How do men justify ... just rambling ... Questions

[janaus]

As I said to my DH, how do you justify yourself, having a fling / affair?
How could you look me in the eye and deny it for weeks?
How can you minimise it? (It meant nothing)
How could you carry on your day to day life like nothing is happening?
How can you look at your children knowing what you are doing to their mother?
These are now your memories, will stay with you rest of your life
Yes, I am trying to reconcile, basically quite happy, but these thoughts are haunting me all the time.

Don't underestimate the power of denial. Cheaters are experts in denial. 'it's not flirting, I'm just being friendly', 'my kids don't know so it doesn't affect them.', 'it's my partner's fault, if only they didn't nag me so much' etc, etc. It's bull shit. They cheat because they're selfish, want an ego boost and are too cowardly to deal with a troubled relationship head on. Flowers for you my lovely. X

It was just a shag - i shagged women before getting together with you, why does my shagging make a difference now we are together?

If not clear, posting as cheating husband, not myself

Yes, Carol, I get it, lol Thanks again for support and hand holding

So, I organised a 'romantic picnic' last weekend, my effort at reconciling.

Now, he is showing a photo of it around to all his mates, saying how wonderful I am. Grrrr

I don't think "how do men" justify is the right question. It applies to women as much.

I've had an affair and to answer your question put simply - it's because the person having an affair isn't thinking.

They don't need to "justify" anything because they are caught up in an illusory cloud of massive lust, sexual excitement, emotional excitement, feeling like a teenager again.

They aren't thinking further than the end of their nose cock/vagina.

Lust and sexual infatuation is heady stuff. It's like a drug. You might as well ask a drunk person why they chose to drive while drunk. It's because they were drunk and not rational.

Same is true for a lot of people having affairs. Not all I grant you -plenty of married men who'll just f*ck anything. But for "decent" people with a family - there is no justification involved - as I said, ask a drunk person why.

It's the irrationality of lust. They turn a blind self-deluded eye to their relationship and day to day life - just to get another fix of the lust drug. It wears off though.

Wow, thank you for such a truthful answer. He did tell me it was like an addiction. "Lucky" or not, for me OW broke it off and never wanted to see him again.

Their relationship doesn't mean anything to them beyond the comfort and security of routine.

I remember your last thread Janaus.

It really is him who should be putting in the effort...not you!

Showing pictures to his mates is,so disrespectful of you, and shows tremendous insensitivity given the backstory behind the photos.

Have you challenged him on it? If so then what was his response?

Why were YOU organising romantic things?

He was boasting to his friends about your doing this after he had an affair?!

He didn't end it, OW did. He is minimising and putting it down to "an addiction" (bollocks) and not taking responsibility.

Why are you with him now?

Also, you're doing that thing people with shit partners do of saying "men" do X, Y and Z, which seems a type of denial. Your H is the dick here, not men in general. Decent partners don't do any of it. there are plenty of men who are decent partners: doesn't sound like yours is though.

You're doing the Pick Me Dance and hysterical bonding. You need to stop making all the effort.

Go sit down with chumplady.com for a while.

Why the fuck are you organising romantic picnics?
What is HE doing?

Jesus, he would have got a picnic in his face from me, stop doing anything, it's all down to him to make up to you, otherwise you might find yourself back here again, just stop.

Hmm.
Was he showing his mates the photo and saying "My wife is so lovely, she organised this last week, isn't it sweet?"
Or was it more like "LOL I shagged someone else and she still made me a picnic"?

I seem to remember from your last thread he was blame shifting quite a lot. Is that still happening?

To those who say they cheated because they are blinded by lust/romance/whatever.

They cheated because of poor boundaries - in Not Just Friends, there's a very good explanation about doors/windows and the slippery slope that can lead to affairs and that these often start long before it becomes physical - the sharing of personal information, the flirting, the mirroring, exchanges of confidences etc. All of these steps require a decision making process on the part of the cheater.

Recovering from an affair means having to re-establish boundaries and examine personality traits, flaws and beliefs that led the cheater to make the decision to have an affair. For someone who is selfish, entitled and arrogant, its very easy for them to justify their cheating and not bother making real and lasting changes to themselves and repair the damage caused by their behaviour.

