FWB with someone you have feelings for

[MzLouissa]

I started a FWB situation with a guy I didn't think I liked...I thought he was cute but no interest.

As soon as we started we liked each other more than expected and started to grow feelings.

I reacted by hoping things would come to more. He reacted by going cold and creating distance because he didn't want to fall in love.

I ended it three months ago because it felt ridiculous.

He's wanting to try again. Can't seem to keep away from each other. Really strong sexual attraction and he swears he learned from his mistakes last time and will be more open if / when he feels scares of how close we're getting.

I know the obvious answer is to stay clear. I just feel very mixed up. I think we've got serious potential but his commitment fears are really severe and I think I might just end up hurt?

Am I mad to start things up again?

Yes, you're both right.

Where I am in all of this is in the unfortunate poition of rellay liking him and wanting to be with him, but had thus avoided seeing him for many weeks now because I know we will just end up in bed and I know the oxytoxin thing will bond me to him.

I do want to help him. But have to admit that's not uncommon for me, I feel the same way about friends and i'm not entirely sure (despite the psycho babble) that that's a bad thing about me.

I'm just confused really because I've nevr been involved with anyone in this sort of situation before. Usually you just date and see what happens.

He is FAR too complicated for my liking. He will dick you around, no end.

You do know, that there are 32 Million Men in the UK? (Assuming that's where you are)

Surely you could find a guy, that doesn't come with all this angst ?

Cor ColdWhite such an easy thing to say.

I have been on dates, plenty, and sat there bored, sad and diconnected and it's not like a light switch that you are fully in control of how you feel about one person to the next. I have done the best i could to walk away from it all by physically walking away from it all.

My mind works in two halves on it.

One being more practical. Look for someone who's not got baggage or problems and someone who wants the same thing as you, and just be alone until you find someone you like just as much.

The other half saying that sometimes people have baggage and issues and working through it is worth it.

I have plenty of friends (myself included) who lived with or committed to or even married perfectly perfect people on paper who turned out to make them miserable or cheat or get divorced.

I also know a few who met people who were a total mess, worked through it and became very happy.

My closest friend had absolutely massive commitment issues. the first year of her relationship with her now DH, she cheated on him, ignored him, dumped him abotu 100 times, would throw things, scream and be completely unreasonable and awful and the fact was I knew perfectly well that she REALLY liked him and wnated to test him to see if he'd stick around.

He did and 8 years later I don't think I know anyone more happily married.

So life isn't always quite as simple as it looks on paper, and sometimes people might have "angst" but might still feel worth bothering with.

I'm actually not worried about the angst part. I'm tough, I'm well balanced, I am very loving and compassionate but what actually worries me isn;t all of that - which I think I would get through and consider worth it for the end result - but more that he might well not ever feel about me what I feel for him.

Even with all his intimacy problems which he feels he might need counselling for, he still knows he's got more power than you in this situation. He's still managing your expectations and only offering FEB when he knows you want more. I don't think it's a good basis on which to start a relationship.

FWB not FEB!

Yeah, I agree with that 100% venus.
He does know I want more and that's a horrible place to start.

Focus on your needs, not his. It isn't your responsibility to fix him. I would be inclined to cut the B out of FWB for now and see if you are really good friends without it.

Also I just wanted to go back to what you said about your friend. It's true that at the end of the day her relationship worked out and she and her husband have been happily married for 8 years. But it sounds like she behaved incredibly badly to him at the beginning, and you surely wouldn't say to someone whose partner was treating them like that that they should stick it out on the off chance that the partner was "testing" them, when it's probably much more likely that the partner is selfish and emotionally abusive and that they are only going to get hurt?

This is only my opinion of course but...

If you have to suggest counselling to someone so that they can try to be in 'a relationship' with you…. please, please, please don't do it. Don't even get into any more of these sorts of heart to hearts with him.

This power change in FWB is classic. As is the 'I'm not ready for a relationship right now' leaving out the words 'with you.'

Nothing should be this hard work this early on.

This has heartache for you written all over it.

All very good thoughts, and I am leaning towards just not seeing him again.

It'd be nice to think Id be the expection but more than likely not.

