"I'm not bringing your Grand-Daughter to see you because you smoke in your house"

[harveybristol]

This is the response I've just given my mum. My daughter has never ever been to my mum's house to visit and she's almost 2!
My Mum moved 100 miles away to live with her partner whilst I was pregnant and his sickly father lives with them. We have never been to visit them because they all smoke in the house and I definitely don't want my Daughter in a smoke filled environment.

After almost 2 years, we are finally planning to visit for the first time at the weekend, but we are staying in a hotel close by. My mum has asked us to visit the house and assures me that "nobody will smoke around her whilst she's there" however they will have been smoking in the house prior to our visit.

I've told my mum we won't be going to the house regardless because the smoke and cigarette smell wont have gone completely. Am I over-reacting? How long does it take for a room to be 'smoke free' after people have been smoking in there? My Daughter has a cough and cold so I don't want to take any risks.

My mum's partner's father is a chain smoker and Mum tells me she's not comfortable in telling him not to smoke in the house before we arrive. When I replied that we wouldnt be visiting the house then, she turned very indifferent on the phone and said that she had to go. Am I being unreasonable?

Not emotional blackmail, Boney, just stating a fact.

Of course depending on circumstances, people try to change, confront or ignore other people's habits according to what effect it has on their life. We live among other people and the whole point of the post is to negotiate what others think is reasonable or not, something all of us navigate every day, so OP can work out what to do next. I made it perfectly clear that I think this is about way more than smoke and a lot to do with OP's relationship with her mother and the level of care she has shown over her as a daughter generally, of which this is a classic aggravating symptom.

The way people pile on smokers generally is, I believe a similar thing, a projection of something deeper. Anger, need for otherness and need to feel better than weaker types which is hiding behind judging smoking, (like many judge the obese) and things like calling people 'disgusting' and 'I would never go in someone's house that smoked'. (Really? Wow. What a principle. Hope they never need your help!)

If someone is smoking near you and you don't like it, it's perfectly appropriate to ask them not to, and I think it's rude and inappropriate to force people to inhale your smoke as a smoker by smoking around/close to them. But this generally doesn't happen nowadays unless you literally go into someone else's house who smokes, in which case, you have a choice not to go in there or negotiate with them whether they smoke, which is literally what we're talking about. I don't know how to respond to a sentence as general as yours. Sometimes we put up with others' habits, sometimes we don't.

Giles eh? What's that got to do with anything?

Being in a house where several smokers habitually smoke inside is extremely unpleasant and I would not want to spend any time in there at all. i would make arrangements to meet the people outside of their home.

Whether or not it's actually a danger to your DD is neither here nor there to me, it's just disgusting to be around that stink.

It's relevant because exposure to smoke can contribute to a child developing asthma. there's no way to know how much or how little exposure yiu cab get away with befire it coukd potentially cause a problem.

and it's not something you want your child to have to live with if exposure to contributing factors is avoidable.

*AsTimeGoesBy
"I think it is a huge shame that you are going to be jeopardising the relationship with grandparents over a bit of smoke."

Why is it the op that should about this surely it is the grandparents that are jeopardising the relationship over a bit of smoke*

They have offered to not smoke while the OP and family visit. What is the grandmother supposed to do beyond that, giving up herself might be one thing, but then she needs to ask an elderly person who is no relation to the granddaughter to give up for an unspecified but presumably quite long time before their visit, and maybe deep clean the house too. It's quite a big ask IMO with no guarantee that they will ever meet the OPs requirements over this.

DS2 has asthma, quite badly. He coughs and splutters if we're on a day out and someone walks past with a lit cigarette. In a house like that he'd be hacking for weeks. No chance. YANBU at all. Besides all the health-related risks there's the fact that there is nothing more revolting on earth than sniffing the top of a child's head and smelling stale cigarettes. It's dreadful.

AsTimeGoesBy

Or they could just meet up with just DGM outside the house and she could lay off the fags for the amount of time that they are there.

PunkrockerGirl

you say tomato etc.

Just to clarify a few things:
I'm happy to take my Daughter to the house provided it is infact 'smoke free' but as it's been clearly pointed out, the house is constantly filled with cigarette smoke from 3 habitual, regular smokers. It is extremely unlikely to be smoke free and the chances of the house being 'aired out' before we arrive is ridiculously slim as my mother does not deem passive, second hand, lingering smoke a health issue. I'm not in a position to force them to air the house out and neither is my mother as her FIL smokes away to his own leisure constantly and she feels very awkward (understandably so.)
We have been asked to have a meal at the house and I'm not happy for my DD to eat a meal prepared in a bath of cigarette smoke. Yuck. It's a shame to let my mum down but I just cant do it. Also forgot to mention that DD has inherited my allergies so there is an allergy issue potentially here too. Along with the fact that she is full of a cough and cold at the moment.
Mum gets to stay with us regularly so has a close relationship with DD. I notice that her bags, coats, clothes absolutely reek of stale smoke, it's awful and the thought of sitting in a house, marinating in that stench just turns my stomach, the health concerns are an additional concern. Hopefully we can make our visit a short one if we must go in the house, but I am really not looking forward to it.

harvey, considering your mother knows how you feel now, and you have the truthful addition of an ill daughter, is there a good reason that you can't pick them up at the house and just go to a local pub or cafe for a nice lunch?

A couple of hours in the house won't kill you or your daughter. You can have a shower afterwards.
Your mother is attempting to meet you half way.