"It meant nothing"....why would anyone think this is a good excuse? I think him shagging OW would be more palatable, if he had feelings for her. But, what he's actually saying, is "I can fuck any woman, with no feelings at all about her, or what impact it would have on you". That = "I will do so again, if I feel like it. Any woman with a vagina is fair game". That's fucking scary shit right there! So, I would fully expect he'll be up for One Night Stands as well as full blown affairs. Any hole is a goal right? I'd chop off his bollocks off and serve them on a cocktail stick at the picnic. But seriously, do get rid, he sounds awful.

So where would he be now if the other woman didn't end it?
And you're making picnics for him!

Beach, I did love your reply. I have never heard the word Bollocks before. It's not used in Australia. I love it.

He did weekend away, I felt like doing something in return, meet half way.
Have to see what happens now. Not doing the pick me dance. They are welcome to him if that's the way he wants it. He says he made a mistake. I say he made a choice.
Sorry for generalising about Men. You are all keeping me grounded, and seeing the reality of things.

You owe him nothing, I'd sit back and do nothing if I was you then you will have a much clearer picture of his real intentions towards you. I think he's actually very lucky you are even giving him a chance. You organising nice times for him is making him think what he did is not as serious as it actually is.

Delude themselves that the woman was just a friend.
That it meant nothing blah blah

There are bits on ChumpLady about "fake naugahyde remorse". Find that, have a read and a laugh, then drill through to related articles.

Beach is right, as are you. If it really meant nothing, why did he choose to do it? He wants it both ways. Kinda like - oh, that's right - a cheater!

Yes mine convinced himself it was just friends for a long time, then came the fantasy, ego, addiction. His words not mine. Makes my blood boil.

I can't believe people would compare it to an addiction! What a shitty way to shirk responsibility for your actions. Op, people who have affairs are fully in control of their actions and fully aware of the impact it will have on their families. Don't let him delude you. My oh cheated and there was no way I wanted to try and make it work unless he fully admitted of his own accord that it had been a shitty thing to do and that he was a wanker for doing it.

There is no justifying an affair. Just admitting that what they did was wrong. I never asked him to cut contact, I wanted him to do that for himself before I moved back in eventually. We are fine now, very strong and better than before. I have complete faith that he would never do that again. If I didn't I couldn't be with him.

Reestablishing boundaries is essential too as pps have said. He views me in a different way and has more respect for me. He also interacts with others differently and sees things from different angles. We're both better people now and we love each other more than before. Good look. He has to take the initiative and he should be making the effort romantically. Imo you need to believe he would have ended it of his own accord to trust him again. and for you

Hi Janaus, I know exactly how you feel! How long ago did your DH have the affair and how did you discover it? It's 3 year's now since Iwas informed by OW of my DH's affair and like you I still feel very hurt that he could do that do us! Our DS would have been just 11 at the time.
We have had good times and bad since and I know he is trying his best to make it up to us, but is that really possible?
I feel reassured by what Fratelli has said and hope that you can overcome your fears but be assured you are not alone!

Anxious.. I found out through the phone bill. He is a complete dill at using technology. Suddenly there was 2 FaceTime on the same day. Curious, I looked back at that number.
Phone calls started last December but from about May to July, phone calls were full on, starting at 5.30 in the morning.

The phone contact to the number suddenly changed from 'Lyn' to "Wally".
She was a customer at our work, that he was making gates for.

I started thinking 8 months is a long time.
I found out on 3rd August, asked him many times if something g was going on, things didn't seem quite right. Looked me right in the eyes, and said you're the only one for me. Married 39 years. We are older couple. Me, late 50's, him mid 60's. 3 adult children, 6 lovely granchildren. How would they feel if they knew. Acting like a teenager.

Finally, I wrote a letter, poured everything out. How I was feeling. What I thought was going on. He finally admitted it towards the end of September. I spent 8 weeks in the spare bedroom. On anti depressants and anxiety medication. Lost 8 kg, which is a good thing. Barely eating or no interest in household things, shopping etc.
I have blocked 'Wally' on his phone, he will never know.

I hope things continue to work out for you.

He did plan a weekend away, well it was my birthday present in Oct. His birthday was recently, came and went, I could not bring myself to buy him a card or gift.