Worried about my DD - calling parents of girls aged 10 or over!

[MummyPenguin]

My DD will be 11 at the end of next month. I've been worried about her for a while now, as she seems to suffer from periods of depression. These have recently become worse and more frequent. Last year she had some upsetting friendship issues at school, which are now sorted, and she has a new group of friends and is happy in their company. In the last few months, we've had quite a rough time as a family, my Aunt, who my DC were very fond of, passed away in November. A few days after that, my DD was staying at my Mum's one night, and my Mum had a stroke in the night, which my DD slept through. Mum managed to call for help, and my DD awoke to two paramedics in the house and something wrong with her Nan. Obviously a frightening experience for her. However, her bouts of depression and mood swings have been occuring for a long time before the recent troubles. I haven't taken her to the doctors, as it's very changeable. She can be happy and laughing and playing in the morning, and low and tearful by the afternoon. It really is mood swings, but as I said, they're getting more frequent, more severe. I've asked her all the usual questions, problems at school? Home? Something she's not telling me? But she answers, that it's nothing like that, she doesn't know why she feels so low. She recently went through a horrible episode where she kept feeling that she wanted to hurt herself and was very worried that she would do so. It was very distressing for her, and me, to see her like that. This seems to have passed at the moment. I know she's at the age where her hormones have started to kick in, I've wondered if it might be a hormone imbalance. She's very at the moment, and I don't know if it's just 'normal' stuff or something more.

She has two brothers who at times drive her to distraction, but nothing out of the ordinary sibling relationship. They do play well together and are all very close too. Her Dad and I are together, she has pets, a nice home, no obvious reasons to be so Anyone else experienced similar with their girls? Did it pass or did you have to seek help?

long post

I haven't had any experience of this... but it sounds like you need to find some help for your dd. Hopefully it is something that will pass... but for now you need to see your GP and get what referrals you can.

I don't have much experience of this either but I just wanted to say that however low your daughter is feeling at the moment, she is at least lucky to have such a caring and thoughtful mum. I would hold off seeking professional help just now - this could make her feel that there's something wrong with her, whereas her low moods sound like a completely understandable reaction to what she's been through recently.

The self-harm issue is more worrying, but at least she's talking to you about it: in my experience, people who go on to self harm tend to be very private about it. I would keep an eye on her for now and if you notice anything else untoward maybe approach your GP then.

I have a just 11 year old - and she has times when she feels "down' She calls it being "jangly" but they never last long and she usually comes out of the phase in an hour or so. I find that she needs to be on her own for a bit sometimes - she goes off to her room with a book and some music and that helps to balance her. I don't let her stay alone for too long - after half an hour or so, I always knock on her door with a drink or something. But her moods are never very bad and never last long - your dd's sound more serious. She has been through a lot, hasn't she, it's bound to take its toll on her. Has she talked to you about how she felt about her aunt and her nan? Could she be feeling guilty about not waking up when her nan was taken ill? I think the bit I would worry about if I were you would be the feelings about hurting herself. Had you thought about chatting to your GP(without mentioning it to yout dd) about it if you think he/she would be helpful? I'm sorry not to be more helpful, I hope someone with more knowledge of where you can get advice about this sort of thing will be along soon.

Thanks lazyemma, your post has touched me and made me feel a bit better. I think I will see how things go, it is still early days after our upsetting family stuff, I might go and have a chat to her teacher, who is lovely, and see what she thinks, after all, she spends almost as much time with her as I do!

I've just re-read your post and I see that her depression and mood swings pre-date the traumatic things she's been through recently. Hm. I still don't know if I would go to your GP just yet though. I was quite a pensive child, given to bouts of what I would now identify as low-level depression, but I think talking to a child psychologist or psychiatrist would have risked making me feel that things were much more serious than they were, and that I couldn't cope with my feelings without medical/professional intervention.

My dd1 is 11;5.

I'd say intermittent grumpiness is normal, accompanied by the usual manifestations of eye-rolling, hufffing, door-slamming and a propensity to burst into tears at the slightest provocation.

What you describe sounds like more than that. Particularly bearing in mind your dd's upsetting experiences, I would probably be inclined to approach a friendly GP for a referral to screen out any more serious issues. But make sure you get a good referral -- sounds like she needs careful handling, and although there are fantastic people working in mental health there are also some less fantastic ones. But a reliable recommendation from a professional I trusted would probably be my first port of call. Feeling you want to hurt yourself is more than just normal pre-teen blues, and imo needs to be taken seriously to make sure it doesn't escalate.

sorry MP - cross posted! glad I helped a little bit.

