so fewer supply problems, no hanging about for hours on the street etc.

It is not drugs that kill, it the war on drugs.

Which leads onto your next point, which I agree with. Heroin should just be available along with better drug education.

Hoping that addicts replace the heroin with 'love and happiness' sounds hopelesssly naive though.

It is not drugs that kill

And to hell with the people who are damaged by the high people around them?

The babies born brain damaged and addicted?

Oh that's alright then as long as the user themself is okay.

" The babies born brain damaged and addicted? "

not nearly as many as FAS babies though are they?