MEN

[Bleakhouse1879]

I have been reading alot on here these past few days about many posters unfortunate experiences with their partners. I read stories of wives & girlfriends being raped or sexually assaulted by their partners, being beaten up, treated like dirt, robbed and belittled.

As a man, I am disgusted to hear that this sort of childish almost psychotic behaviour is so wide-spread with so many supposed 'men'. It has genuinely opened my mind to what is happening in my country. These sorts of behaviours were common place but still wrong during the 1950's. No person in Britain in 2015 should be subjected to this sort of disgusting behaviour.

No proper man would hit a woman or force himself on her or want her to feel anything less than tip-top, especially if his partner was the mother of his child. I don't think these people have the right to call themselves men and it doesn't do justice to the men out there who do want to treat their partner as a princess.

I hope any women who have been ill-treated in the past, don't tar all men with the same brush. We aren't all violent, misogynistic bullies. There are genuinely decent people out there and I hope the majority of my fellow men feel the same and it is just a case of a few bad apples

as soon as I read "bad apples" I just knew it would be picked at.

OP, I was raped and I certainly didn't find your post patronising.

YY Sylvanian the general shock if a woman chooses to leave her children. It's such an anomaly that you frequently see magazine articles about it. Men choose to leave all the frigging time but hey, it's cool as long as they pay their maintenance and have their kids every two weeks.

If I chose to leave my kids (their Dad left two years ago) but paid a weekly amount and saw them every three weeks (as he does) I'd be a terrible person with no maternal feelings. People wouldn't understand at all. My ex does it but he's a Good Dad.

Btw, OP, Dennis the Menace is a bad apple. Rapists and abusers are scumbags. Just so we're clear.

I had a similar experience OP. I stumbled across this site by accident. I have three brothers, I have always been active, outgoing, sporty and come from a traditional 1960-70's family. I alway's thought I was non sexist and equal minded and thought most men were like me.

Then I read some truly tragic, awful stories on here and I was shocked (beyond shocked). It has made me re-examine myself. I guess in truth I was equal minded on the "big gesture" things, but totally missed many of the very important, ingrained, blatant small things.
Now I guess I am a work in progress.

Bleakhouse,

If you are genuinely shocked by your perceptions of the abuse of women by men, then I will say that you are in for an even bigger shock if and when you begin to understand the scale of abuse committed by women toward men.

You say that "it was just nature to love and respect your mother and sisters", have you not read the copious threads posted by women about their abusive female family members?

I'm sure you're intentions are positive but maybe it's time to trade in your shining armour and send your horse to the knackers yard.

Is it called a 'lad' culture ...its everywhere, so common we barely notice .
There is a spectrum of abuse: from bad to very bad to very very bad .
The more posts I read on here the more I am made aware of the extent that women put up with the very very bad .
But in my daily life I see the milder abuse and attitudes all around, the debates I got myself into about that footballer were endless him being seen as the victim and the hero disgusted me . Women need educating though in my view as much as men.

YY both women and men buy into the victim blaming culture, but most of the illegal behaviour / violent behaviour / all the rest of it is committed by men. There's just a massive cultural effort to make excuses for the ones who do stuff.

One time something happened in a pub, it was my female friends who told me to stop making a fuss (I was really shocked and said OMG to them and that I was a bit upset! hardly over-dramatic). It is very true that women are as guilty of minimising and victim blaming as men, it's across our whole society.

I would say that women are equally, if not more, capable of 'ladding it'.

Ask the average bouncer, who is the most difficult/problematic gender to deal with.

Also when I was more seriously attacked I told 3 friends, 2 weren't interested and 1 just said "but he's a nice bloke everybody likes him" and that was that.

So I guess I learnt pretty young not to bother telling anyone about anything, and I think that a lot of girls have that experience really. It is very strong, around here when I was growing up anyway. Maybe things have changed (I hope so) but surveys and reactions to stuff in the papers says otherwise maybe.