When I was a kid we had neighbours who chainsmoked. Lovely friendly people but my god...

They gave us chocolate rabbits for Easter once. Obviously we said thank you very much and it was kind, but then they had to go straight in the bin because they tasted of stale smoke.

What happens if the OP does brace herself to eat at the house and her DD refuses the food?

i think youre using this as a power trip rather than seriously thinking that being in the same house as someone for an hour where they have previously smoked is going to do any damage to your PFB. I bet there are other issues going on here. Youre cross with her about something arent you? Moving away? Dont like her partner? Didnt get you a Mr Frosty for xmas?

YANBU.
They choose to smoke - which is OK.
But you are equally within your rights to choose to avoid that environment.
Do what you think is right for your DD.

Your baby's grandmother will not be around forever. Think about that.

Oh the irony! I expect she'd be around a lot longer if she stopped smoking

I was the grandchild in this scenario. My GF chain smoked. My DF hated this and was allergic. We'd go anyway and come back stinking.

We also got to watch him die slowly of emphysema, watch him housebound on a O2 hose, with stomach ulcers from the meds he was taking, slowly getting thinner and thinner and battling for every breath, hacking up mucus.
There was no relationship with him once he was ill, it was such a waste. He had so many stories from a very colourful life and we never got to hear them because he couldn't breathe enough to tell us.

YADNBU

My DM smokes...she has recently been in intensive care as her lungs are giving up after 60 years of smoking. We all hate going to visit her and my DF because the house stinks. We all race for the shower as soon as we get home because we all reek of smoke. My DS has asthma and struggles in the house as all the second hand smoke triggers him.

My DM was the only one smoking in the house but the smell was, and still is, dreadful. She, in theory, didn't smoke near the children when they were little but in practise she make a few token moves towards standing by an open door to smoke but that was it.

Its not only the actual smoke that's a problem its the smoke on her breath, clothes, furniture, food, everything.

There's an awful lot of 'psychologists' on this thread attempting to pick apart the 'real' issue with my DM.

Is it really not enough to not want my Daughter have to be a part of a polluted, smoke filled environment? You people clearly didn't grow up in smoke infested capsules for houses, otherwise you would realise that fears for my DD's wellbeing is enough!
Unfortunately, this is as nitty gritty as the problem gets, DM and I have a good relationship, DD and her DGM do too, her partner is lovely and so are the rest of the family judging by the interactions I've had with them.
Not wanting my Daughter inhaling cigarette smoke is the issue, that's it. Stop over-analysing!

Well I don't really get what you want from this thread. You insist it's all about your daughter's health, so you think you rally need to ask anyone else if YABU? If the situation in which your mother moved away and how far had nothing to do with your reasons, then why mention it? Now it doesn't really matter how old your daughter is or for how long she hasn't been to her GM's home, if your decision is that she won't see your mother in her home because she and her partner smoke.
Your OP does imply there is more than just health related issues. As a mother you have every right to do what you see necessary to keep her healthy and safe.

Really if there is no other reasoning other than health, I don't see the purpose of posting a thread about it.

Yanbu!!! X I'd do exactly the same x

Good god the way smokers are demonised these days. it's frightening

I disagree. It's absolutely vile, disgusting habit that is of no benefit to anyone and categorically detrimental to the health of smokers and passive smokers.

The point about obesity is a red herring. Someone who overeats in front of me isn't damaging me by doing it.

I'd use the words damaging, addictive, expensive and carcinogenic but you stick with vile and disgusting and everything that implies. As for 'no benefit' which is a term sodden with selfish expectation, I'd have to trust the mentally ill person who says that sadly they depend on cigarettes to help manage anxiety in the moment. But you carry on shaming people for what's already hurting them and angrily protecting yourself from what is no doubt an onslaught of smokers on your carefully fenced lawn.

YANBU OP. I'm surprised at the blase attitudes on this thread - even passive smoking carries documented risks, including increased risks of SIDs. Even if they don't smoke in the house while she's there, the smell of smoke will be everywhere in the walls and air. I don't think smokers understand how much it permeates everything and that opening a window for an hour or so does not fix it. It is a disgusting smell - even walking past a group of smokers outside my office means that my hair and clothes smell for the rest of the day. My mum used to smoke - she would send me cards and i could smell the smoke on them as soon as I took them out the envelope. Someone who smoked paid my husband in cash for something the other day and the smell on the money is still lingering in my handbag.

ok, harvey, since this is just about what it's about, you have some consensus here. Most people seem to think that it's not unreasonable for you to take your daughter wherever you want to take her, and not to take her somewhere you don't. I think most people also think that any health impact of being in a house where people normally smoke but aren't doing at the time of the visit is negligible, if not zero. I'm sure you knew that already.

FWIW I know what it's like to grow up in smoke filled capsules, you're right, it's not nice at all. I just don't think it's too much to imagine that those sorts of choices that were made for you growing up (and the allergies you now have, that your daughter shares) may play into how you feel about this. As they should, as you say. no one's saying your relationship with your mother isn't good, but you have valid reasons to be frustrated with her and your post is peppered with that. That's the sort of feedback you're going to get here if you're brave enough to pose a question and reveal yourself. Maybe the point is - what are you looking for? Are you looking for validation from us for refusing to go round? Support that you aren't being a snob? Advice as to what to do? (Which has been given and you haven't responded to, like take them out for lunch) or advice and compassion about how to get your mum to stand up for you and your daughter over the FIL issue?