You will never know. I don't think it's worth the risk. I would comfort yourself that there is every likelihood you have saved yourself a lot of future heartache. If it helps, I'll tell you that the on/off FWB scenario I referred to in my own life (where I, at 16, once had "all the power") dragged on for over 16 years before I finally saw the light and ended it. It's a waste of your life.

And I thought our "relationship" was complex, and defied explanation, and he was my soul mate, and no one else understood as well. They did, they just saw it rather differently to me.

I know it's not how it's mean to be Venus. I did walk away after only a few months and haven't caved yet so there's at least a little sense in me. It's just that I want him. Really annoying but I do. Maybe with no contact or something that feeing will go away. It's so shit to yearn for someone like that.

The thing is, the whole time that you are letting him dominate your thoughts, you are shut down to finding anyone else. I assume you are not dating.

Your friend who did terrible things to "test" her man, sounds like a bit of a nut. And he got walked all over, so he sounds submissive. I suspect that they now appear happy, because he does exactly what he's told, at all times.

I know it's hard to walk away if you like someone.

But what are his redeeming qualities?

In any case, he's made it clear that he's not ready for a normal relationship.

I think he is manipulating you, so that he gets lots of sex, without making any commitment to you. Win win for him. Lose Lose for you.

Don't you deserve a lovely man, who has his head sorted? This guy sounds narcissistic and he will always put himself first, and you last.

Don't do it.

To be honest you do sound relatively assertive and well adjusted, and my concern is that if you don't centre your own feelings and focus on what you want out of it you will lose yourself and your focus will shift further towards pleasing him and his sexual and emotional needs. It's not a healthy position to put yourself in, when you want caring, love and commitment.

It is shit, I agree. I think NC could well be the best thing with the feelings you have, especially if he is hoping to change your mind. I do sympathise.

I think this:

I genuinely didn't know at that point that his "I don't want a relationship right now" statement was actually so deeply rooted. I had absolutely no idea what a genuine fear of intimacy was so I reacted about as badly as you could imagine when he started pulling back by basically repeatedly telling him it wasn't good enough and to fuck off. So I made it worse instead of better because I didn't understand

is what scares me for you.

As you say, there's at least a little sense in you… I personally read your posts and think that's much more than a little sense in you - you clearly are intelligent and empathetic… and yet it seems that you are sitting there thinking about what you did wrong and what you could have done better to make him feel and behave differently.

With no contact it WILL go away. And I'm not at all saying stop this thread now as you're still thinking through the process… but as I've said on other threads, at some point you also have to stop talking about him. Full stop. Spend time with your friends and family so you have to keep talking (you can't just sit there in silence) but ban yourself from talking about him so you have to think about other things. It really does help speed up the process.

You're investing a lot in very little.
He wants regular shags. He's prepared to talk the talk to get them.
You want to get married. ('I'm ok with no marriage on the table' - oh, no you're not. You're the woman who had 'all the power' and embarked on no-commitment fucking then wanted a boyfriend. Excuse me, I'm overstepping the mark, but it looks that way from here).
Sack him. Now. Forever. Next time you meet someone, hold out for what you really want.

I don't think it should be labelled as FWB.

SYUSBCA would be more accurate. "Shag You Until Someone Better Comes Along"

And someone else WILL come along. At which point he will cut all ties with you. You'll be deleted and blocked.

And you will find out via Facebook/friends, that he's gotten engaged and all of a sudden he isn't a complicated individual at all. And you will be heartbroken.

And in my book, that's not how Friends treat each other.

FwB, fuck buddies...lalalalalala

What nonsense really. And why is it that having sex is no longer considered intimate, but having dinner, holding hands and planning a date for next week, or a hypothetical conversation about the future is more so!

I can have dinner, hold hands, plan for next week and go to the cinema with my best friend, my ex, my father or even my next door neighbour, but I don't have sex with them. I have 'relationships' with these people. They are clearly defined as ex, father, best friend and neighbour.

So, why is it that now we have this "male brained" inspired geography of relationships where dating is intimate but sex is little more than a handshake?