I had depression at that age but did not seek medical help until I was 16 as my parents could not know. I would get help for your daughter now to avoid further probs in the future. It may well be nothing and could just be hormones or a phase but imho its better to deal with this sooner rather than later especially if she has been thinking of harming herself. If I can be of any assistance to you in any way or if you just need a shoulder then I am here for you. this will not be an easy thing for either of you to deal with.

Thanks too, katelyle. She still has episodes of tears about my Aunt who was a hilarious wonderul character whom all children adored. You may have touched on something about DD feeling guilty about the episode with her Nan. I'm glad she talked to me about the self harm thing. She has always been a girl who's not great at opening up and talking about her feelings. Yes, I agree that her 'down' times may be more severe than perhaps they should be, so I will observe for a while. Perhaps talking to our GP, who also is lovely, and very understanding, without DD present at first, might be a good idea.

You guys! I'm nearly in tears now!

I cant comment on her wanting to hurt herself as my DD never spoke of anything like that. DD started her periods at the age of 10.1 and I have to say that probably for the year beforehand she changed from a sweet loving girl into someting I can only describe as a stroppy teen with attitude. She also would go from sweetness and light into this other unrecognisable character at the drop of a hat. It was a really hard time and it continued for a year or more. I was often in tears and couldn't understand what has happened to this beautiful girl of mine. So loved and so priviledged it just seemed so unfair, I really felt I had "lost" her. . she is now 11.7 and I have my DD back. She has gone through that awful phase and god I hope it never returns. It was all nothing more than hormonal (luckily). I hope this helps. Girls undergo enormous hormonal changes even before periods announce themselves and they get moody and low and feel unhappy. When you ask whats wrong they just don't have the answers. They don't know whats wrong, infact it is just their changing hormones. I was advised during this awful period I was having with DD that she would "come through the other side" and be fine again. At the time I could not see it ever changing but trust me, it does. Good luck, daughters can be hard work but when they are happy they are amazing.

I understand that you are worried and upset but please stop for a second and give yourself credit for the fact that you have noticed that there is something maybe not quite right in your daughters world, that she feels able to talk to you about it, and that you are prepared to do something to help her. That to me signals that you are an amazing mum and your daughter is very lucky to have you.

MoreteaVicar, I can really empathise with your post, particularly the 'drop of a hat' changes in behaviour, and feeling that you've 'lost' her. That's exactly how I've been feeling. Meant to say, DD hasn't started her periods yet, when I mentioned things to my Mum, she said that girls can often go through what DD is just before they start.

"I understand that you are worried and upset but please stop for a second and give yourself credit for the fact that you have noticed that there is something maybe not quite right in your daughters world, that she feels able to talk to you about it, and that you are prepared to do something to help her. "

Exactly - you've put it perfectly, bewilderbeest. Thinking back to my own childhood, there's no way I would/could have confided in my mum about how unhappy I was in the same way that your daughter has confided in you. She obviously trusts you very much, and feels very safe and loved.

I do hope so, lazyemma. She's my firstborn, my only Daughter, and my princess. As much as I love my two boys, I think an only Daughter is always going to be special. That's a shame that you couldn't confide in your Mum, sometimes Mum and Daughter relationships can be so tricky. I've had problems with my Mum, but in adulthood.

oh - don't get me wrong, I love my mum, but she's always been a very pragmatic sort of person who can be a bit impatient about this sort of thing. I'm not sure I would have known how to talk to her about what I was going through, and I'm sure a lot of children having similar difficulties would feel the same - often through no fault of their parents.

I think it's a difficult time for all children generally, going through the whole puberty/adolescent thing. One of the things I've read is that this is also a time that they begin to understand the realities/emotional side of life, i.e. about death, vulnerabilities, etc. And given that there has been a real death, of someone very close, then it's perhaps not surprising that she's suffering from such mood swings - it's a really difficult thing to take on board as an adult.

It sounds like you have a fantastic relationship with her, which can only help.

I think talking to her teacher is a really good idea - if for no other reason than to alert her to a potential problem, but would also suggest that you go and talk to your GP (without your daughter) to see what their advice might be.

Hope all goes well!

Yeah, definately sold on the going to the GP without her first, idea, I hadn't thought of that, so thanks to whoever first suggested it. Will also speak to her teacher. Am also going to have a 'girly' day on Saturday - cinema, pizza, claire's accessories, just to give her a bit of 1 to 1 and a general spoiling.