I think it is hard for (particularly white middle class) men to understand what it feels like to be a woman. It is a good thing if you are listening to some women's experiences and resolving to examine your beliefs/behaviour. The really tough thing is the belief systems which promote discrimination and abuse are so ingrained in men and women that I really believe there is not a single person who has never played a part in the oppression of women. As mentioned by pp even if you are minded to not be part of the problem it is extremely difficult to not be. The really bad end of the scale is what is shocking you I think but i firmly believe every person is part of the 'smaller' things - laughing at a 'ye ma' joke, watching porn, not picking up dirty socks etc for men, not speaking up when we are offended, accepting or seeking a disproportionate burden in the home etc for women. We are all part of this culture. The best we can do is accept that fact, become more self aware and try our best not to ignore our responsibilities. I've certainly become more aware of the damaging beliefs about women I had internalised as time goes on and certainly been part of it - at one point was even a 'bring your man a beer after a hard day's work while you get on with the ironing' type...

I'm not giving you a cookie for posting but I was pleased to read the post as it is nice to feel men are recognising some of this stuff, whether or not we feel they should have done ages ago or not.

Of course you will always get some men (and women) who flatly refuse to believe the stats and the stories of women and girls and so forth.

This is the sort of attitude sadly that has led to serial rapists going unpunished for years, victims of child abuse not being listened to, all of that stuff. That goes for male victims of sexual abuse too, obviously.

You've got to wonder what the people who like to think that women and girls are liars get out of it. I always assume they have been doing some pretty dodgy stuff themselves and don't want to face up to it / their friends have / or they are simply people who commit sex crimes and don't want people reporting it / believing their victims.

Whirlpool,

Try telling men or women about a male being abused by a woman and the response you are describing will be twofold.

The subject of abuse ought not to be genderized.

That doesn't read right. In the case of women who disbelieve other women it's often the case that they have been victims of similar crimes and don't want to face up to that themselves. If you got sexually assaulted and you have internalised that it was your fault, you have to say that anyone else it happens to it's their own fault as well.

Doesn't make it any less toxic for all the victims out there obviously.

Or sometimes, maybe, rather than often.

Some people are just bastards, obviously.

Whirlpool,

I would say a lot of people are just too afraid of it happening to themselves.

Can anyone be bothered with this?

All women in the world need to stop worrying about the harm inflicted on women and girls through domestic violence / sexual violence, and instead concentrate all our time and energy to stop all of the global tide of violence of women and girls against men.

Righto, gotcha.

I think a lot of times it is genuinely that some people just don't believe what they have done is wrong. Look at the Welsh footballer reading his own website it is clear and obvious that he is guilty of you understand the law. He just is outraged because he can't believe that doing what he did could be wrong. I find that most shocking.

Tell you what, why don't you go and find some MEN to help you in your cause of stopping global female violence inflicted on men, and leave women alone to talk about violence against women and girls, because the men who run the world have never given a fuck and so if we stop then there is No-one left to care.

and that is where you have lost me,

that is an astoundingly ridiculous response.

Lost you? From what? We never had you. You came here to a thread about what a shit time women and girls have, to tell us no that's appalling, you need to be looking after men.

You have stated that the problem of violence inflicted on men by women is more serious and prevalent than the violence inflicted by men on women and girls. This is patent bollocks. So, like I say, we never "had" you to lose, and I can't be bothered to humour you.

Yes, I'm sure it seems astounding and ridiculous to you. The person bleating about female violence towards men on a thread about the scale of male violence to women...

You have misquoted me,

I have at no point stated that violence inflicted on men by women is more serious and prevalent.

and

"bleating", well thankfully I am not a sheep and as such do not follow the myth nor minimisation of gender based violence.

"If you are genuinely shocked by your perceptions of the abuse of women by men, then I will say that you are in for an even bigger shock if and when you begin to understand the scale of abuse committed by women toward men."

Said directly to the OP in a valient attempt to steer him away from his newfound concern for women and girls, and towards the much bigger issue of female on male violence.

I mean even the most basic MRA knows to complain on this sort of thread by stating that men are more likely to be the victims of violent crime than women. The perpetrators are of course other men.

(And those stats exclude crimes of a sexual nature, and recently there were other reasons that they start to look a bit dodgy).

But anyway. Why not visit an MRA site for some basic tips then come back and try again, eh?

just ignore the derailer

there is always one

if we get too exercised, more of them will come

there ya go, Bleak some more evidence of how some men think their voice should be heard above that of women's

just ignore the derailer

there is always one

if we get too exercised, more of them will come

there ya go, Bleak some more evidence of how some men think their voice should be heard above that of women's

oops, sorry for double post