I would go back to him, tell him to shove his FwB, his mealy mouthed excuses, his issues and his manipulations. I would spell it out that if he wants me and insists upon defining what we have, he can define it as a relationship, learn to overcome his issues, and keep the agenda open. He needs to change his mind set to one of: open to possibilities but cautious. That is rational, what he is now is either neurotic or just a waste of space.

I don't necessarily agree ColdWhite. I think there are people who genuinely are emotionally unavailable, generally. They don't have relationships with anyone - they constantly seek FWB type arrangements to fill the void they have. But the point is that nobody can fix them - they were broken before you came along - it is not simply that they need to wait for the right person and then everything will be ok.

My ex H was emotionally unavailable when I met him - didn't have girlfriends, struggled to have feelings. I decided to try and fix him (I was only 19 when I met him). After 6 difficult months he did seem to be able to cope with being in a relationship. We ended up getting married. But really, he was still emotionally unavailable because he refused to talk about feelings etc and would have various avoidance techniques that meant he wasn't really there for me emotionally.

Yes but this man doesn't struggle to have feelings… he seems to have shitloads of them that the OP has spent a lot of time talking and thinking about.

I don't think it's necessarily true that this is a "male brained" thing as there are certainly women out there who really are happy with the FWB thing… but the OP's posts are so painfully familiar (both personally and close friends), especially this:

I knew he liked me for a fair while, and to be honest I felt I had "all the power" if that's a horrible way of putting it so I went into it feeling like the FWB was more to protect his feelings that mine. Then very early on (about 5 nights together) I started to realise I actually really bloody liked him

I just don't feel (going from what she's said on this thread alone of course) that she's one of them… power switch after 5 nights together with a sensitive man with all these scary feelings… it's classic.

I genuinely do agree with most of what you're all saying. Totally my viewpoint also and a messy situation where people do confuse intimacy in the wrong situation but I think for him he wants the faux intimacy with none of the vulnerability.

I agree I probably might get dumped, but don't think it would be for someone better or good enough. But more for someone new, because I think if things got to close he'd run. Then do the same to her next. Such is the nature of his issues - which are as boden says a very real thing. He is just, if not more miserable than I am about this and he is trying to be honest even if it might not be what I want to hear.

I think boden that's anothr worry of fear of mine. That he might always be damaged like this. He's just such a sad person, it's horrible.

I know you're all picturing him as a bad and selfish person (and he probably is selfish because he lacks the ability to be vulnerable) but someone asked about his redeeming qualities.

Well for a start he's honest, even when lying would be more likely to get him what he wants. And he doesn't ever put other people down or say thing to make himself look bigger or better. He really hates seeing other people get hurt, it actually upsets him equally so he's empathetic and when I have been upset while he's not been able to "give me what I want" (or chosen not to) he has absolutely sat there for as long as it takes to talk it over and try his hardest to make me feel better. And he's very affectionate, and when he's like that he is his most vulnerable and rather lovely. And he's quite innocent of the ways of the world because he's never really had many relationships. And he's committed to work and being careful with things and is a very supportive friend. And that even though he set out to have a casual relationship he was actually as shit at it as I was. An he's very nice to children, he tlks to them like he is one of them and they feel very safe around him and has a gentleness about him that he also shows to me. He kisses in his sleep and is always so excited to see me and he brings out this tenderness in me that most people don't. And he gets drunk and dances the worst Dad dancing you've ever seen, and he is inquisitive and he always stands with me when I am cooking and talks about anything and everything and you could talk to him for hours. And he worries a lot about doing the right thing and is in a lot of visible conflict over this situation and he makes me laugh like probably no one else.

So he does have redeeeming qualities, but he's not wanting to be a boyfriend to anyone right now.

So I do know he has to be told to go away and come back when he's willing to at least try instead of setting no expectation from the outset.

you're right Laurierf. I am not the type to be okay with FWB. I'd struggle to muster the interest to want to continue sleeping with someone unless I felt something...but he'd the first person in two years I have wanted to be with so I am quite fussy and don't just attach to anyone who walks past

Louisa - has he had relationships before than lasted more than a year? And also how old is he?

You seem to have made your mind up so why come on here?