Just wanted to update this. I took DD to the GP in the end. I didn't go without her first, we just went along together. This was a couple of weeks ago. At first she was very reluctant, and said she wasn't going to talk to him, but when we were in the consulting room, she did open up a bit, and broke down too, which was sad, but good in a way, as at least the GP could see her like that. He asked her lots of relevant questions such as does she have trouble sleeping? (sometimes, yes.) Does she feel panicky? (yes) does she feel 'removed' from what's going on around her? (yes.) So on the basis of that, the GP has referred her to a counsellor. We've yet to receive the appointment, and I am going to chase it up. I went into school, let her Teacher know what's going on, the Teacher was concerned, particularly about the self harm thoughts. She suggested that whilst we wait for the appointment with the counsellor, that DD have some sessions with the SENCO who does, in fact have a counselling certificate with children. The plan was that the SENCO take DD to the room that is used for SN, and they look at some books together, and talk about 'feelings.' It would give DD an opportunity to air things etc. DD had one session last week, but wasn't happy about it, she doesn't feel comfortable talking about these issues with the SENCO which, in a way I can understand, as the SENCO does have a bit of a hard way about her, and DD doesn't know her that well. DD has told her teacher that she doesn't want to have any more of these sessions, and that seems to be okay.

Lately she'd seemed a bit better at home, and I was wondering if perhaps she's come out of it, but the last few days she's been quite bad again. She said to me last night, that she still feels bad and low inside, but can't stop smiling and laughing, and this leads people to believe that she's okay. She's very up and down all the time. It sounds to me a bit like manic depression. This morning she had complete meltdown over her hair. She likes to leave it down, which is okay when it's first washed, but she has hair like mine which is prone to frizz and getting untidy. I insisted that she have it tied back, as I don't want her going around at school looking like a scruff. She sobbed and sobbed and got herself into a real state over it, but it wasn't just a diva strop thing, she kept saying over and over that she just can't stop her hands from going to her head and fiddling with her hair, and she kept saying "I can't help it" and "I can't control it" and things like that, and it just wasn't right, you know?

The whole thing is really bringing me down now, and I feel quite depressed myself. I've been so supportive to her and understanding and treated her with kid gloves, but I can feel that wearing a bit thin now, as her constant whining and crying and meltdowns are really beginning to grate.

Sorry for long post. Just wanted to get it off my chest. Any thoughts?

Oh honey.... just as it started to sound so positive. Is there any way you can chase up the appointment with the counsellor? I wish I knew what to say to bring you comfort.

no advice but big hugs x x x

Thanks you two. Marslady, yes, I will phone the Doctors in a minute actually, to see what's happening about the referral. Who knows, the Doctor could still have a note about it on his desk...

Mummypenguin
I have a DD who is 11 and has just finished seeing a child psychiatrist for symptoms of depresssion.
Like your DD mine was fine one minute and telling me how down she was the next.
I did not take my DD seriously at first as I thought she has a nice home etc what does she have to be depressed about however I asked her to write down how she felt and I was at just how bad she felt.
Anyway our GP did take it seriously and the sessions have really helped my DD sort out her feelings.
I was not allowed to sit in on the sessions which allowed my DD to talk more openly and my DD appeared to enjoy having one to one time to fully discuss her feelings.
She has been given coping strategies to use in order to banish negative thoughts and so far she has been a lot better.
As hard as it was I had to accept that I could not solve this one for my DD and that she needed professional help and I am glad that I did.
Keep pestering your GP if you feel that an appointment is not coming through quick enough and paricularly if her symptoms worsen.

Ishouldbeironing, thanks, that's really helpful. Good also to know that we're not on our own, sometimes I feel like she must be the only nearly 11 year old girl who's like this. Phoned the Doc's just before, the lady I spoke to said that a letter has gone off, and that if I've not heard anything by middle of next week, they will give me a number to chase up the clinic myself.

Getting her to write it down is a good idea too, I hadn't thought of that myself, but I think the SENCO at school did this. I will do that with her myself. Should be insightful, as she's not the type of girl who expresses her feelings easily.

Hope you get an appointment soon.
My DD was a bit reluctant at first to write anything down but I said that it would enable the GP to help work out how best to treat her.
I also told her that I would not read it unless she gave me her permission - but luckily she did - as it gave her control over the situation.
Hope this helps.